NLD and Asperger's

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Could someone tell me the signs that you could have both nonverbal learning disability and Asperger's? If not, is it different for each person?

Nonverbal Learning Disorder ONLY
-problems with spatial relations (drawing graphs, reading maps, directions ect)
-visual perception problems
- trouble with math in school

ASD ONLY
-stimming , constant twirling fingers in front of eyes as a child and walking in circles talking to myself , flapping arms when upset/exited -now do the twirling but in private -still flap arms when uspet.
-extreme need for sameness, upset with changes
- tendency to be obsessive about interests (my imaginary world as a child), reading now ect.

Could be because of either ASD or NLD
- sensory issues with overload, sound and smell
- motor skills problems (really severe)
- social problems - being inappropriate , accidentally offending people
- having no friends for most of my life and very little social life now (1 friend I talk to every couple of weeks and see every month or so).
-non-verbal communication problems (not picking up non-verbal cues and having weird gestures and facial expressions , voice tone ect)

Could someone with both NLD and AS still have the issues with math? When I was a child, my dad said I would constantly wave my hand in front of my face and "talk" to it. I also did the hand flapping while running back and forth or continously walking in a circle. I never displayed NLD traits as a child.

The psychologist who dxed me with NLD flat out told me that he did not like labelling people but thought I had APD and then denied that. It bothers me that I may of been wrongly dxed with one disorder instead of another. That's why I want to know.

Maybe you should be reassessed for ASD. That sounds weird.....maybe your doctor was a quack. You could just have ASD pr both or nothing and have trouble with math. It just is common in NLD because problems with spatial relations cause problems with math. If you have problems with spatial things like directions which is also usually indicated in an IQ test by having a verbal IQ WAY higher than your performance IQ, then you might have NLD or both NLD and ASD. The social problems are similar in the two conditions but they;re more severe and noticeable in ASD than NLD. I saw a statistic on this website recently that estimated 1/3 of people with ASD also have NLD, so they aren't mutually exclusive and actually occur together a lot.

The doctor was a nice guy but some of the things he mentioned to me were just plain weird. Also I was assessed in MT and that state has a horrible record of people being screwed over by the doctors. I didn't know it was NLD until my voc rehab caseworker showed me my evaluation. I thought I had a visual processing disorder because that's what he told me it was.

I'm going to see if I can get health insurance here in Oregon and then go find a psychologist who can probably reassess me correctly.

That's a good idea. Good luck.

Thank you.

Mainly I can identify with the criteria for NLD and I do find that noises really bother me and I may stim mildy and not sure. As a little kid I enjoyed spinning in circles until I was dizzy.

I am somewhat clumsy and never liked playing basketball and did like throwing baskets.


Math was a problem when I was in middle school and all the visual spatial deficiencies are there for me (trouble thinking in 3D as shown when I took a neuropsychology test and also when reversing a car which is difficult for me.).

I think that underlined traits are typical for Kanneric (hard) sorts of autism. Bolded are for me PDD traits, I think that they are not uncommon in "soft" autism. Severe dyssemia is the first criterium of autism and AS is DSM-IV and ICD-10.

The symptoms from "could be because of either ASD or NLD" are not NLD symptoms for me. NLD is not a social problem, it does not make you "obsessive".

Classic AS is just an atypical variant of Kanner's autism. It should be classified as "atypical autism" rather than "Asperger's". "NLD" is so severe to be just a learning disability. It is also a complex developmental disability.

People with "NVLDish" PDD (not a Kanneric one) tend to have social, emotional, behavioral, sensory, linguistic and motoric anomalies. They are for me "pure" Aspies, but of other sort than "Kanneric" pure Aspies.

NLD should be limited even to "visual-spatial developmental disorder", even with exclusion of motoric deficits.

In ICD-11 there should be something for "social NLD" in F84.5. "Classic" Aspies should be F84.1. And the name NLD is definately to change - it misleads severily. "Asperger's" is for me any PDD (also in "subclinical" level) without intellectual disability and with ability to use speech to communication.

Interestingly, I now sometimes stim by walking in the circles or even talking to myself... I do not remember talking to myself in childhood. I do not have extreme need for sameness. I have F84.5, not F84.1 or something which should be classified as it. HFA is very like "classic" Asperger's. They are so similar. F84.5 is after F84.2, F84.3, F84.4.

F84.5 is for "social NLD"! "Social NLD" is for me a multiplex developmental disturbance, such as HFA, but "social NLD" tends to be milder. But still a PDD. I am properly diagnosed with F84.5, not F84.0 or F84.1.

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