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spongy
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27 Nov 2011, 4:15 pm

Apparently there have been some doubts about this so Im going to try to clear things for newcomers that may have similar issues.

This section is accessible to both males and females.

Its meant to be a place where females can feel free to discuss any issue they wish(as long as they are respecting the opposite gender which is a requirement on this site´s rules) and any male can give their input as long as they are trying to be helpfull/supportive.


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Angel_ryan
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28 Nov 2011, 9:49 pm

I do hope you closely monitor it though. A few years ago it was my first time posting on the women's form and couple of guys were being rude/disruptive. I ignored the forms after that till recently. In my recent post on here it was to a man that OPed something mildly but not over the top offending and his opinion was backed by another male poster. topic : Do autistic women? I'm not completely discouraged by this but I definitely won't open up as much because of the known or even potentially menacing lurking male presence. I've also discussed some sexual habits in another topic recently and was discouraged when a male quoted and commented on it. It was not something I wanted to discuss around men which is why I felt it was ok to talk about it on the women's forum.



spongy
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29 Nov 2011, 12:28 am

Angel_ryan wrote:
I do hope you closely monitor it though. A few years ago it was my first time posting on the women's form and couple of guys were being rude/disruptive. I ignored the forms after that till recently. In my recent post on here it was to a man that OPed something mildly but not over the top offending and his opinion was backed by another male poster. topic : Do autistic women? I'm not completely discouraged by this but I definitely won't open up as much because of the known or even potentially menacing lurking male presence. I've also discussed some sexual habits in another topic recently and was discouraged when a male quoted and commented on it. It was not something I wanted to discuss around men which is why I felt it was ok to talk about it on the women's forum.


We try to monitor every section.
However this place is too big and there are times when we miss things, for such occasions there´s a moderator attention thread on wrongplanet.net section where you can post about whatever thread you are having issues with/approach a mod about it and we´ll see what needs to be done.

Ive seen the do autistic women thread and I thought it was odd to say the least but there have been no formal complaints about it and we try to allow threads to continue until there are a couple of formal complaints. Having said that I´ll make other mods aware of your concerns about that thread right now and we´ll see what they think could be done about said thread.

You are free to chose not to open up but if you have seen the discussion about this on wrongplanet.net you´ll see that allowing males here has its reasons.
Ideally there´d be a males section not accessible to females and a female section not accessible to males, sadly alex took down the male section a while ago and not allowing males to post here would be seclusive and we are trying to make everyone feel welcome on this board at all times(a sign saying you cant access this board because you are x gender wouldnt help and as someone pointed out gender can be changed fairly easily on account settings and making this place secretive would mean a lot of males that dont care about what goes on here would come here to see what the hype is all about.)


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deconstruction
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29 Nov 2011, 12:50 am

Like I explained elsewhere, I'm against segregation and I don't see it as a solution to the problems. However, I do think women need to know men can not just access this forum but they can also post their comments.

We can argue about the double standards, but for some reason, women are often less ready to open about certain issues (particularly of intimate nature) than men (and, judging by these forums, this includes Aspie men). To take my example, I don't really care about letting everybody know about my tampon problems, but when I opened that thread I assumed only women would be able to see and reply to it.

I'm all for gender equality, but men and women often have different ideas about what's appropriate and what isn't. I don't know if men are more ready to open in L&D and Adult forums than women are, or maybe they assume most of the people here are males, I don't know. But I do know that many women (not necessarily myself, though) are not ready to open if they know males are watching.

Again, I am against segregation but this is certainly an issue. Take this "do autistic women" thread. I went "lol" at it, but it doesn't really belong here. I'm not blaming it on mods; I know you're busy and we should report the threads we find unsuitable. But the mere fact it was allowed for it to appear here kind of speaks about the need for this forum to be made more safe for females.

And don't get me started on constant sexism we see on a daily basis at some other parts of the forum (L&D, for example). Seriously, that forum sometimes seems like "Men's Discussion" forum, and not in a good way.

