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Tyri0n
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21 May 2013, 12:11 am

It may not have always been this way, but in modern society, gender equality is a nearly universally accepted value. It's not going way, so the only reason to resist it is if one has a strong incentive to resist it. Those who reject equality tend to be either (1) religious nuts (male and female in equal numbers) or (2) sexually frustrated losers (mostly male).

Getting laid is a primary and common human activity. It is not an accomplishment, like getting into Harvard, so MRA's and other opponents of gender equality--mostly comprised of ugly sexually frustrated dudes--are the weakest of the weak. Those men who resent feminism tend to do so because they themselves are losers in the system. But not all men are losers in the system. You don't see Wall Street bankers (70% male) complaining about feminism. Most of the top paying jobs and politically powerful positions still belong to men (80% of the Senate for example), and most powerful men have no problem either getting laid or getting all people, including women, to be subservient to them. It follows, hence, that those men who have an incentive to complain about feminism or gender equality are those left behind.

The complainers are the minority of men who are losers in the system, and therefore, this type of complaining is almost always a sign of being weak and a loser.



Last edited by Tyri0n on 21 May 2013, 1:08 am, edited 2 times in total.

1000Knives
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21 May 2013, 12:18 am

Yep, weakness=unadaptability. You are correct. I suck.



mds_02
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21 May 2013, 12:28 am

I mostly agree. The only issue I have is that you equate distaste for feminism with misogyny, with being against gender equality.

One can be all for equality, but still take issue with some of the cornerstones of feminist ideology and find the movement itself to be needlessly divisive.

But I do agree that blaming one's personal issues, one's own lack of success in the world, on an entire class of people is a sign of weakness. Be it misogynists blaming women, racists blaming other races, or whatever.



Keni
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21 May 2013, 12:59 am

Many original MRA activists had issues with a nasty ex-wife and were looking for support in child custody issues.
It seems to have degenerated into a bitter mass of
Oog the Neanderthal, Hannibal-the-not-at-all-psychotic, and Ivor Biggun of the badly wielded sword.



The_Face_of_Boo
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21 May 2013, 1:06 am

What's MRA?

Magnetic Resonance Angiogram?

Marketing Research Association?

:lol:



Keni
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21 May 2013, 1:21 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
What's MRA?

Magnetic Resonance Angiogram?

Marketing Research Association?

:lol:


From what I've seen, its "Misogynists Reacting Asininely"



The_Face_of_Boo
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21 May 2013, 1:24 am

Keni wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
What's MRA?

Magnetic Resonance Angiogram?

Marketing Research Association?

:lol:


From what I've seen, its "Misogynists Reacting Asininely"


Ahh...

I see...

You mean something like..


^^^
BURN THE WITCH!!

:lol:



Declension
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21 May 2013, 2:30 am

It's a nasty way of putting it, but you might be onto something.

I think we need to add a couple of caviats:

(1.) Lots of men are "losers" in the "game" but they don't blame feminism for it. Maybe they blame themselves, or maybe they don't blame anyone at all. You are in danger of offending these unsung heroes who have every reason to transform into swivel-eyed MRAs but choose not to.

(2.) There is a subspecies of MRA who have indeed gotten laid, but became MRAs because of a nasty breakup. This type might even still get laid regularly, but they probably do it by using creepy "Pickup Artist" tactics.



blue_bean
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21 May 2013, 4:48 am

I'm getting cynical about equality arguments on both sides of the fence. Equality to me is starting to look like getting a "1 up" over the other. Agendas seem to be more geared towards taking away, dismissing and attacking the other's rights more than positively advocating for their own. This is why gender debates here and elsewhere kinda piss me off. It's always negative, bitter, belittling and non-productive, and it's always at the expense of making someone feel like s**t because they have a penis/vagina/whatever.

On WP to date I've not seen anyone state any parts of the opposite gender's rights movement they support.



blue_bean
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21 May 2013, 4:52 am

And if you agree to the above post you better be doing so with self reflection.



Greb
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21 May 2013, 5:45 am

Years ago, I had a flatmate who was around 50 years old. He was quite a nice and common guy, the opposite of the violent badass type. After paying the loan of the house where her ex and their daughters lived, after paying the generous pension for her daughters maintenance he had barely no money for himself.

Yeap, he was not specially brilliant, had a normal job, not such a big salary. He was not one of this Wall Street guys. He was a loser, isn't it? If he would have been one of this powerful guys with loads of money, then he would had nothing to complain about.

That could even be a Beatles lyric: "Oh, f*****g losers, with their low middle class jobs, they're kind of disgusting, aren't they?"

Then what is this about? "Look at those powerful guys, they don't complain about feminism". If you just reached to belong to middle class, or low class, how do you dare to complain? Oh, f*****g loser, you don't the right to speak. You barely have the right to live.

Sometimes the current values in the society make me sick. And so do some unempathic feminist attitudes. Not because of the gender equality request, but because of the individualistic values that wrap those requests and come as a pack.

Losers have the right to complain too. Not everybody is meant to be a Wall Street guy. Not everybody is meant to be brilliant. The world if full of drab people that are honest and do their best. The world if full of nice guys that finished last and losers with a golden heart. Haven't they the right to complain? Haven't they the right to rise their voice when they think that something is not fair?


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Jono
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21 May 2013, 7:10 am

The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
What's MRA?

Magnetic Resonance Angiogram?

Marketing Research Association?

:lol:


It's supposed to stand for "Men's Rights Advocate", I believe.



Jono
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21 May 2013, 7:11 am

blue_bean wrote:
I'm getting cynical about equality arguments on both sides of the fence. Equality to me is starting to look like getting a "1 up" over the other. Agendas seem to be more geared towards taking away, dismissing and attacking the other's rights more than positively advocating for their own. This is why gender debates here and elsewhere kinda piss me off. It's always negative, bitter, belittling and non-productive, and it's always at the expense of making someone feel like sh** because they have a penis/vagina/whatever.

On WP to date I've not seen anyone state any parts of the opposite gender's rights movement they support.


Yes, I've seen that as well.



MCalavera
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21 May 2013, 7:12 am

Declension wrote:
There is a subspecies of MRA who have indeed gotten laid, but became MRAs because of a nasty breakup. This type might even still get laid regularly, but they probably do it by using creepy "Pickup Artist" tactics.


I don't even think it's just "some". Most outspoken MRAs I've heard of have been in relationships and sexual activities with women. Also, MRA is not equal to misogyny (that's like saying feminism = misandry).

This thread seems like it was made a power trip of some sort ("I'm strong, you're weak").



eric76
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21 May 2013, 7:28 am

I used to know one strident feminist who would wear clothes that always reminded me of a clownish caricature of men's suits. I've seen many other women in appropriate and nicely done business attire, but she's the only one who I ever saw wear anything like that.

It was as if she thought that she needed to wear something resembling men's suits in order to be on the same level.

Even stranger was that she didn't actually have a job except briefly. I saw her in other places on a number of occasions and she never wore them elsewhere.



SaveTigers
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21 May 2013, 8:07 am

mds_02 wrote:
I mostly agree. The only issue I have is that you equate distaste for feminism with misogyny, with being against gender equality.

One can be all for equality, but still take issue with some of the cornerstones of feminist ideology and find the movement itself to be needlessly divisive.

But I do agree that blaming one's personal issues, one's own lack of success in the world, on an entire class of people is a sign of weakness. Be it misogynists blaming women, racists blaming other races, or whatever.


One of the most intelligent, reasoned posts I've seen anywhere! Thank you!