Is homosexuality a form of autism/wiring?

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Thom_Fuleri
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13 Oct 2011, 5:00 pm

<-- Homosexual and autistic. Chose neither.

Here's a curious theory for you. The idea that homosexuality is a brain wiring issue is pretty likely - I remember reading an article in New Scientist involving brain scans. Those of homosexual men are more like those of heterosexual women than heterosexual men, and those of homosexual women are more like those of heterosexual men than heterosexual women. Basically, lesbians think like straight men and gay men think like women.

Of course, it's a lot more complicated than that. But this is where it gets interesting.

I'm also aware that far more men are diagnosed autistic than women, and that generally women are less severely affected by autism. So I've often wondered - if my homosexuality means my brain works more like a woman's than a man's, would my autism be worse if I was straight?



AstroGeek
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13 Oct 2011, 8:10 pm

Thom_Fuleri wrote:
<-- Homosexual and autistic. Chose neither.

Here's a curious theory for you. The idea that homosexuality is a brain wiring issue is pretty likely - I remember reading an article in New Scientist involving brain scans. Those of homosexual men are more like those of heterosexual women than heterosexual men, and those of homosexual women are more like those of heterosexual men than heterosexual women. Basically, lesbians think like straight men and gay men think like women.

Of course, it's a lot more complicated than that. But this is where it gets interesting.

I'm also aware that far more men are diagnosed autistic than women, and that generally women are less severely affected by autism. So I've often wondered - if my homosexuality means my brain works more like a woman's than a man's, would my autism be worse if I was straight?

It would be interesting if someone did a study of the severity of ASD in homosexual males and heterosexual males. It does seem like most of the people in the LGBT part of WP are fairly high functioning. I suppose that sample-sizes might be an issue though.



DerStadtschutz
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18 Oct 2011, 11:04 am

Ambivalence wrote:
DerStadtschutz wrote:
Dark_Lord_2008 wrote:
I believe homosexuality is a lifestyle choice people make in their life based on their environment and childhood upbringing. It is not like people have a gun held to their head forcing them to be a homosexual. People all have free will to decide whether or not they want to be homosexual, bisexual or heterosexual. People can change their sexuality just like changing a pair of shoes or clothes.

Our sexuality is a lifestyle choice. Just like making the choice of what shirt, shoes to wear or what food to eat or what to drink. We all have choices to make in our lives.


See, I don't believe that for a second.


Don't waste your time, Dark Lord is a self-confessed troll.


Ah... okay then, I'll have to remember that in the future.

Mushroo, you're welcome.

How can you CHOOSE what turns you on? Sexual arrousal/getting horny is a REFLEX. Just like you can't keep your leg from moving when the doctor hits it with that little triangular rubber mallet thing, you can't CHOOSE what makes your dick or nipples hard, or what makes your p**** wet.

You can find both sexes attractive and get turned on by both sexes. You can CHOOSE which sex you're going to pursue, but you can't choose which one turns you on in the first place. I feel that anybody who says it's a choice must be attracted to the same or both sexes and are either gay or bisexual but afraid to admit to that.

If sexuality was a choice, considering how much s**t homosexuals have to deal with for no reason other than that they are homosexuals, who the hell would CHOOSE to be homosexual? What benefit is there? Fewer rights, being ridiculed everywhere, parents disowning them, just generally being treated like s**t by most people, hated on by stupid religious fanatics, told they're evil, going to burn in hell and all that bs, forced to go to "gay camp" and other similar things, an attempt by the parents to make the gay just go away... WHO WOULD CHOOSE THAT? To suggest that it's a choice is nothing short of insanity as far as I'm concerned.