Sorry for the long rant. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm against segregation but I do think AS women deserve to have a forum on WP where they feel completely safe to open themselves. I have no idea how to make a compromise here, though.



spongy
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29 Nov 2011, 1:43 am

deconstruction wrote:
Like I explained elsewhere, I'm against segregation and I don't see it as a solution to the problems. However, I do think women need to know men can not just access this forum but they can also post their comments.
We can argue about the double standards, but for some reason, women are often less ready to open about certain issues (particularly of intimate nature) than men (and, judging by these forums, this includes Aspie men). To take my example, I don't really care about letting everybody know about my tampon problems, but when I opened that thread I assumed only women would be able to see and reply to it.

I understand previous misunderstandings because of the section´s inacurate description and I´ll try to contact alex about making a small change on the description that clears this,in the meantime hopefully this will clear things out a little and prevent further issues.

deconstruction wrote:
I'm all for gender equality, but men and women often have different ideas about what's appropriate and what isn't. I don't know if men are more ready to open in L&D and Adult forums than women are, or maybe they assume most of the people here are males, I don't know. But I do know that many women (not necessarily myself, though) are not ready to open if they know males are watching.

Again if anyone feels a certain comment, thread...(we have even discussed avatars a couple of times) is inappropriate you can contact a mod about it and see what can be done.
If its a female related issue it´d probably be best to approach hyperlexian since she´d probably understand your concerns best but anyone is free to apporach either of the mods on moderator´s attention thread first post

deconstruction wrote:
Again, I am against segregation but this is certainly an issue. Take this "do autistic women" thread. I went "lol" at it, but it doesn't really belong here. I'm not blaming it on mods; I know you're busy and we should report the threads we find unsuitable. But the mere fact it was allowed for it to appear here kind of speaks about the need for this forum to be made more safe for females.

That thread doesnt belong here and it isnt here right now. However current policy is to let any thread follow its course(as long as it isnt agaisnt the rules) until some members approach a mod about it. I was approached about it here, asked the other mods asap about it and the thread is now gone.

I understand that public complaints should be taken more into account but we see public complaints as a way of ganging up against someone and everyone can make a small mistake without realizing it(if its constant thing the member is asked to either stop or leave) so they usually arent welcome and we are trying to make members understand that.
deconstruction wrote:
And don't get me started on constant sexism we see on a daily basis at some other parts of the forum (L&D, for example). Seriously, that forum sometimes seems like "Men's Discussion" forum, and not in a good way.

Sorry for the long rant. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I'm against segregation but I do think AS women deserve to have a forum on WP where they feel completely safe to open themselves. I have no idea how to make a compromise here, though.

As for the sexism on L&D believe it or not things are starting to improve there.
I usually refer to it as a section with great potential(because we have quite a few members on healthy relationships that could offer great advice) but that is spoiled by a couple of members attitudes(which has lead to some of this members with great advice leaving because they were constantly attacked...).

Believe or not when I started as a moderator members would complain to other mods about me expecting them to follow the rule about making every member feel welcome regardless of their gender at L&D and things seem to have toned down a little.
I understand that there´s still quite some work to do there but I´ll be taking a break on a few weeks and I dont want to start doing any more changes there and make other mods deal with the complaints about it.

No need to excuse yourself about the length of your comment, I understand that you are just trying to improve things and we are trying to do a similar thing so any kind of input members have is more than welcome.


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Last edited by spongy on 29 Nov 2011, 1:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

Angel_ryan
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29 Nov 2011, 1:44 am

I don't even like to post on the love and dating thread because the guys can seem pretty rude at times. They pretty much own it. It's the last place I like to post. It's kind of sad that Alex took down the men only/ women only forms, I mean seriously most women don't like to talk about certain things in front of guys so to claim that this is the place where we can talk about that kind of stuff and making it assessable to the people we don't want to know about certain issues defeats the purpose of it's existence in the first place. Not only that but there is a higher prevalence of autism or at least diagnosed cases amongst men leaving us a minority. It's bad enough there still isn't total equality in society, we deserve some rights and privileges don't we? Especially since there are private things that Aspie women might not get all that much support with, it's probably refreshing to some to know there is a safe place to talk about those things with other women on the spectrum. We also are affected by our symptoms differently and it'd be nice to feel emotionally safe from talking about things the opposite sex is probably going to make fun of you for. NT guys or Asipe guys they can be pretty mean and incompetent when it comes to emotionally understanding a women and they are just going to come off the wrong way, why leave us with the hassle. What's a women supposed to do if she feels bullied by men in her life and doesn't want a male's input on an emotional subject. Sometimes I want to slap my brother upside the head when he tells me as I'm putting make up on that men don't care if I look pretty or not and that I'm just going to be yucky and sweaty when they're done. This thread is a nice example of misconceptions http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt178932.html Apergian females are normal?



