ASDs ignored due to the new UK 'Welfare Reform' Bill

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The new UK government are putting a new system into place to replace Disability Living Allowance. This new system however seems to rely on a shocking new test which misses a lot of major problems. The government themselves have admitted (see the Guardian article below) that the test is weakest when assessing people with ASDs, learning difficulties or mental health problems.

"In pilots of the test, 30% fewer people have been found unfit for work and 70% fewer people have been found eligible for the full-rate unconditional support benefit. Already people have been told they don't qualify for benefits in much greater numbers than anticipated in government projections."

Guardian Article: Government reform disability benefits

NAS Media Response: Concern over benefits for those with hidden disablilities

I read the articles and comments. I feel sorry for some but others seem to have the attitude that because life's tougher for them than average, they should be compensated for it. The new criteria are tough, and for some, definitely unfair, but for some others if they were in another country with less social support, they would be working eg. they may have health problems, but they are not incapeable.

What I don't get is why they can't just make all disability pay the same as normal workers allowance and just have extra supports? That way there is no extra incentive for malingerers. Since the NHS is free, why does being disabled mean that you need an extra £25/week?

I'm honestly asking- I know very little about any hidden costs, so from an outsider's perspective, the £25 just seems like a bogey-prize for being disabled. Maybe the extra cash should go on supporting people in/find work instead?

Overall, if I lived in England, I would support the new system. But I think it is unfair that your chances of getting benefit are hugely increased if you bring a friend/relative to back up your story- that doesn't seem fair at all to many who are less adept at working the system (for right or wrong) or who are so isolated through illness that they have no social supports. I hope they are able to refine the system in the future.

No, they would not be working. The reason? NAIRU! As long as NAIRU is holy writ there's going to be a reserve army of labour and these people are just going to have to suck it up and live in poverty as clearly their mental problems are God's punishment for their evil and they deserve what they get. That's what the Tory scum have decided.

The NHS may be free, but medication isn't, and nor is care for some. If a person genuinely can't work or has difficulty getting themselves into a position to work, they need some means of living. This is what the disability allowance should provide. The £25/week is the regular jobseeker's allowance, which you can get if you're out of work but actively looking, just to sustain you for the time being. When you're in receipt of this, you have to prove weekly that you have looked for and applied for jobs etc or they won't give you anything. So far that's all fine, however...

When disabled people (in the new system) are actually recognised as being disabled (which as I've said, isn't often), they fall into one of two categories. One of the categories is for those who are genuinely incapacitated and can't work, but the other category is for people who can work if they are given help and support to get into a job. This is what worries me the most, as the new criteria is stopping a lot of people who could really use the help and support that they are offering, and really do want to work (which is I think the case for a lot of people with ASDs or other mental, 'hidden' problems) but are being ignored and pushed onto jobseeker's allowance without another thought for them. These people aren't going to get any further help and so might not manage to get themselves into employment, which isn't their fault, though they are technically labelled 'jobseekers' and it would seem that nothing is stopping them getting a job.

People with hidden conditions such as autism may be capable of working. There is getting the job in the first place and that means having to attend interviews. This means that autistic people will be at an unfair disadvantage due to having to compete with neurotypicals in the job market. If two people, one has Asperger syndrome and another is NT and they both are invited for a job interview, the interviewer which is usually the personnel assistant in the company the vacancy is with. He or she would more than likely choose the neurotypical. This is why most people on the autistic spectrum are not working. Some are but they may have had help in job seeking and interview skills that NTs look for such as the simian non verbal communication that interviewers look for in assessing suitability for a job. Another factor in unemployment in autism/Asperger syndrome is the presence of an aspiphobic workforce and increased workplace bullying of Asperger syndrome people by some thicko neurotypicals.

I think that the so called austerity cuts proposed by the Tories and their Lib Dem coalition partners are just an excuse to kill 10,000,000 people and will be labelled by historians as the British Holocaust. How would this be carried out? By mass starvation, destitution as benefits are stopped as vulnerable people are falsely accused of being workshy or bone idle.

Ah, I see. That doesn't seem fair. I suppose it's cheaper to pay 25 quid a week than give effective (expensive) meds to someone with say arthritis, but it flies in the face of the government's claim to want to get people back into work.

I read that the carers allowance was being cut (or was that Ireland?)- that's an utter disgrace!



