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goldfish21
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22 May 2018, 3:41 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
Also Universities these days are all about acceptance and diversity. So how about kicking people off campus who are attempting to "cure" autism, deny them things like funding and tenure etc, make it impossible for them to publish their "research?" It certainly works well for so called "creation scientists".


Should we also kick off medicine researchers who are trying to find better ways of alleviating physical pain and replace all such efforts with the notion that people in excruciating pain just simply accept the fact that they're screaming in agony?

Why would you want to make it impossible for research doctors to help alleviate the ASD symptoms of people who are suffering from them and want treatment options available to them just as they are to treat physical pain or other ailments?


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22 May 2018, 3:45 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
Inexpensive simple treatment for a complex genetic condition? LOL good luck with that. As for this Naziesque intervention with infants/toddlers, that's just the kind of genocide I'm against. A world with no more Darwins, Einsteins, Newtons? Is that what you want?

Instead of treatment, what we need is a more plural society that accepts individual difference.

Anyway, the mods will almost certainly lock this thread now, or at least delete this tangent discussion. Enjoy it while you can.


Inexpensive simple treatment for ASD. No one said anything about a complex genetic condition. Or are you making the unfounded assumption that ASD is solely a complex genetic condition? Sounds like it.

I don't need luck; I've already achieved this. Doctors hypothesized 1 year ago that this may be possible to achieve in the future. I achieved it more than 5 years ago. It's not only possible; I'm already doing it & as they hypothesized, it does indeed enable me to function way higher than ever. I can work, live, and play in the social world with everyone else.

No, not naziesque intervention with infants/toddlers. Medicinal treatment of ailments exactly as I described intervening in the poor health of my friends' 1 year old son, who is now a healthy, well adjusted, normal NT 6 year old. This can be done for countless other young people who show signs of ASD development, or who are given mass amounts of lifesaving antibiotics as infants. It's science.

Why would I, or anyone, want a world without people who push the frontiers of science? That's not what I want. I want one where treatment options are known & available to anyone who'd like to realize the benefits of them for themselves or their children. You're not obligated to be one of those people.

Society will never accept everyone, but people can treat what ails them and fit into society better.

*enjoying the s**t out of this* :D


I'm sure you are, because you are continuing a LOCKED THREAD in violation of forum rules.


Exactly as I suspected in the other conversation.. you intentionally torpedo threads in order to have them locked and make the topic of discussion against forum rules. Pretty weak scientific argument for a self declared career scientist.


Dude, I went to school for four years. I passed geochemistry, physical chemistry, calc based physics, and a bunch of other classes too hard for the typical NT. You couldn't do my job. So screw you. Go back to the beach where I hope some shark will take your arrogant head off.


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goldfish21
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22 May 2018, 3:52 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
Inexpensive simple treatment for a complex genetic condition? LOL good luck with that. As for this Naziesque intervention with infants/toddlers, that's just the kind of genocide I'm against. A world with no more Darwins, Einsteins, Newtons? Is that what you want?

Instead of treatment, what we need is a more plural society that accepts individual difference.

Anyway, the mods will almost certainly lock this thread now, or at least delete this tangent discussion. Enjoy it while you can.


Inexpensive simple treatment for ASD. No one said anything about a complex genetic condition. Or are you making the unfounded assumption that ASD is solely a complex genetic condition? Sounds like it.

I don't need luck; I've already achieved this. Doctors hypothesized 1 year ago that this may be possible to achieve in the future. I achieved it more than 5 years ago. It's not only possible; I'm already doing it & as they hypothesized, it does indeed enable me to function way higher than ever. I can work, live, and play in the social world with everyone else.

No, not naziesque intervention with infants/toddlers. Medicinal treatment of ailments exactly as I described intervening in the poor health of my friends' 1 year old son, who is now a healthy, well adjusted, normal NT 6 year old. This can be done for countless other young people who show signs of ASD development, or who are given mass amounts of lifesaving antibiotics as infants. It's science.

Why would I, or anyone, want a world without people who push the frontiers of science? That's not what I want. I want one where treatment options are known & available to anyone who'd like to realize the benefits of them for themselves or their children. You're not obligated to be one of those people.

Society will never accept everyone, but people can treat what ails them and fit into society better.

*enjoying the s**t out of this* :D


I'm sure you are, because you are continuing a LOCKED THREAD in violation of forum rules.


Exactly as I suspected in the other conversation.. you intentionally torpedo threads in order to have them locked and make the topic of discussion against forum rules. Pretty weak scientific argument for a self declared career scientist.


