I'm Noticing a Trend, Here...

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You are wrong. Just because I can relate to these types of characters doesn't mean I am like them in any way.

Right. No offense meant, either way. I might have worded that with a bit too much bite to it, now that I read over it again...

Don't know about here specifically but that does sound a bit like what's happened with modern art and modern composition where beauty has been seen as tired/uninspired where ugly/absurd has been the new black for close to a century. I'm starting to think a lot of this comes from existentialist and nihilist philosophies, perhaps even an overextended association of 'beauty' with organized religion hence beauty is old fashioned and prohibitive? Possibly all of the above, add in that aspies tend to have - not always - plenty of darker life experiences (admittedly though seeing a Mozart come from us who writes very strong, steady, mentally healthy stuff would be inspiring).

No one is purely normal in any sense of the word, but what Zokk is speaking against are characters who are designed to be the antithesis of what our society considers "normal" or "good" just for the sake of shock value, pseudo-nihilism, or a fake sense of complexity and depth. A character who stands out in a few ways from the rest is acceptable, even desirable, but no one wants to read about a character who's a one-dimensional deviant in every conceivable way. I certainly don't; I might sympathize with characters who have been unfairly ostracized by society and are therefore regarded as abnormal, but these characters should have some quality that makes them likeable or at least understandable in order to work, and purely messed-up characters that only offend everyone's sensibilities don't achieve that effect.

I also might add that I don't really like stories where not only the protagonists are messed up or unlikeable but also everyone in the story's world. If protagonists must be unsympathetic, they should be balanced by sympathetic antagonists. I need characters that I can root for in order to emotionally invest in a story. Completely negative stories don't give me that. They just scream of pretentious pseudo-nihilism and pointless weirdness.


Honestly, the vast majority of "modern" art is created only to befuddle and irritate people as far as I'm concerned.

What you are talking about is the 0815 Hollywood s**t^^
Especially movies of the 80s and 90s have been that way but since after being used to the hero, the constant appearance of a deus ex machina and the happy end nobody has seen a reason to watch movies anymore so Hollywood had to develop. You know, why should I watch a movie when I anyway know that there'll be a happy end? why should it give me a thrill when I anyway know that the deus ex machina will save the situation, the typical cliffhanger, the typical Arnold Schwarzenegger or Sylvester Stallone, that's totally boring!
We have developed and need to have interesting characters such as interesting stories instead of a fruit salad of cliffhangers and soft porn- sex scenes.
The only format that still includes all those things is the children TV.
I haven't read any of the books and stories posted by members here and I doubt that many of them would be worth to be read but I just don't think that anybody is interested in reading something normal. We have the normal aspect of life everyday, people who watch movies or read books mostly haven't got the intention to continue with that when they dream.

See, I wouldn't know about that. I don't read things with no depth to them. Perhaps that's why I didn't understand what the thread was about.

This. This exactly.

What is your problem exactly? So instead of interesting characters you want boring "normal" ones? Who are you to decide what is normal? Normal = boring. People like stuff they can relate to.

No one? there is no possible way you could know that. What qualities would make them more likeable exactly? So if someone is messed up they are unlikeable?

It's gets on your nerves? really? really? get over yourself. mentally stable and physically capable characters are boring, it's much more that just parental abuse or abandonment, or got into drugs, alcohol and sex at an early age too. I do not want to read about someone who is supposedly 'perfect' and 'normal' and what do you mean by like everyday people? A lot of everyday people are not as normal as you may think.

Well for me personally I relate better to the dysfuncitonal characters with dark and troubled pasts.........so yeah those tend to be the characters in movies I identify with. I don't have much in common with the normal protagonists that led relatively normal lives and grew up in a relatively normal family so I don't relate much to those characters.

I don't really see anything wrong with that sort of preference if you like the 'normal' protagonists better no ones stopping you from that. so why does it get on your nerves if other people prefer the characters with a dark troubled past?

So wait lets get this straight, if someone can relate to one of these broken characters that automatically makes them a self destructive maniac? I think its you who's being a little bit extreme here.

oh crap reading the past few threads on this page makes me think this was a bit unessisary, looks as if it was already adressed.

Last edited by Sweetleaf on 28 Dec 2011, 1:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I don't see how a dark and troubled past is always necessary, but if the character is fairly normal he/she should at least be challenged. A character that never has their perspective and values challenged by anything makes a boring story.

Certainly true, but that doesn't mean 'normal' characters can't have legitimate character arcs. I'd give examples, but it seems that no one cares if I elaborate on a point or not.

I see nothing wrong with normal characters........I just tend not to relate to them very well at all. But movies/books where a mostly normal individual ends up going through some crazy book/movie plot and ends up learning and changing their perspectives and such because of it can be entertaining I just don't tend to relate to those characters as well as I relate to those who have a more abnormal darker past as its kind what I've had.

Define normal.