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draelynn
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17 May 2011, 10:27 am

cubedemon6073 wrote:
Ask your husband these things.

1. Do the majority of people accept the way the world works?

2. If the answer is yes to 1 then couldn't it be possible that the world is the way it is because the majority accepts it as is and the majority feels hopeless to change it?

3. Ask him this as well. Couldn't it be possible that the majority accepting the way the world is and the hopelessness felt by the majority is the cause of why the world is the way it is?

4. Ask him is the majority happy with the way things are done? If yes, I ask why are they happy? If no, then I ask why don't they want to change it then if they are truly unhappy with present conditions?

We seem to have a chicken or the egg problem here.

Come to think of it he may agree with my logic but he may see the futility of it. One of my conclusions that I have come to is most people do not want to think. The parents who have remained on here more than likely does not mind doing some thinking.


#2 is very much in effect for him. His thinking is mainly NT but he does have some Aspie traits and to further stir that pot he is bi polar so the whole system is skewed in a rather irrational way. Especially where I'm involved. We do have a chicken and an egg problem but it's for a whole different reason.

I'm pretty sure you would get different answers of varying degrees no matter who you asked those questions. People may say they do like the way the world works but there always seems to be a 'BUT' tacked onto the end. Once you challenge people to think, they test the edges of their personal thinking and, in my experience, they step back from that edge back into their comfort zone. People are not, generally, comfortable with stepping out of the box. The box is safe. Personally, I deny the box existence. I'm uncomfortable every day of my life. If I can do it, so can other people.



draelynn
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17 May 2011, 10:53 am

psychohist wrote:
I actually agree with him that the world is not going to change for us, so when dealing with random strangers, we need to figure out how to adapt. I don't think that necessarily means reacting as a neurotypical would, but it may mean finding some other course besides our first impulses.

However, even if the world isn't fair, our loved ones should be fair. When dealing with loved ones, there needs to be compromise or at least understanding. And between parent and child, I think the reality is that the parent, being more emotionally mature, needs to do more of the adjusting.


I agree as well. I tend to see little tiny details but also the huge vast picture. Humans are the way they are because it works for them. That doesn't mean that our social rules are the most advantageous or beneficial. The human capacity for war and hate is testament to that. But science is also proving with increasing frequency that evolution can happen in fits and starts - entire traits can be changed in the course of a single generation. That is where my hope lies. I think people can change, not just for those on the spectrum but because open minded acceptance is in the best interest of the species as a whole. In the meantime - while that seeming impossiblity works its magic - we need to learn how to work with the rigid, fixed thinking of those around us. And I very much do believe that is the case even though those with AS are considered the 'fixed' thinkers. We need to learn to adapt and 'fit in', changing our entire mindset to make the majority more comfortable with what they see as uncomfortable differences. Stimming scares them so they seek to eliminate it rather than understand why it happens and the importance it has to those that do it. We do need to curb ourselves in order to make others more comfortable - but let's call that what it is. It is adaptive behavior for their comfort, not ours. Our comfort would include acceptance of who were are just the way we are - we wouldn't need to change who we are in order to be acceptable.

Honestly, I would like to hold my loved ones to a higher standard at home but, alas, they are also human. And adulthood does not instantly confer emotional maturity. So, I agree with you and try to live by that standard myself but it is not something I can not force on those around me or even really teach. It has to be learned individually by those who recognise the need in their life to do so.



anni
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17 May 2011, 5:36 pm

I've never known my son to lie, although it may have happened at some point I guess. He's more inclined to misrepresent how well he understands certain things in order to "fit in" with society. I had issues with a teacher back when he was in 2nd grade. She believed that he was lying about needing to go to the toilet. She thought he was asking to go too often, and started refusing his requests to be excused. The first I knew about this was to have her storm up to me after school one afternoon and do the "Do you know what your son did today?! He wet his pants!" She then explained that he was asking to go to the toilet frequently. It took me a while to figure it out, but I finally got to the bottom of it. He was feeling very pressured in her class, and the toilet thing was real, but it was about anxiety levels rather than physiological. It was his body's way of getting him away from an unacceptable level of stress. I had to get the principal to intervene after observing her teaching style for myself for a few days. She was young and inexperienced and sometimes seemed to be intentionally cruel to the children in her class.

She actually was a very poor teacher, the worst one we encountered in the small catholic school my children attended. It was due to her neglect of my daughter on a school camp that I finally pulled my children out of that school and sent them to a state school. It was a brilliant decision as it turned out. From the first day in the state school, all of my children would come home excited and full of news about their day, which had been sadly lacking while in the catholic school. With class sizes of between 30 and 35 children in each class, my children spent a great deal of time just waiting for things to happen.



Roman
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17 May 2011, 11:24 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
Ask your husband these things.

1. Do the majority of people accept the way the world works?

2. If the answer is yes to 1 then couldn't it be possible that the world is the way it is because the majority accepts it as is and the majority feels hopeless to change it?

3. Ask him this as well. Couldn't it be possible that the majority accepting the way the world is and the hopelessness felt by the majority is the cause of why the world is the way it is?

4. Ask him is the majority happy with the way things are done? If yes, I ask why are they happy? If no, then I ask why don't they want to change it then if they are truly unhappy with present conditions?

We seem to have a chicken or the egg problem here.

Come to think of it he may agree with my logic but he may see the futility of it. One of my conclusions that I have come to is most people do not want to think. The parents who have remained on here more than likely does not mind doing some thinking.


When I read these questions I can't help but to think that NO ONE will say they are happy with the way world works unless they are completely ignorant. The "world" includes Islamic terrorists; few decades ago it included Nazis and communists; and the list goes on and on.



Roman
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17 May 2011, 11:35 pm

draelynn wrote:
In the meantime - while that seeming impossiblity works its magic - we need to learn how to work with the rigid, fixed thinking of those around us. And I very much do believe that is the case even though those with AS are considered the 'fixed' thinkers.


Could it be that both AS and NT-s are "fixed thinkers" to the same extend. The only difference is that members of minority are the only ones who are asked to change; thus, the "fixed thinking" of the minority is the only thing that is being noticed. Perhaps if in a different planet the majority are aspies, then "fixed thinking" would be considered a trait of NT-s in that planet.