Dude, I went to school for four years. I passed geochemistry, physical chemistry, calc based physics, and a bunch of other classes too hard for the typical NT. You couldn't do my job. So screw you. Go back to the beach where I hope some shark will take your arrogant head off.


So what?

I went to business school at the British Columbia Institute of Technology & completed 130.5 credits in 2 years (and was The Chair of Business and Health Sciences on the BCIT Student Association in my 2nd year) and graduated when I was 19 years old - a full 9 years younger than the average age in my program, and 35 years younger than the 54yo Mechanical Engineer from China who was the eldest. Many of us can study things and pass tests. I'm going to go do it again, too, for as long as it takes until they let me into Medical School, and then I'm going to do that, too. But again, my point is, so what? What is your point? :?

I'm actually heading to the beach momentarily. :) It's a beautiful place on campus at UBC. I was there for 13 hours yesterday... and made $90 carrying heavy things down the stairs and digging holes in the sand. (Barrels of beer and ice, which we then buried the leftovers to dig up this morning.)


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RainbowUnion
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22 May 2018, 3:58 pm

My point is I'm not self declaired anything. So why don't you work in your field? That makes no sense to me.


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goldfish21
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22 May 2018, 4:08 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
My point is I'm not self declaired anything. So why don't you work in your field? That makes no sense to me.


I did some work as an Industrial Engineering Technologist right out of school. Big pressure, worked for jerks, very low pay, super stressed = F this & started working part time at bars 3 nights a week and made more money.

I later studied for Real Estate, Mortgage Broker, and Property Manager licences with a friend and scored over 95% in the course work - but never wrote any of the licence exams because it wasn't right for me at the time.

I sold alarm & video surveillance systems, and had a business partnership marketing a brand of snowboards from the UK across Canada and the USA and created a sponsorship program etc. I've worked at bars and restaurants, tons of different construction jobs, and am currently an Apprentice Taper.

All of these things are now a mere means to an end, though. I just need money so I can pay for schooling for a long time.

The short answer, though, is: Autism. My symptoms did not allow me to function fully & highly and work well with others throughout my 20's. There's little point in people like us getting educated if we can't make the rubber meet the road and apply it to a working career due to our ASD symptoms. But, through medicine, a better higher functioning life is entirely possible - and I am living proof as I've been back to work full time+ for the last 5 years and am going nowhere but onwards & upwards to bigger better things.

edit: My early education was not for naught, though, as I've shared many times.. it's the problem solving techniques & strategies I was taught in business and industrial engineering courses that I applied to solving the problems with my own health - and here I am today for it. Even if I never ever work in a business/sales/manufacturing environment ever again, I got my time & money's worth out of my education and then some, for I have my health.


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22 May 2018, 4:41 pm

OK, well you have treated all your relevant issues or at least think you have, so why not go back to the field you studied? Sounds like there were issues not related to autism at all and those are the real reasons that you didn't like it, such as jerks, low pay, super stressed, etc.


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"It must be understood, that neither by word nor deed had I given Fortunato cause to doubt my good-will. I continued as was my wont, to smile in his face, and he did not perceive that my smile was at the thought of his immolation."

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goldfish21
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22 May 2018, 4:49 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
OK, well you have treated all your relevant issues or at least think you have, so why not go back to the field you studied? Sounds like there were issues not related to autism at all and those are the real reasons that you didn't like it, such as jerks, low pay, super stressed, etc.


Because I despise greed for the sake of greed and the acceleration of consumption of Earth’s resources for no good reason at all.

I’ve also had the life changing transformation that medicine can provide and want to make a career of doing that thing for other people. I’m also capable of doing it and feel I’m underutilizing myself if I don’t. It’s not a career path for everyone, but it is the one I intend to pursue.

You can think whatever you want to, but I just told you I didn’t function highly enough in my 20’s to develop a career. That’s another big reason I’m a fan of medicine for ASD: there are many people like me who are educated but can’t apply themselves to any career path because their ASD symptoms constrain them. Treatment options are for people like them who want them.

And no, I don’t have any particular plans to work with ASD in medicine aside from contributing what I can to doctors who’s specialty it is.


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RainbowUnion
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22 May 2018, 4:55 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
OK, well you have treated all your relevant issues or at least think you have, so why not go back to the field you studied? Sounds like there were issues not related to autism at all and those are the real reasons that you didn't like it, such as jerks, low pay, super stressed, etc.


Because I despise greed for the sake of greed and the acceleration of consumption of Earth’s resources for no good reason at all.

I’ve also had the life changing transformation that medicine can provide and want to make a career of doing that thing for other people. I’m also capable of doing it and feel I’m underutilizing myself if I don’t. It’s not a career path for everyone, but it is the one I intend to pursue.