Yeah, that's why I kind of think that instead of giving extra money to disabled people, they should give extra support instead (including the drugs/therapy needed to allow them to function).

What kind of extra supports would someone with aspergers need or be able to get?

That's true, I can imagine interviews being a real hurdle. Also, whilst I'm not sure I agree that non-verbal language is 'thicko' or simian, I do agree that it probably plays a huge role in office cohesion and inter-politics.

Just a thought though, but maybe they are right not to hire people who cannot work in that particular environment? There are other jobs apart from office work that require less interaction and may not even require interviews. Presuming that the person with AS keeps applying&getting turned down by the office job regularily, that leaves them still eligible for work-seekers benefit and then when they do come across a job more suited to them, they can take it... I may be missing something, but that seems to me to be more realistic than giivng someone help to land a job that is ultimately unsuited to them.



But as long as people keep applying for jobs, whether they get them or not, will they not still get paid? I know it's less on workers allowance and as HamOfCydonia pointed out it doesn't cover all meds or carers, but many people survive on that and less without starving.

(edit, sorry if I come across as devil's advocate. I don't mean to offend anyone who is on disability/is finding it hard to work. I just feel I need more information before jumping on the bandwagon of condemning the new system as 100% evil).

What I cannot understand is where are all these jobs that they want people to work at?
Previous Tory government destroyed all our manufacturing industry and it cannot be replaced!

There is an small minority underclass that are expert in getting benefits to avoid work one thing I do know is that they will not be affected when the majority of usually the most vulnerable claimants will be given a very hard time.

In relation to people with disabilities, most labor laws require the employer to make reasonable accommodations. People with ASD's is quite entitled to such accommodations too, so long he/she is qualified and capable of doing the work they are payed to do. It may be good for them to improve their social skills to some extent but they are not payed for that and they do not deserve office bullying either.

wondering if i should bother filling out my DLA renewal form.. but atm i need every penny & that's £60 a week i can't really do without.

Knew this was gonna happen ever since the coalition was created. Oh well, none of this stuff kicks in right away and I'm trying to get a job right now anyway.

The system was unfair to us to begin with, and all disabled people.

The job centre decided THEY didn't think I was capable of working based purely on being an aspie (no query about what I'm capable of, no taking into consideration the fact I've held down managerial/senior roles long-term and consistently outperformed my colleges in the past...in part because of being aspie - no, they just instantly decided being aspie meant I was 'mentally incapable' of working), so forced me onto ESA. I was refused ESA based on the assessment. Since getting back on JSA I've faced prejudice as they're trying to kick me off again, they don't take my disabilities into consideration at all, and I get no support what-so-ever as my disability adviser seems to find my asperger's funny and knows nothing about it let alone how to help.

Assessment for ESA asks questions based on physical disability/health and mental disability/health.
No criteria what-so-ever for neurological problems.
Most of us would only get any points within mental health, but even if you were to get points in every section of the mental health section that still would not be enough to qualify for ESA - to get enough points to qualify for disability benefits you have to be both mentally and physically disabled to the point of sitting in a corner rocking back and forth...but then of course if you can sit for long periods of time in a corner, that obviously means you're capable of working in an office role, so again will get refused ESA.

Consider the questions such as "You can usually cope with change" - usually? A particularly good question is this; "You usually get on with other people and no not cause them distress" - I don't usually get on with people, but I don't cause them distress....I think it's safe to say most of us on the spectrum don't get on with other people well, some of us can't even talk to our co-workers half the time, and often in the work place this is a source of friction so much so that it can often cost us our jobs...but because we don't can't THEM distress (hey, sods to whether or not it causes US distress to be around other people!) we'd not get a point on this question.

I was forced into a work trial a while ago, not only was it in a call centre where I wouldn't have been able to do the job anyway, the place was dodgy...so much so that even the New Deal people who sent me their agreed that it was not suitable for ANYONE to work there given as what they were doing was illegal. Between that and not knowing whether I was allowed to refuse to do certain [illegal] things that without losing benefits, I had a meltdown...they asked me not to come back, specifically they lied about me so they had a reason to refuse to let me back and it made me look like I was refusing to be there. Specifically my ASD meant they stopped me from working in that job, so obviously to some degree ADS prevents me from working - surely this evidence is worth more than these ridiculous questions?

