Sexism against guys

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i think any group (whether sexual, racial or otherwise) who were oppressed in the past, can sometimes find it hard to get the balance right...when does pride turn into arrogance...etc.

I think I'm upset with men for better reasons than that. . . And I passionately hate those books.

I want honest, equal, and respecting relationships. . . and I'm willing to go without rather than relax that standard.

it shouldn't be too much to ask.

I hope you don't think I'm chastizing men. I'm just saying that clashing expectations can cause a lot of hurt even without anyone doing anything wrong.

Same here. It took me a long time before I could believe that there are men out there who care enough to try to do the right thing.



I had a relationship of "equals" when I was 24, and it didn't work, because equality of input does not equal equality of outcome, at least not for me. I turned to "those books" when all my other efforts failed, and they helped me sort out some stuff that I didn't understand. They're not for everyone, and some people already know everything they could get out of them, but when you're raised the way I was, they're a godsend.

for all the lipservice given it, I was not able to experience a relationship of equals till I met someone who had a much clearer idea of that than I did.

Before then I had no concept, regardless that I thought I did.


I can see how such books could be helpful for some people at some times. . . I get very frustrated, though, at "how to date" things that advocate a lack of openness and honestly.

most of my friends (both male and female) have read passages of that "men are from venus, women are from mars" book (it was left in our house when we moved in, amongst other forgotten literary classics XD" and we've all pretty much discounted it as absolute trash, written as a guide for unintelligent gender-typical sheep. i remember reading it and being horrified at the incredible generalisations that were being made about the different sexes....if someone wrote "all black people smoke crack" in a book then i'm sure it would cause offence, but if it's a statement like "all women are emotional creatures and men are pride-driven, fun loving bastards" i'd assume most people would either agree with it or let the writer get away with it.

but then again, i feel my friends are somewhat of an enlightened group, i'm far more "girly" than a few of my female friends, who i'd assume would be called "tomboyish"

god, society really loves putting things in boxes...

/rant over

I think a lot of people accused The Rules of promoting dishonesty, but I think all they meant was don't tell people your life story on the first date (or first few months). It's usually not a good idea (though sometimes it can work). After all, you don't know the guy, and have no idea if he'll be respectful. Plus it can make people uncomfortable. I suppose it all depends on how intense you both are. The more conventional you are, the more these books apply.

I didn't get much out of the first book, either. The one on dating has five stages for dating, though, which to me really helped in understanding how relationships grow over time. Plus I think his approach encourages authenticity in the long run. But that has nothing to do with sex differences.

I did get something out of the first book at one point though, when I was dealing with issues around career counselling. They always ask: what do you like to do? But I think for many women the more important question is: who do you like to work with? Often the job itself is secondary. And there may be sex differences there. Even if there aren't I think it's important to ask both questions, since different people have different priorities and may not know it.

oh its incredibly important, i think even so amongst asperger's people, we have to work in the right environment with understanding colleagues else we're gonna hate it.x

that book was written by a Freudian so no more.

Amen.

yep
I don't like being called "aspie" or bisexual or whatever I am
I am what I am-I don't want labels
i am a person!
not a word

I actually read The Rules, and while it's been awhile, and I don't remember very precisely that's not what I remember. I think there are specific items about not telling your life story on the first date, but there's also a lot more. . .

It seems to be all about maintaining a romantic mistique, so you always leave them coming back for more.

If I were to follow their advice, I would be presenting myself as something entirely different from what I actually am. . . . and not following it, I have no trouble finding people to date. I don't think finding deep intellectual connection (along with everything else--which is what I'm looking for) would be easier with their help.

My rewrite of their advice: Study human social interaction and ettiquite, so you don't to anything spectacularly stupid, and develop real depths so you don't have to fake it.

finally, some where i can post this pic .

Uggh. Men, ever ask yourself, 'what does feminism do for me?' That answers it.