Last edited by Angel_ryan on 29 Nov 2011, 2:40 am, edited 9 times in total.

spongy
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29 Nov 2011, 1:58 am

Angel_ryan wrote:
I don't even like to post on the love and dating thread because the guys can seem pretty rude at times. They pretty much own it. It's the last place I like to post. It's kind of sad that Alex took down the men only/ women only forms, I mean seriously most women don't like to talk about certain things in front of guys so to claim that this is the place where we can talk about that kind of stuff and making it assessable to the people we don't want to know about certain issues defeats the purpose of it's existence in the first place. Not only that but there is a higher prevalence of autism or at least diagnosed cases amongst men leaving us a minority. It's bad enough there still isn't total equality in society, we deserve some rights and privileges don't we?

You need to contact alex about it(theres nothing we can do) but as I stated previously I doubt he´ll be up for it because changing your gender online can be done in less than a minute and making this section only accessible to a certain gender would attract far more males that dont care about this section but would be interested on finding out whats so special about the closed area.

Just so you have an idea of how this works. A female member from here created a fb group for females to share their experience with certain female issues, she wanted to attract as many females as possible so the group is open. The first post in the group explains that any male member is more than welcome as long as they are respectfull to their issues and arent there to make fun of them... . Why did she do this? because if she hadnt her place would have been attacked by males that felt discriminated against(and they have a right to do so).

As for the misconception thing every one of us gets it. Ive seen threads that compared aspergers to sociopaths saying they are the same, threads about how all males are shallow because they dont want to date an overweight woman when there are males that prefer them, I could go on.


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Last edited by spongy on 29 Nov 2011, 3:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

deconstruction
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29 Nov 2011, 1:58 am

I will post my longer reply later (I'm sleepy now), but for the moment all I want to say is that I wouldn't mind if guys had their own forum to discuss viagra problems, best underwear for sensitive testicles, etc. I sure wouldn't go out there and disturb their threads.

This is NOT a pro-segregation comment. I'm just saying there are certain things that women don't like to discuss in a presence of males.



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29 Nov 2011, 2:28 am

Some would consider it talking the high road if there were both separate male and female forms I mean we use different bathrooms don't we? If a male wants to troll the female thread I think we'd weed him out pretty quickly not only that I'd be surprised if he wasn't murdered. I think any guy that did created a profile to view it would get bored pretty fast even if he wasn't trolling. If the guys have their own form they have no right to complain. If anything It'd make wrong planet stand out more positively because yes women are considered a minority in the autism community and we are different in general, but the males who created/monitor the site would get that right?



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29 Nov 2011, 2:49 am

Redacted



Last edited by nat4200 on 19 Apr 2012, 4:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

spongy
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29 Nov 2011, 3:25 am

Angel_ryan wrote:
Some would consider it talking the high road if there were both separate male and female forms I mean we use different bathrooms don't we? If a male wants to troll the female thread I think we'd weed him out pretty quickly not only that I'd be surprised if he wasn't murdered. I think any guy that did created a profile to view it would get bored pretty fast even if he wasn't trolling. If the guys have their own form they have no right to complain. If anything It'd make wrong planet stand out more positively because yes women are considered a minority in the autism community and we are different in general, but the males who created/monitor the site would get that right?

Thats the thing. Guys dont have their own forum.

So making a forum only accessible to a certain gender and leaving the other gender out would make wp stand out in a bad way because its clear discrimination against males.

Again I cant do any changes so you should be contacting alex and see if he is willing to do it but considering what I just said and that he has ruled out the possibility of a male board I doubt it´ll happen.

Also this site is monitored by females as well(as pointed out on my previous response to deconstruction you can approach hyperlexian for any concerns related to female issues because she is a female).