You can think whatever you want to, but I just told you I didn’t function highly enough in my 20’s to develop a career. That’s another big reason I’m a fan of medicine for ASD: there are many people like me who are educated but can’t apply themselves to any career path because their ASD symptoms constrain them. Treatment options are for people like them who want them.

And no, I don’t have any particular plans to work with ASD in medicine aside from contributing what I can to doctors who’s specialty it is.


Again you prove my point--its not Autism that is the reason you don't want to go into that which you studied! Its some excuse like you don't agree with greed for greeds sake (sounds very Aspie to me BTW). And you didn't function enough? Could you have just been plain old LAZY? Ever think of that?


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"It must be understood, that neither by word nor deed had I given Fortunato cause to doubt my good-will. I continued as was my wont, to smile in his face, and he did not perceive that my smile was at the thought of his immolation."

Edgar Allan Poe, The Cask of Amontillado


goldfish21
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22 May 2018, 5:03 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
goldfish21 wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
OK, well you have treated all your relevant issues or at least think you have, so why not go back to the field you studied? Sounds like there were issues not related to autism at all and those are the real reasons that you didn't like it, such as jerks, low pay, super stressed, etc.


Because I despise greed for the sake of greed and the acceleration of consumption of Earth’s resources for no good reason at all.

I’ve also had the life changing transformation that medicine can provide and want to make a career of doing that thing for other people. I’m also capable of doing it and feel I’m underutilizing myself if I don’t. It’s not a career path for everyone, but it is the one I intend to pursue.

You can think whatever you want to, but I just told you I didn’t function highly enough in my 20’s to develop a career. That’s another big reason I’m a fan of medicine for ASD: there are many people like me who are educated but can’t apply themselves to any career path because their ASD symptoms constrain them. Treatment options are for people like them who want them.

And no, I don’t have any particular plans to work with ASD in medicine aside from contributing what I can to doctors who’s specialty it is.


Again you prove my point--its not Autism that is the reason you don't want to go into that which you studied! Its some excuse like you don't agree with greed for greeds sake (sounds very Aspie to me BTW). And you didn't function enough? Could you have just been plain old LAZY? Ever think of that?


My answer isn’t up for debate. You asked me why, I told you. I elaborated and told you what has inspired me to pursue a different career path, too.

Not everyone’s ASD symptoms are so mild that they just love themselves for being different and can’t understand why others can’t just get an education and work their career as their ASD selves. For people like me, ASD seriously impacts the quality of our lives and our ability to function at work and on society in general. That’s why it’s a Godsend that treatment options exist and are being developed and refined further. You may not need or want any sort of medicinal treatment for our ASD, but that does not mean that I and others don’t.

Edit: I’ve also learned, grown, and changed a lot since I was 19 years old 16 years ago. And with new knowledge of what I value, I’ve made different decisions. I’m not sure why that’s difficult to comprehend.


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Last edited by goldfish21 on 22 May 2018, 5:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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22 May 2018, 5:09 pm

RainbowUnion wrote:
Another thing GF, I'm sure Raptor is watching this argument and laughing his sick perverted arse off, because that's exactly what gets trolls like him off. They intend to cause this sort of thing at forums.


Personal attack!
Talk about trolling.
:roll:


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22 May 2018, 6:18 pm

Get a room

Now back to our regularly scheduled topic
Texas school shooting: Accused shooter's dad believes bullying behind rampage, paper says

Quote:
The father of the teenager accused of killing 10 people at Santa Fe High School in Texas says his son was a "good boy," and he believes bullying drove him to perpetrate last week's deadly rampage.

Antonios Pagourtzis' claims came during a brief phone interview Monday with The Wall Street Journal.
Pagourtzis' son, 17-year-old Dimitrios Pagourtzis, is on suicide watch at the Galveston County Jail, where he is being held without bail. He has not entered a plea to the charges of capital murder of multiple people and aggravated assault on a public servant.

In a probable cause statement, authorities said he admitted to the shooting.

His father told the Journal that Dimitrios was "mistreated at school" and "I believe that's what was behind" the shooting.
In a statement over the weekend, the Santa Fe Independent School District said it was aware of false reports "about SFISD high school coaches and bully-like behaviors toward the student shooter." The administration investigated the claims and determined they were untrue, the statement said.

Pagourtzis, who business records show owns North American Marine Inc., a ship repair and industrial cleaning company in Houston, north of Santa Fe, told the Journal he struggled to get where he is today. He left his village in northern Greece when he was 12 with only the clothes he was wearing and a spare set of boots, he said.