Radiofixr
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18 Oct 2011, 1:08 pm

there is another thing you cant choose and that is who has feelings for you back-I just had that happen to me recently-I had deep feelings for this person and because of my AS I have trouble expressing it and they always had a view of a difference in age being a problem and well I was thinking that as we hung out together more we would be more comfortable with each other and he would maybe realize that age is but a number as we are both on the spectrum and -bam he makes contact with someone and one date they go at "it" and he was only 3 years younger than me-well the age difference hang up he had went out the window right away-and he finally admitted to me that from the get go it wasn't an age difference problem it was because of my looks and personality.Talk about a kick in the self esteem and why wait a year to tell me its my looks when feelings on my part are getting stronger and be up front about it-he was up front right away with the person he went to bed with right away of his feelings on things and what he wanted.


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mushroo
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18 Oct 2011, 1:31 pm

DerStadtschutz wrote:
Mushroo, you're welcome.

How can you CHOOSE what turns you on? Sexual arrousal/getting horny is a REFLEX. Just like you can't keep your leg from moving when the doctor hits it with that little triangular rubber mallet thing, you can't CHOOSE what makes your dick or nipples hard, or what makes your p**** wet.

You can find both sexes attractive and get turned on by both sexes. You can CHOOSE which sex you're going to pursue, but you can't choose which one turns you on in the first place. I feel that anybody who says it's a choice must be attracted to the same or both sexes and are either gay or bisexual but afraid to admit to that.

If sexuality was a choice, considering how much sh** homosexuals have to deal with for no reason other than that they are homosexuals, who the hell would CHOOSE to be homosexual? What benefit is there? Fewer rights, being ridiculed everywhere, parents disowning them, just generally being treated like sh** by most people, hated on by stupid religious fanatics, told they're evil, going to burn in hell and all that bs, forced to go to "gay camp" and other similar things, an attempt by the parents to make the gay just go away... WHO WOULD CHOOSE THAT? To suggest that it's a choice is nothing short of insanity as far as I'm concerned.


Disagree a little bit. :) I think "being turned on" can be a Pavlovian response developed due to positive sexual experiences. A wonderful night of passion and orgasms with a man (or woman) and then you get turned on by the sight/touch/smell of that person, or others with similar attractive qualities. In other words I think that for many people, "I could never be turned on by a man/woman" could be "cured" by an erotic experience with the right partner. Of course I am not saying that people should do this, it is perfectly OK to stay in one's comfort zone.

I agree 100% that living in a homophobic society makes same-sex an unappealing choice for many. Part of this is a lack of positive queer role models (especially true for those of older generations). If your only exposure to queer culture is the "flaming" stereotype on TV then yes, it can seem like a ridiculous lifestyle choice. People with a more diverse and permissive social circle will be more likely to "experiment" I think. The hatred of gays you describe is sadly true in some places, but fortunately, in the year 2011, at least in some parts of the world, it is respected or even admired. I'm sure you have heard the word "Pride."

Social pressure is the number one reason why the ratio is so lopsided (90%/10% is one common estimate) in my opinion. In a hypothetical world where heterosexuality was taboo then I think this number would be closer to 50/50 or maybe even 10/90.



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21 Oct 2011, 2:19 pm

Most people are very quick to say that homosexuality and autism are in no way connected.

Nature has ways of weeding out the population, though.

I notice that many people on the spectrum are also asexual, this is very CLEARLY natures method of population control.

I also notice a lot of autistic traits in gay people. They may also have some traits that are the complete opposite of ASD behavior, but IME, I see more NT gay people who seem more like people on the spectrum than I see in the rest of the NT population.



MITcpu
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21 Oct 2011, 7:09 pm

I'm gay, and it certainly wasn't a choice for me. I don't think it's hereditary, but I do think it's biological. I haven't got any gay family members, but I did read that in families with brothers, each successive brother is more likely to be gay than the others. Curiously, that does not apply to sisters. Also worth noting is that I only have an older sister, although I rarely ever see her (I'm fifteen), and I don't have any contact with my father. However, a friend of mine has six (four older) brothers and lives with his father (not his mother) - so clearly homosexuality can arise with or without elder male influences. It seems to be pretty random to me, with the possibility of a few encouraging factors here and there.

