global warming or a new ice age?

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When people fart and burp the same happens as for all animals. And for all animals (people included) breathing out CO2 also increases CO2 in the atmosphere. So then all animals should stop farting, burping and breathing, so we should all die, but when we die also CO2 will be released. So then maybe all animals should stop reproducing. Then CO2 will decrease. But the CO2 that is released by farting, burping and breathing comes from the food we and other animals eat, so in the system it remains the same.

Concerning sparkling drinks:

From food-info.net/uk/e/e290.htm:
So the CO2 in sparkling drinks comes from the air.

In beer and champagne yeasts ferment sugars and form carbon dioxide gas (and alcohol).

So all this CO2 comes from the air and from plants.
But for producing drinks containing CO2 we need energy to take the CO2 from the air and put it into drinks. This energy, if it comes from burning fossil fuels, will quickly increase CO2 in the atmosphere.

In the atmosphere plants will take CO2 out of the atmosphere and produce O2.

So the problems arise when we don't have enough plants and trees on Earth to make O2 from the increased CO2 levels.
So maybe we should all start planting trees

Taxes won't solve the problem.
Unless these taxes will be used for planting trees

Last edited by Scientist on 31 Dec 2009, 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Yes but that wont make money it will cost money . they aren't doing any of this to save the planet they just want to tax us.

Good observations btw. I thought this myself. i miss all the forests they have cut down in my area. yet you don't see any body trying to stop that.

Last edited by just-me on 02 Jan 2010, 2:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

There's no logic in economy/capitalism, no logic in the way the system is now. We can't eat and breathe if there's no more healthy plants, trees and animals. We can't eat and breathe money. If we ran out of healthy food and healthy air, money would be useless.Thank you.
I also don't like deforestation. There are people trying to reduce or stop deforestation. But unfortunately these people/groups are not powerful enough. And we might need LOADS of trees to make up for our CO2 emissions. So maybe we should not only reduce or stop deforestation, maybe we should also start reforestation and afforestation, on a global scale. I don't know if we would have soil enough for all the trees we need. I don't know how many trees we need and I don't know how much time the trees need...

Oceans also take up CO2.
Studies find CO2 uptake by oceans may be slowing caused by acidification of oceans.

I think in general too many people think too short-term.


BTW, you actually should delete [quote="Wombat"] in the beginning of your post, because you quoted me. And if you would do so, you would get rid of your quotations mismatch

It is a fact that our planets climate is ever changing and that human activity clearly has an influence. Other posters have presented scenarios where the earth is scoured clean ect the problem is if the oceans rise or glaciers scour there will still be man made chemicals that will never go away (ie: teflon) . I also believe in another scenario that others haven't addressed the magnetic poles of our earth has shifted in the past and will do it again when it does climate change will be a moot point.

In our short time as a species, we had nothing to do with the major changes.

We came up in a long ice age, 50,000 years ago we got hit with cosmic junk, Barringer Crater in Arizona, Lonar Crater in Maharashta India, and as land is only a fifth, several ocean strikes.

When the ice melted, humans and southern trees moved north, and were killed by the next wave of ice, and again, 26,000 years ago, another wave of space junk, more holes, and another wave of ice.

8,000 years ago for no known reason, the Sahara formed in what was grassland trees, lakes, streams, for maybe a million years. It rolled through the Middle East, Caspian Sea, and on to the Gobi.

There were humans, but not enough to cause anything.

The big drought in the American southwest came long before the invaders, Anasazi, Mimbres, people in southern Arizona, found themselves in a desert, which has lasted. it started about 1100, lasted till 1550, Some rains did come back, but not like before 1100, when the Chihuahua Desert was towns and farmland.

The canyons cut through stone show the west saw some real rains, floods, great and sudden rivers eating their way through stone, forming the Grand Canyon, and Copper Canyon in Mexico, five times the size of the Grand Canyon. No ice age ending did this, it was rains.

12,000 years ago was the Lesser Dryas, a 1,500 year dust storm, that blanketed the west with up to 17 meters of dust. The Clovis culture ends, nothing lives till the wind and dust stopped.

The rise of humans to large numbers is a direct result of the Global Warming of the last 10,000 years.

It was a rare time in geologic history. Before that was ice from 13,000 to 22,000 years ago, and before that a 5,000 year very warm period, sea level seven meters higher, people living east of the Urals along the Arctic coast. Before that was 5,000 years of ice, and before that the first time we came north and lived, an age of 5,000 years.The ice before that lasted 125,000 years.

These changes kept humans in small numbers and tropical.

13,000 years ago sea level was 450 meters lower. It rose as much as 20 meters in one summer, and as little as none in a thousand years, but over time, a half meter per hundred years. Our current rate is a third meter per hundred years.

The Arctic is gone, and if all of Greenland and Anarctica melt, sea level can only rise seven more meters. We were there from 23,000 to 28,000 years ago.

The far north is very farmable. The days are long, the Matenuska Valley in Alaska is very productive. Canada and Siberia would come into production.

The idea that we all voted for climate change to stop is not working. We even passed Laws!

Plan on farming farther north, for if the ice comes back, there is no plan possible. One year without summer, like 1815, no crops from the American and Canadian grain lands, and it is famine. Argentinia and Australia have drought, and were large grain producers. We are living on the edge.

India and China are not going to stop producing greenhouse gasses, they would starve, and that is asking a bit much. They have a water problem, the Three Gorges Dam is not filled, because drought has demanded more water down stream to keep the crops going. India pays people to dig holes to catch water if it does rain. The Monsoon has not been good.

