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btbnnyr
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12 Mar 2015, 2:03 am

starkid wrote:
btbnnyr wrote:
I think peer pressure is like League Girl describes, more of an implicit copying and conforming to a norm that is determined by most of the people behaving similarly. It is not only someone purposefully trying to convince others to do certain things.


Norms don't even exist unless people expect them to be followed. Expecting people to conform can be explicit or implicit, but if there's no push from other people to do something, then there's no peer pressure. There has to be some kind of social "pressure," otherwise the term doesn't even make sense. What's pressuring about people just copying others because they want to?


A person can feel peer pressure or social pressure if they find that all the other people around are doing something, then they copy the others and do it too. That is conformity to group behaviors. It is probably driven by implicit social cognition without requiring anyone to try to convince the person to act like they do. It's like that study with the researchers pretending to be subjects giving wrong answers to obvious questions, then the real subject starts to copy their wrong answers after awhile without anyone pushing them to do it.


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12 Mar 2015, 2:15 am

btbnnyr wrote:
A person can feel peer pressure or social pressure if they find that all the other people around are doing something, then they copy the others and do it too.


I agree, but I'm just saying that the feeling of peer pressure, or imagining being peer pressured, is not actual peer pressure. A person can feel pressure and think that other people care how they act and be wrong. Peer pressure is when people actually exert some kind of pressure on someone; it's an act by the people doing the pressuring, not a feeling or a thought of the person who might be pressured.

social pressure by members of one's peer group to take a certain action, adopt certain values, or otherwise conform in order to be accepted.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ ... ref&ch=dic


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ImAnAspie
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12 Mar 2015, 2:18 am

Rocket123 wrote:
ImAnAspie wrote:
Joe90 wrote:
I act differently depending on who I'm with though.


But is it something you do consciously or does it just happen?

I act differently, mostly depending upon the environment. As an example, I act entirely different at work than at home. For me, this is definitely conscious. I am curious what the significance of that (being conscious or having it just happen) is.


My sister was the crankiest, most aggressive person you could meet but whenever she got on the phone to our Grandfather, she'd put on the most sickly sweet fake high pitched sucky crawly voice you've ever heard. That fake falseness used to make me want to vomit. After she got off the phone, suddenly, Miss Hyde would come out again. I used to tease her about it because I couldn't stand her 'fakeness'.

Anyway, all of her sucking up was in vain. She sucked up to him all those years and when he died, he didn't even leave her a brass razoo - and wasn't she peeved to say the least :)


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Sherry221B
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12 Mar 2015, 5:22 am

League_Girl, thank you for sharing your experiences. I did not know people do these things. I have not experienced the things you describe, unfortunately.

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they think how you act home is how you will act at work
This does not make sense to me. I did not know about this saying, but I think that, for work environment you just have to fulfill your work duties and meeting your boss expectations. I do not think that changing the way you act, the way you are like is not even necessary. I do not have such rules....Besides, I express myself differently. I have always found myself, that in order to attempt that my message is understood, I have to simplify, and lower the vocabulary.

I would not like to be like certain individuals, and never had the desire to mimic them. I do not know at the moment if I ever expected someone to react like myself. Well, while it is true that you cannot go back to the past to amend mistakes, you can learn from them. I do not understand why to get upset about it.

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Maybe they do it because they feel if they don't they will be judged and not liked by other kids. Like kids might not stand up for a victim who is being bullied because they don't want to be bullied so they ignore it and turn their backs. I also read kids bully because they feel if they don't, they will get bullied and I have also read online that sometimes kids might not be friends with someone because they don't want to get picked on for it so that is one of the reasons why we tend to be outcasts.


Where did you read this information?

Quote:
I was being like them, they would think I was just as good as them and stop thinking of me as stupid and I would be liked more and have more friends and not be weird anymore. My mom calls this all being literal and some might call it peer pressure or being badly influenced.


In my case, I wished to be left alone and being able to do the things I like.



Kiriae
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12 Mar 2015, 9:47 am

League_Girl wrote:
When I was a kid I would act different too at places because I was aware of the rules. I was aware my school had rules that were different than I had at home so at school I didn't do things I could do at home I wasn't allowed to do in school. When I was seven I discovered I was allowed to scream in school so I always did but at home I didn't. Then one time I decided to start doing it a home and my mom put a stop to it and I apologized and said it was school behavior. My mom sure learned I was in the wrong teaching environment and I needed to be in mainstream where I could be with normal kids and learn appropriate behavior. When I was eight, I would go to school and use words I wasn't allowed to use at home because I was that literal. I didn't know, my mom's rules applied everywhere. I would go to school and do school rules and school behavior and go home and do home behavior and follow my mom's rules. I didn't even know NTs did this too until I was an adult but for them it might be for a different reason while for me I was just being literal and it was about rule following. I copied behaviors which is what all kids do but for me it was an issue because I didn't understand what I was doing and my mom always had to figure out what caused my behavior because most of the time it was learned behavior. I was a copycat.