I take issue with your statement that neurotypicals cannot deal with variation (although I've got paranoid schizophrenia - so I'm not certain that I could be considered neurotypical in any way except that I do not have autism).



AstroGeek
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21 Oct 2011, 8:49 pm

MITcpu wrote:
I'm gay, and it certainly wasn't a choice for me. I don't think it's hereditary, but I do think it's biological. I haven't got any gay family members, but I did read that in families with brothers, each successive brother is more likely to be gay than the others. Curiously, that does not apply to sisters. Also worth noting is that I only have an older sister, although I rarely ever see her (I'm fifteen), and I don't have any contact with my father. However, a friend of mine has six (four older) brothers and lives with his father (not his mother) - so clearly homosexuality can arise with or without elder male influences. It seems to be pretty random to me, with the possibility of a few encouraging factors here and there.

Don't necessarily assume that it is not genetic just because you don't have any family members who are gay. It could be a recessive gene, for example. Or a polygenic trait where you were the first one in your family to get all of the right alleles together. To provide a counterexample to your experience, I'm gay and so is my uncle. (One of these days I really need to get around to having a good conversation with him about things). Genetics are complicated, so I don't think anecdotes can be used as a way to judge.



Thom_Fuleri
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22 Oct 2011, 4:41 am

AstroGeek wrote:
Don't necessarily assume that it is not genetic just because you don't have any family members who are gay. It could be a recessive gene, for example. Or a polygenic trait where you were the first one in your family to get all of the right alleles together.


Another possibility that I've considered, and which may also apply to autism, is that we have a genetic tendency to be gay which gets "switched on" (probably in the womb). That is, there's a point in our development where the right conditions will trigger it, but it doesn't happen to everyone, and it only happens to those with that genetic makeup - hence the family trait.



Mxzysptlik
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02 Jul 2012, 3:40 pm

I often question are reasoning of homosexuality. Personally, I believe that sexuality is far more complex than simply gay, straight, or bisexual. For me, at one point in my life I was generally more attracted to women and then to men and now I'm back on women again. It's very odd actually, but it's just how I am lol



jcCoolidgejr.
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24 Jun 2017, 11:39 pm

Being Autistic is a natural occurrence.



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Sweetleaf
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25 Jun 2017, 9:37 am

I'd say both autism and homosexuality have to do with wiring....however homosexuality doesn't cause difficulty in functioning. A homosexual person could develop things like depression and anxiety or other mental issues if they are mistreated/bullied over it, or they've felt the need to hide it due to fear of judgement. But it doesn't come with things like sensory issues or executive function problems and other functioning issues autism comes with....autism is more of a disorder because it can negatively interfere with functioning but that's not the case with homosexuality.


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Sweetleaf
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25 Jun 2017, 9:52 am

jcCoolidgejr. wrote:
Being Autistic is a natural occurrence. Corruption turns people gay. No one is born naturally gay. Your trying to aquate real science with the gay agenda because those two things have nothing to do with each other.


Because there is so much science to support corruption turning people gay.... :roll:

Lol I suppose you better watch out for the corruption of the 'gay agenda' or you might wake up gay one morning....


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Sweetleaf
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25 Jun 2017, 10:07 am

As far as this idea that sexuality is a choice....I don't think it is, I mean I didn't choose to be heterosexual and I don't think I could turn myself homosexual. But even if it was a choice what would it matter? I don't think that would make it less legitimate.


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jcCoolidgejr.
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25 Jun 2017, 11:21 am

If you don't count increased rates of depression,drug use,anxiety,narrsasism, then ya, it doesn't get in the way of your life. Plus it isn't wired. All these people come out at like 23 or 17 or 34. It isn't the same in any way to Asphergers.



jcCoolidgejr.
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25 Jun 2017, 11:25 am

They CHOSE to open Pandora's box anyway.



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