All the questions are like this, for people with asperger's there are no hard and fast rules about what we are or are not capable of doing in specific situations. It may be that we can work in one type of job but not another, or it may be that we can cope perfectly fine with the day to day but get us into a working environment we would just not be able to cope - the criteria of benefits like ESA is a joke, more so for us.

You then have the general uselessness of such assessments - "Do you go on Facebook" - AKA can you use a computer, if yes then you can work in an office job, "Do you watch TV?" - AKA you can sit for long periods of time, if yes you can work as a receptionist. My mother is an example of a physically disabled person who was screwed over by the system when she applied for disability benefits with a bad back. She was able to go to the local shop for food, thus she wasn't disabled enough for disability benefits - didn't matter that this 10 minute walk was agony and enough to put her in bed for a week, or that if she didn't go she'd starve as no one else could go for her. She was expected to work in a shop, with heavy lifting, despite barely being able to walk, because these assessments are total nonsense.

I got ZERO points in my ESA assessment, in all fairness I can work but certainly having asperger's seriously limits my ability to work, and it effects my day-to-day life significantly, as such I should have scored something. The Citizens Advice Bureau found it amusing that I was 'too disabled' for JSA but 'not disabled enough' for ESA - we're being forced out of all benefits, we are falling down the cracks for sure.

I don't want extra money - even though living on £40 per week is almost impossible, my life is on hold, debts are rising, etc. and more so when I went two months without any benefits when I switched from ESA to JSA and the job centre and DWP staff were too stupid to do it correctly. All I want is help back into work. I am more than capable of working, but I struggle with the phone and interviews, the job centre had me applying for call centre jobs for over two years and they refuse to help me determine what jobs I can do, I have no references so can't even apply for voluntary jobs and was [wrongfully] fired from my last job so have no idea how to get a job yet job centre won't help.

Just as an extra boot to the guts - disabled people like us can get support from various other organisations such as Shaws Trust...but they only work with disabled people who are on DLA/ESA...if you are on JSA you're expected to be capable of doing everything everyone else is, if not then it's you being lazy not an issue of disability, but most of us can't get onto disability benefits to get the help we need.

Last edited by Bloodheart on 23 Feb 2011, 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I was on JSA for several years. I had no idea why no employers wanted to talk to me. I have a degree and lots of voluntary experience. This was long before I'd even heard of Asperger syndrome.

Meanwhile, I had the bullies at the Jobcentre asking me the same questions, and getting nastier and nastier about it until I eventually cracked and wound up suicidal.

I'm now in higher rate Income Support. The last time I got called in for one of their "medical assessments" it triggered a suicidal episode until my GP called them off.

I've since moved, and I have no idea if my GP is anything like as sympathetic. As things stand I have a diagnosis of Borderline Personality Disorder, with the AS not formally diagnosed, but AS would explain a great deal, and the self tests, unreliable as they are, show at the very least very strong Aspie tendencies.

I am dreading the new assessment. I know it's designed to get people with mental health problems on to JSA, not because they have any chance of getting a job, but because it's cheaper.

My mental position now is probably worse than it was around the time of the last assessment. BPD is treatable with therapy, although it's hard work and there is a long waiting list. I'll never be able to relate to humans. I'm almost constantly fighting the urge to end my life. The one thing stopping that is my partner telling me that if I kill myself it would destroy her too. I have no idea if she's telling the truth or if this is just to make sure it's not on her conscience (hopefully she won't read this or she'll either be or act hurt - I have no idea which.

Regardless, I do not expect to survive the new assessment. I have detailed plans for what do do when the letter arrives.

I just don't want to live in a world like this.

Niall, check to see what will be the case in Scotland, I think you guys will escape a lot of the sh*t aimed at England - certainly when it comes to NHS privatisation. Just wish someone would declare everything outside of Toryshire a separate country so we can be left in peace too.

You and me both. The world should not run for the rich and powerful alone.

The changes in benefits rules are the same. They piloted it in Aberdeen, I believe.

They just want people like me dead. It's easier for them. I just don't have a lot of strength left to fight them any longer.

Remember that while health was devolved to the Scottish Parliament, social (in)security was reserved to Westminster. We might survive the worst of the health cuts here, although the SNP adminstration still have to find a lot of savings!