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skafather84
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23 Feb 2011, 8:36 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
I say that we should expand into space while we still can.



DING DING DING DING DING!! !


Space exploration is a very important piece of the puzzle. Studying the runaway greenhouse effect on Venus is something that should be considered crucial to anyone who actually considers climate change and global warming.

There's also the opportunity that there could be more resources that we can utilize from somewhere else.


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23 Feb 2011, 8:37 pm

iamnotaparakeet wrote:
I say that we should expand into space while we still can.


I think so too. There is nothing but space out there. Every religious minority could have their own homeland. I could see the Zoroastrians or other ancient and mostly forgotten religions doing this


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23 Feb 2011, 8:39 pm

Quote:
Studying the runaway greenhouse effect on Venus is something that should be considered crucial to anyone who actually considers climate change and global warming.


Absolutely, though it has a lot to do with volcanic outgassing and it's location. There is also the matter of it's mysterious retrograde orbit. I have heard some speculate it is an extrasolar capture. Some even suggest it would be possible to terraform Venus into an Earth-like planet that would be even better then Mars in terms of gravity, though it's day is almost as long as its year so plant life would need to adapt or we would have to somehow figure out how to make it rotate more frequently on it's axis again

Que the people talking about the impracticality of settlement, out of ignorance of space technology advances or developments, any minute now


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skafather84
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23 Feb 2011, 9:18 pm

Vigilans wrote:
Quote:
Studying the runaway greenhouse effect on Venus is something that should be considered crucial to anyone who actually considers climate change and global warming.


Absolutely, though it has a lot to do with volcanic outgassing and it's location.



From what I've read, much of its temperature has more to do with its greenhouse gas problem due to a carbon dioxide atmosphere so thick you could be crushed by it before you hit surface level.


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23 Feb 2011, 9:32 pm

Yeah, the issue is where all of it comes from though. Also Venus' magnetic field isn't that strong and is created by different forces then the Earth. So it's atmosphere is getting nibbled away at by the solar wind but it is being replenished actively. One theory I tend to support has to do with it's location; it is close enough to the sun that much of it's water evaporated. Not a well known fact, but water is necessary for plate tectonics, providing a sort of lubrication if you will. Venus has almost no water, so it has no tectonics. Instead it's entire surface get replaced every ~1 billion years or so by massive super-vulcanism that builds up over hundreds of millions of years. This is why most of Venus' surface is so young. It could be that a few billion years ago it was much like Earth, but without water in the crust, it was doomed to fail. Maybe life even started there, and not Mars, and eventually arrived here.
There is a layer in Venus' atmosphere that is 1 bar pressure and would be survivable to Humans with just breathing apparatus. It is conceivable that our first livable outpost could be some sort of aerostat colony using the atmosphere to develop raw materials. The development of raw materials from the atmosphere could contribute to thinning it out over time and provide us with carbon resources without exploiting the Earth


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skafather84
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23 Feb 2011, 9:50 pm

Vigilans wrote:
Yeah, the issue is where all of it comes from though. Also Venus' magnetic field isn't that strong and is created by different forces then the Earth. So it's atmosphere is getting nibbled away at by the solar wind but it is being replenished actively. One theory I tend to support has to do with it's location; it is close enough to the sun that much of it's water evaporated. Not a well known fact, but water is necessary for plate tectonics, providing a sort of lubrication if you will. Venus has almost no water, so it has no tectonics. Instead it's entire surface get replaced every ~1 billion years or so by massive super-vulcanism that builds up over hundreds of millions of years. This is why most of Venus' surface is so young. It could be that a few billion years ago it was much like Earth, but without water in the crust, it was doomed to fail. Maybe life even started there, and not Mars, and eventually arrived here.
There is a layer in Venus' atmosphere that is 1 bar pressure and would be survivable to Humans with just breathing apparatus. It is conceivable that our first livable outpost could be some sort of aerostat colony using the atmosphere to develop raw materials. The development of raw materials from the atmosphere could contribute to thinning it out over time and provide us with carbon resources without exploiting the Earth


Like Cloud City on Bespin!


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23 Feb 2011, 9:50 pm

Yeah man! It's every classic Star Wars fan's dream come true


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23 Feb 2011, 10:08 pm

If not to settle population pressures though, the other planets we share the system with could ease the resource burden. Mercury, for instance, has almost equal gravity to Mars, despite being smaller, and has a decent magnetic field (1-2% of Earths) as well as abundant cometary water. Though not really a good target for permanent settlement, its immense gravity is probably because it's crust is abundant in iron and other heavy metals that we could certainly use. There would be no need for the EPA on Mercury for strip mining, just safety oversight


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skafather84
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23 Feb 2011, 10:34 pm

Vigilans wrote:
If not to settle population pressures though, the other planets we share the system with could ease the resource burden. Mercury, for instance, has almost equal gravity to Mars, despite being smaller, and has a decent magnetic field (1-2% of Earths) as well as abundant cometary water. Though not really a good target for permanent settlement, its immense gravity is probably because it's crust is abundant in iron and other heavy metals that we could certainly use. There would be no need for the EPA on Mercury for strip mining, just safety oversight


Except for the temperature problem. Do we have robots that could do work and survive 800F long enough to be productive?

One thing I'd love to see is a project to create solar arrays around the sun to transmit energy back to earth.


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23 Feb 2011, 10:38 pm

I read a work of science fiction where a colony on Mercury was described. Basically they built a huge rail around the entire planet, and the city (not particularly large) essentially moved with the terminator to prevent it being destroyed. Most of the work was done by teleoperation, naturally, on the current 'dark side'.

Quote:
One thing I'd love to see is a project to create solar arrays around the sun to transmit energy back to earth.


If I'm not mistaken, dedicated research is already being done to this effect


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23 Feb 2011, 10:45 pm

Fine, YOU GUYS go off into space while I stay on earth and have more leg room, good riddence.


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23 Feb 2011, 10:47 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:
Fine, YOU GUYS go off into space while I stay on earth and have more leg room, good riddence.


You sure? We have space beer and zero g sports. There's nothing but leg room out here, and everybody you meet is guaranteed to be a PhD


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skafather84
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23 Feb 2011, 10:53 pm

Vigilans wrote:
DarthMetaKnight wrote:
Fine, YOU GUYS go off into space while I stay on earth and have more leg room, good riddence.


You sure? We have space beer and zero g sports. There's nothing but leg room out here, and everybody you meet is guaranteed to be a PhD


Don't forget Z-Ball!! !


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CU5H946DLY&feature=related[/youtube]


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23 Feb 2011, 10:59 pm

I hope everyone except a few people go into space so I can live amongst the animals.
Everyone you meet is guaranteed to not be a PhD.


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23 Feb 2011, 11:02 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:
I hope everyone except a few people go into space so I can live amongst the animals.
Everyone you meet is guaranteed to not be a PhD.


Fair enough, :lol:

When I'm done terraforming Mars though, you're still invited


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You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do