We have strip mined the oceans, all major fish are way over fished. The Cod and Herring that filled the North Atlantic are gone. Everyone takes from the ocean, and dumps their waste there. No one owns the Commons, so no one takes care of them.

Ocean life is one place we could produce a lot of food, as I mentioned, seeding the oceans with iron will produce a Plankton bloom, then Krill, then fish. Bring back and protect the herring, and the species that eat them. Let them die of natural causes, for they will gather the metals, toxins, and concentrate them. After a hundred years or so, the ocean can feed the land.

Tax all fishing! A free catch is the problem. A tax will pay for restoring the oceans.

The world belongs to the future, and we can leave it a better place.

LOL thanks I did not even notice that. I've been quite stressed lately and it is effecting my thinking.
thanks for the heads up.

Yes there is still a debate on whether that is gradual or sudden occurrence. In the documentary i watched they said in the past the poles had shifted in a weird way. there were spots on the earth where the poles were switched (but only in that spot). and others areas were normal. over time these spots became more frequent until a complete pole shift had occurred.

From today's news, the magnetic pole has been moving, forty miles a year, heading toward Russia.

It has been happy in Canada for a while, but is leaving. Not much detail on how long this has been going on.

At over three miles a month, no one said if it was picking up speed.

You heard it here first, folks.

The "warming alarmists" are finding it hard to convince people when they are up to their butts in snow and suffering record low temperatures.

Time for "Plan B".

"Man made CO2 is making the oceans acidic. If we don't impose carbon taxes immediately then all the coral reefs and all the poor fish are going to die!! !! ! Probably by next week."

"One way or another you people WILL give up control of your own economies and pay taxes directly to the privately owned World Bank"

If the North magnetic pole's moving, is the South magnetic pole moving with it?

From what I've read, it's been drifting ever since accurate compass readings have been taken. I think what people are concerned about is that if the poles did switch - and they will as they have multiple times in the past - the Van Allen Belt will be affected and we will be bombarded with high levels of radiation.

Probably, but not necessarily in antipodal positions.

ruveyn

I have been interested in pole shifts for awhile now ,from what I can gather there is evidence (that is being suppressed) that in the geologic record the poles have done a series of minor shifts followed by one major flip . Evidence found has been flash frozen mammoths with fresh buttercups between their teeth these plants only bloom at above 60 degrees F so it was early summer when these animals were frozen, consider that you can actually get an edible steak off some mammoths.

Here's the news about the moving North Magnetic Pole:
National Geographic - North Magnetic Pole moving due to core flux
And I found some more information about the moving North and South Poles.
Apparently both Poles are moving, but not together.

Thank you Scientist. That was a better article than the AOL view I caught. It is speeding up, 400+% since the last twenty year mark.

The magnetic field is connected to the solid core, which floats in liquid metal? Whatever it is, even if the core was a perfect sphere, there is a lot of edge movement, Solid core, liquid middle, and solid crust, no longer moving as one. As motion under that much pressure will produce heat through friction, I think we have another Global Warming problem.

I have always heard it was fairly static, little magnetic drift over time. Heat came as plumes, melted some crust from the bottom, and produced volcanos.

If it is moving, the axis of spin is going to be a ring hot spot, for if the pole is moving, so is the core beneath me, I live on the axis. Since 1989, taking 32 kilometers a year as mid range, it has moved 640 Km. This is like a broad river flowing north, of liquid metals, just beneath my feet, and speeding up.

Over the next twenty years, about twice that, if the rate does not increase, and eight times that if it continues gaining speed. Now we are up to 5,000 Km.and 20,000 in the next twenty.

One of the unexplained problems of global warming, most is happening in the Arctic region. This ring of a heat plume from the core moving would be crossing the Arctic. I have heard 8 degrees of warming, the highest on the planet, and no connection with CO2.

Another minor problem, it is passing beheath the New Madrid Quake Zone, which is the largest in America, with a 200 year cycle, that is the reason there are eights and nines on the quake scale. About 1812, from a center on the Mississippi river, it rang church bells in Washington and Boston.

It is a deep mid craton quake, not like those shallow California quakes, San Andres is a whimpy slip sliding fault. The Mississippi River follows this fault, and it is thought it is a spreading center.

The last time few lived in the area, it toppled forests, the Mississippi ran backward, with waterfalls, it lasted for months, serious after shocks.

Study has shown it is a dependable quake, coming every 200 years for the last few thousand.

Now it is the center of our grain lands, power transmission lines, major east-west and north-south highways, railroads, and oil and natural gas pipelines. The river is the main way of shipping grain.

There is no way to measure magnitude over 200 years, but it will be top of the scale, somewhere beyond total distruction, forests toppled, then kicked around. Faults opened and swallowed land, trees, people, animals, and water, then closed as others opened. The descriptions were from tramatised people. The month of aftershocks were beyond Major Quake.

I do have a personal interest, I live a few miles from the river. Sometimes it is almost a hundred foot higher than the city, held back by levees, that would crumble in a quake, just as they did in the minor Katrina three meter storm surge.

This years snows are going to be the spring thaw and flood, the largest in years, when we have had 100 year floods about every five years. A river of molten metal below flowing north, a major Mississippi flood flowing south, lots of natural processes going on.

I feel small.

Joke :

-What did Hitler want for x-mas ?

-A "white" x-mas