As for nat4200 suggestion the software of this forum is pretty outdated because alex isnt keen on changing it. If he hasnt updated it to any of the more current/more advanced ones and this doesnt require much effort from him I dont think he´ll be willing to tweak the current software to implement the changes you are suggesting.
However feel free to approach him and see how he replies.


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deconstruction
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29 Nov 2011, 3:48 am

I know I don't have a say in this, but I strongly oppose segregation. I don't think male members should be kicked out or treated as inferior in the women's forum. But seriously, guys, you don't have anything to offer in a discussion about tampons, so isn't it best to just ignore it? Also, if this is a women's forum, accept that your views and your needs and your privilege might not be of utmost importance here. Not in a way that you don't have a say in any discussion concerning women's issues, but that the fact you might find breast funny/interesting/strange isn't important in, say, a discussion about bras.

I (and this might be just me) wouldn't mind discussing my bra size in a forum that males can access, too. But I sure don't want to see anybody jumping in the middle of a conversation with a comment: "D cups?? Whooooo.... " or something.

Just to make it clear: I made up this example; it never actually happened. But I hope it illustrates my point.



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29 Nov 2011, 4:07 am

Well Ive made my views clear enough and this shall be my last post on this topic for a while(sent a notification about this discussion to the other mods to see if they are interested on keeping the discussion but Ive written half of the responses and I want to encourage an open discussion so I shouldnt be keeping such a close eye on this thread)

Please not that the OP makes a reference to supportive males that help with their contributions to the discussion(perhaps trying to explain some aspects of the male lifestyle that are being discussed here/ explaining that not all males are looking for the same thing when someone starts putting herself down because she cant fit achieve"standard" beauty...) and the one on your example is making an out of line comment that doesnt help with the discussion.

I understand that the discussions here are serious(unlike some threads in adult) and they should be treated as such by any of the posters here(wether male or female).

If you believe someone isnt able to grasp the seriousness of this board feel free to approach a mod about it and we´ll contact the member and ask them to remain away from this section/make helpfull posts


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deconstruction
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29 Nov 2011, 4:14 am

I was just giving an example of a bad and intrusive way to join the discussion. I sure never wanted to imply that all male WP members, or most male WP members are like this, or that male opinion is unwanted here.

Personally, I do think men can help with certain things and their opinion is valuable.



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29 Nov 2011, 4:28 am

when i began posting on this site, i did not take any notice of what forum a thread i was posting in was.
(i come to this site via "most recent posts", which is not ordered into forums (although the forum name is mentioned, it is not prominent)).

i accidentally posted in the womens section a few times, and very soon after, i was warned by pm that i should not post in the women's forum or the haven. i have tried to obey, and i have gotten used to reading which forum i am posting in now.

i am only posting here now, because it is not a "women's business" type of thread.



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29 Nov 2011, 9:12 am

nat4200 wrote:
spongy wrote:
You need to contact alex about it(theres nothing we can do) but as I stated previously I doubt he´ll be up for it because changing your gender online can be done in less than a minute and making this section only accessible to a certain gender would attract far more males that dont care about this section but would be interested on finding out whats so special about the closed area.


I don't know how valid this argument is that one can easily change gender in the preferences and therefore circumvent such measures is, if this were implemented it surely would probably keep most of us men out (surely any measure would be vulnerable to some deception based measure) but I do wonder if similar protection should then provided for (or at least considered for) areas such as "LGBT Discussion" and "Adolescent Autism Forum".

Perhaps though an alternative change to the forum software might be the addition of option/s to hide certain areas from search results like the "View posts since last visit" feature, it wouldn't prevent active lurking, but it would make it much easier for men (like myself) to respect the privacy of areas such as this one and not accidentally read your threads by mistake.

There's a saying that "Locks Are to Keep the Honest People Out" ;)


I like this idea

And yeah I'm going to seem a little discriminative towards men because I've been beaten by them, sexually harassed and psychologically abused as well. Lots of verbal abuse from my own family. Things that most people would consider inappropriate. My distrust does not apply to all men, but I also have not met a lot of understanding men. The fact that most men don't even act like they understand why women want certain privacy has much to be said. Men who'd take the time to complain about a women's forum being closed to them would only prove my point.