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Off the Rails: Documentary on Autistic Train Thief Darius McCollum

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GreenSky
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06 May 2016, 12:24 am

naturalplastic wrote:
"Dead pan comic Steven Wright quipped "I got a parking ticket. I plead insanity", and gets laughs because everyone knows that you cant plead insanity for lesser crimes than murder."

Are you sure you cant plead insanity for lesser crimes than murder? (Look up legal insanity tests like: M'Naghten Rule, The Irresistible Impulse Test, The "Durham Rule", and Model Penal Code test)


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GreenSky
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06 May 2016, 12:33 am

Since we are on the topic of legal insanity. I really want to know what other people with Autism think of some of the tests used to determine legal insanity. Here are a few.

The M'Naghten Rule,
The Irresistible Impulse Test,
The "Durham Rule", and
Model Penal Code test.

These tests always bothered me when I was learning about them because, well... Just read them and see if they apply to anyone you know.

Please do not take this as an insult. I am not trying to insult anyone (under these rules someone could argue that I have been legally insane).


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naturalplastic
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06 May 2016, 7:57 am

GreenSky wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
"Dead pan comic Steven Wright quipped "I got a parking ticket. I plead insanity", and gets laughs because everyone knows that you cant plead insanity for lesser crimes than murder."

Are you sure you cant plead insanity for lesser crimes than murder? (Look up legal insanity tests like: M'Naghten Rule, The Irresistible Impulse Test, The "Durham Rule", and Model Penal Code test)


I was speaking fast and loose for brevity's sake.What I meant to say is that you cant plead insanity very far down the heirarchy of crimes from murder. The reason being that the more severe the crime the more severe the punishment. So they have to guard some folks against the severe punishments of capital crimes, but dont bother to put similiar safeguards from the lesser punishments for misdameanors like parking tickets.

Actually- I have never heard of the insanity plea being used in anything other than murder (though there are sanity clauses in contracts). But I dont claim to be a lawyer. you're probably right.



alex
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06 May 2016, 10:36 am

Totally agree with you. Great point regarding the MTA's responsibility in creating this problem starting from the time he was 15.

skibum wrote:
I just read the article. It's very good. I think that it is absolutely disgusting that he is in Rikers with rapists and murderers, career gangbangers and drug dealers who murder people and destroy lives as a way of life. I also think it's disgusting that none of the train and bus operators who would call him in to take their shifts for them so that they could play paid hookey are in prison with him.

This entire situation is absurd. From what I read in the article, the MTA created this problem, not Darius. The first conductor to hand over the controls of a train to a 15 year old civilian was the first problem. It was not for Darius to refuse, he was a child. Then after that all the conductors and drivers who would call him and ask him to take over their shifts to give them a paid day off was the second problem. And the same goes for the ones who would ask him to take over their shifts mid shift.

As far as him taking trains and buses on routes without the involvement of anyone else, that was all him but from what the article said, most of the time seems to be when other drivers asked him to. And technically he never stole one because he would always bring them back on time and intact. And I may be wrong about this but isn't public transportation paid for by the public? I don't think it's a private enterprise. So he was not even borrowing private property if I am correct in this.

It really sucks. Every single driver who asked him to take over a shift should be in Rikers right along side him.


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GreenSky
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06 May 2016, 2:15 pm

skibum wrote:
I think that it is absolutely disgusting that he is in Rikers with rapists and murderers, career gangbangers and drug dealers who murder people and destroy lives as a way of life.


I completely agree. He should not go to jail because jail is mostly about punishment. He should have been sent to a place where he could get the mental help he needed. This might have given him the skills to prevent future incidents.

I do not know what the legal test for insanity is where he committed those crimes, but for him IMHO it would be better to be "insane" than go to jail.

Durham test "states that '... an accused is not criminally responsible if his unlawful act was the product of mental disease or defect'." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durham_rule

The M'Naghten Rule "to establish a defense on the ground of insanity, it must be clearly proved that, at the time of the committing of the act, the party accused was laboring under such a defect of reason, from disease of mind, and not to know the nature and quality of the act he was doing; or if he did know it, that he did not know he was doing what was wrong." http://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-pr ... 3gfzV.dpuf

Here is an example of insanity using the M'Naghten Rule (taken from the same webpage as rule above):
"A man murdered his wife and daughter, and then waited calmly for the police to arrive. Three mental health experts testified that he was too psychologically ill to understand that his criminal acts were wrong. He was found not guilty by reason of insanity and sentenced to 10 years in a mental health facility." http://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-pr ... 3gfzV.dpuf

"Those found to have been not guilty by reason of mental disorder or insanity are generally then required to undergo psychiatric treatment in a mental institution" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insanity_defense


* Please note this is not legal advice.


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ehymw
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09 May 2016, 4:17 pm

alex wrote:
Yigeren wrote:
I've read of him before. I feel that it's sad that he has to spend so much time locked up. I know that he's technically committing crimes, but he's not hurting anyone.

He's better at driving the subway trains than most of the professional conductors I'd imagine.


I've had the same thought.

A person like this needs to be found a fitting outlet for his obsession or it's society that will have lost an opportunity.



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19 May 2016, 6:29 am

This goes to show how little people give a crap about black men and black lives. Here this dude is doing something thats completely harmless and they would throw him in jail, and ruin his life like that. This is why organizations like the color of autism need support that way MORE people of color and blacks on the spectrum could get diagnosed and be at least a little bit understood. Whether it helps or not is another story because white cops are still white cops.



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19 May 2016, 8:00 am

I agree that Darius should not have been put in prison. I don't think he should have the burden of a felony record.

But what he did was wrong, and what he did was potentially dangerous. And he has to learn that.

I believe the MTA should actually hire him in a similar role as that guy from the movie "Catch Me If You Can," about the idealistic forger.



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18 Aug 2016, 4:16 pm

I used to live in NYC, and am old enough to remember the newspaper reports from when he was initially caught driving a train at age 15. While there was some concern that as an untrained motorman, he could have injured someone, most people were at least a bit amused by his antics, and thought maybe the MTA should have hired him once he was old enough to apply. Too bad they didn't; he wouldn't have been in all of this trouble.



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18 Aug 2016, 5:43 pm

I've only ever read about this guy and seen pictures in British newspapers:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5131960/

- but I love him unconditionally



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18 Aug 2016, 10:16 pm

The lone nail and all that.

It sucks, but society is made for the normal majority; always has been and always will be. You need to go through the steps they all do to do the things they do, but if you can't due to a disability, then there we go.

I'm disbarred from the military and police for the same reasons.



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18 Aug 2016, 10:28 pm

oops wrong picture, here's a brit article on him with a good picture

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... rk-transit