According to Harris County court records, Pagourtzis was twice charged with misdemeanor assault -- in 1987 and 2012 -- and both cases were dismissed. In 2008, he was convicted of illegally dumping wood materials, records show.

n the 2012 case, Pagourtzis punched a man and "grabbed his face and hit his head on the ground causing his nose to bleed" after, Pagourtzis alleged, the man hurt dogs at his shop, a police affidavit said.
It's unclear why the cases were dismissed, and neither Pagourtzis' nor the alleged victim's attorneys could be reached for comment.

During the interview with The Wall Street Journal, Antonios Pagourtzis wouldn't discuss how his son came to acquire the weapons used in Friday's attack, the paper reported.

Sawed-off shotguns are illegal without a permit from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. The .38-caliber handgun was purchased in the early 1990s, the official said.

nvestigators have identified the original buyers, but how Dimitrios ultimately obtained the weapons is still under investigation, the official said.

In a Saturday interview with Greece's Antenna TV, Pagourtzis said he owned the guns used in the attack and Dimitrios took them from his closet.

Dimitrios worked out and didn't drink or get into fights, he told the station. He said he ate and played with his son the night before the shooting, and Dimitrios left early the next morning. When the father asked why he was leaving early, Dimitrios replied, "I'm off, I love you and I'll see you in the afternoon," Pagourtzis told Antenna.

The suspect won't face the death penalty if he is convicted. Under Texas law, offenders younger than 18 who are charged with a capital offense face a maximum penalty of life in prison with the possibility of parole after 40 years.
Gov. Abbott on Tuesday kicked off the first of three roundtable discussions on school security, gun safety and the accounts of victims, including those from Santa Fe.

The first roundtable, which focused on school and community safety, included almost two dozen school administrators, politicians, law enforcement officials and an architect with expertise on school design, among others.

Reporters were then ushered out of the room, as Abbott's office announced they would be prior to the meeting. After the discussions, reporters came back in and Abbott talked about what happened.

He said ideas discussed included enlarging the school marshal program, which allows teachers to be armed; greater parent accountability; creation of more threat assessment teams; hiring more school counselors; improving communications between law enforcement and school employees; installing metal detectors; and statewide monitoring of social media.
"We did more today than talk," the governor said. "We came up with some solid solutions."

Wednesday's session will focus on gun regulations, mental health and causes of gun violence, he said. Thursday's roundtable will be about victims and families of victims.

On Wednesday, district teachers and support staff will return to school. All students will return May 29, the district said.


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23 May 2018, 11:05 am

Goldfish started this. I was only responding to the bait in Aspie fashion.

Heres how I see it. Goldfish failed in life for reasons not related to autism, and is using it as an excuse and a scapegoat. Even after "treating" his condition, he still lacks a real job (digging ditches on the beach doesn't count) and is spouting his pseudoscience BS to people who have told him they are not interested myself and Ez among them.

GF, Ez is non verbal, and you want to call him on the phone? That would be pretty one sided LOL. He, myself, and Raligh all think you are nuts and have told you that directly. The mods have told you they think you have "significant TOM issues". That means they think you are nuts. NUTS NUTS NUTS. Like Christian Fundie level of nuts.

You dig ditches, so do I. To test groundwater for chemical contamination. I have a real job and a life that I love, and I wouldn't change anything. You want to be a doctor?? Heaven forbid. Your poor patients...


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"It must be understood, that neither by word nor deed had I given Fortunato cause to doubt my good-will. I continued as was my wont, to smile in his face, and he did not perceive that my smile was at the thought of his immolation."

Edgar Allan Poe, The Cask of Amontillado


Last edited by RainbowUnion on 23 May 2018, 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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23 May 2018, 11:09 am

Raptor wrote:
RainbowUnion wrote:
Another thing GF, I'm sure Raptor is watching this argument and laughing his sick perverted arse off, because that's exactly what gets trolls like him off. They intend to cause this sort of thing at forums.


Personal attack!
Talk about trolling.
:roll:


Screw U raptor.


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"It must be understood, that neither by word nor deed had I given Fortunato cause to doubt my good-will. I continued as was my wont, to smile in his face, and he did not perceive that my smile was at the thought of his immolation."

Edgar Allan Poe, The Cask of Amontillado


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23 May 2018, 12:57 pm

Damn!! 8O
Just look at the personal attacks and incivility in those last two posts alone. Not to worry, as a progressive you'll be given a lot of latitude that no conservative or libertarian here has ever had. I've had your kind threaten to knife me though the eyes, sodomize me with a corn cob, and to cut my throat here on WP and get away with it.


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23 May 2018, 1:02 pm

locked for trollery and attacks that detailed the thread.

really poor form guys. for shame.


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