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Kraichgauer
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18 Jul 2017, 12:23 am

Lintar wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
EzraS wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
No, Putin doesn't want America as an enemy: he wants America to be his stooge, and his b*tch, staying out of his way while he expands Russian political and economic power. Unfortunately, Trump either seems just fine with that, or he's too dumb to realize that's Putin's plan.


Well I guess after nearly 20 years in power and turning 65 soon, it's about time he finally gets around to it. btw what leader doesn't want to expand their country politically and economically?


That becomes a problem when that expansion is at our expense.


You mean like N.A.T.O. expansion?

http://pickelhering.blogspot.com.au/200 ... chive.html

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=NAT ... ORM=HDRSC2

Can anyone blame Russia for simply defending itself?!


Last I checked, NATO hadn't attacked Russia. But Russia has definitely attacked their immediate neighbors who used to be ruled over by the Russians back in the days of the Soviet Union. If anything, those former east bloc countries asked to join NATO because they have every reason to fear Russian expansion. The Russian claim of being gang upped on is nothing but a pretext for justifying imperialist growth.


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Lintar
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18 Jul 2017, 12:48 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
Last I checked, NATO hadn't attacked Russia.


Not directly, no. That might have something to do with the fact that Russia is more than capable of defending itself from N.A.T.O. aggression if it ever came to that. It is, however, being slowly surrounded by states that are joining a hostile military organisation. The nation of Turkey is the host to foreign (i.e. U.S.) military bases, and nuclear weapons are believed to be stockpiled there. Turkey is approximately the same distance from Russia as Cuba is from the United States.

Kraichgauer wrote:
But Russia has definitely attacked their immediate neighbours who used to be ruled over by the Russians back in the days of the Soviet Union. If anything, those former east bloc countries asked to join NATO because they have every reason to fear Russian expansion. The Russian claim of being gang upped on is nothing but a pretext for justifying imperialist growth.


They have NO reason to fear your mythical "Russian expansion". Since 1991, when the USSR collapsed, Russia has annexed how many nations... ? Answer: none. The U.S.A., on the other hand, has invaded and bombed more countries than every other nation on the planet put together.



Kraichgauer
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18 Jul 2017, 12:59 am

Lintar wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
Last I checked, NATO hadn't attacked Russia.


Not directly, no. That might have something to do with the fact that Russia is more than capable of defending itself from N.A.T.O. aggression if it ever came to that. It is, however, being slowly surrounded by states that are joining a hostile military organisation. The nation of Turkey is the host to foreign (i.e. U.S.) military bases, and nuclear weapons are believed to be stockpiled there. Turkey is approximately the same distance from Russia as Cuba is from the United States.

Kraichgauer wrote:
But Russia has definitely attacked their immediate neighbours who used to be ruled over by the Russians back in the days of the Soviet Union. If anything, those former east bloc countries asked to join NATO because they have every reason to fear Russian expansion. The Russian claim of being gang upped on is nothing but a pretext for justifying imperialist growth.


They have NO reason to fear your mythical "Russian expansion". Since 1991, when the USSR collapsed, Russia has annexed how many nations... ? Answer: none. The U.S.A., on the other hand, has invaded and bombed more countries than every other nation on the planet put together.


I seem to recall Russia having invaded Chechnya, and Ukraine. The Baltic States have good reason to fear that they'll be next.


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18 Jul 2017, 1:13 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
I seem to recall Russia having invaded Chechnya, and Ukraine. The Baltic States have good reason to fear that they'll be next.


Chechyna is, and always has been, a part of Russia. It is as much a part of Russia as Siberia, or Sakhalin Island. The Ukraine is still an independent country, it hasn't been annexed. The Baltic States have also joined N.A.T.O.



Lintar
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18 Jul 2017, 1:16 am

Kraichgauer, how would you feel if Cuba, Canada and Mexico joined the (now defunct) Warsaw Pact, had Soviet troops stationed within them, and nuclear weapons based there that all pointed to the U.S.?

Surrounded? Under attack perhaps? Try to empathise with Russians, because that is precisely how they feel right now.



Kraichgauer
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18 Jul 2017, 1:45 am

Lintar wrote:
Kraichgauer, how would you feel if Cuba, Canada and Mexico joined the (now defunct) Warsaw Pact, had Soviet troops stationed within them, and nuclear weapons based there that all pointed to the U.S.?

Surrounded? Under attack perhaps? Try to empathise with Russians, because that is precisely how they feel right now.


I actually would want to know why those neighboring countries had joined the Warsaw Pact, and if there was something we could constructively do in order to dissuade them.
As for your previous post: sure, fine about Chechnya, even though there was at one time an independence movement there, based on their separate ethnicity, language, religion, and history. But you haven't made mention of Ukraine, which Putin had invaded after they had shrugged off their Pro-Russian leader. The Ukrainians have had a long history of being bullied and dominated by the Kremlin, and now want to look to the west for their future - a thing Putin wants to stop at all cost. If Putin wasn't obsessed with rebuilding the Russian Empire, perhaps his neighbors wouldn't be so scared of him to the point of joining Anti-Russian alliances.


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