I was even worse. For me rules were situation specific and short lasting. The rule "don't interrupt when adults are talking" applied while parents were arguing but not when they were talking with a friend or when teachers were talking. The rule "don't jump on bed" applied only for a few minutes after grandma said it but not the next time I wanted to jump. And "don't sit on the window sill" never applied.

I was reminded about the rules all the time but unless I understood the rule as something other than "Stop doing it because it is currently pissing me off" and agreed with it I was ignoring it over and over.

I had to see a clear reason of the rule to follow it. For example I learned to stop using "bad words" when my mom explained to me that they "stink". I took it literally of course and smelled the air to see if it really stinks and it was since we were in a dirty train. So I supposed that my "bad word" caused the smell. I was never using "bad words" after that because I didn't want to make the air stinky. :lol:

And if I knew the reason but didn't agree with it ("don't jump on bed because you will break it", "don't sit in the window or you fall out") I was arguing it's not right till I experienced it myself. 8)

There was no real difference between school and home for me. Situation specific rule was situation specific. There was no classrooms or school halls at home so why should I follow school rules there?

Yet I never copied other kids. I was not breaking understood rules when adults were not around because I knew the reasons for the rules and considered other kids stupid. And during our free time classes in elementary school I was never playing with other kids. I was walking around schoolfield collecting bugs and stones when they were playing ball in spring/fall. And during winter when the schoolfield was frozen all kids were playing with snow or gliding together on the part of ice cleared by school I found my own spot of ice, cleared it myself and was gliding there, away from everyone.

I was immune to peer pressure (and adults pressure too :D) because I was always following what I personally considered right.



League_Girl
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12 Mar 2015, 11:28 am

Sherry221B wrote:
This does not make sense to me. I did not know about this saying, but I think that, for work environment you just have to fulfill your work duties and meeting your boss expectations. I do not think that changing the way you act, the way you are like is not even necessary. I do not have such rules....Besides, I express myself differently. I have always found myself, that in order to attempt that my message is understood, I have to simplify, and lower the vocabulary.



If you like to drink or like to party or sit around and play video games and you are a slob, you can't do that at work. You are there to work. Not goof around. This is changing the way you act. If you like to sleep in and you get a call for an interview, they may think you will be an unreliable worker because you were still sleeping when they called you so they don't call you back again for an interview. They don't realize that you'll adjust your sleeping schedule if you work.

You just mentioned how you have to change somethings about yourself to adjust in social situations and to your work settings.


Quote:
Where did you read this information?


I have an online friend who told me he bullied other kids and kids stopped bullying him because he knew the social cues how to do it and he told me most kids don't want to bully but they do because of peer pressure. it's the only way they survive to avoid being the victim. Members on here have wrote how kids were afraid to be their friend or would pick on them because they didn't want to get bullied. When I was a kid, I was too afraid to stand up for this aspie boy because I didn't want to get picked on and that was the last thing I needed. At least I was being left alone because the kids were too focused on him so it was a relief for me and it made me feel normal because just as long as that kid was around, I was left alone and "normal."

So this tells me not all bullies are sociopaths an I think that word is thrown around too much. I think peer pressure needs to be gotten rid of and rules need to be enforced more so kids won't feel pressured to fit in and to avoid being bully baits and that way the bullying is taken care of and stopped. We can't just try and get rid of the behavior alone by trying to punish the bully for it because that is like trying to treat the depression without trying to figure out why the person is depressed or trying to punish the behavior problem out of the kid without trying to figure out why the kid is acting that way in the first place, same goes with bullying and then take care of it.



Sherry221B wrote:
In my case, I wished to be left alone and being able to do the things I like.



Me too. One thing I noticed is kids who were actually ignored wished they were bullied while I wished I was ignored because I think that is better than being teased and harassed and called names and hearing how stupid you are or retarded and kids egging you to do things and pressure you and not back down until you do it and bam you are in trouble and not them and the staff doesn't care and they act like it was all your fault, same as for being taken advantage of.

Sorry if the quotes are messed up, I am not good at these things when there are quotes from more than one person.


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I have a quilt of labels. I had a language disorder and a speech disorder. Then communication disorder NOS. My other diagnoses have been Language Processing disorder, dyspraxia, SPD, OCD, ADD, Asperger’s, anxiety disorder, adjustment disorder, anorexia nervosa. My mom’s labels of me are: eating disorder, anorexia, social anxiety, PTSD, just being sensitive and having the victim complex when I was a kid. And of course she says I’m normal and says the only thing I had as a child was language. Huh? I must have been a shitty person then and maybe a difficult child I was who had to be labeled because of incompetent school staff and mean kids who didn’t accept differences and because I was trying to be “normal.” :/

My blog: https://mynoneabdlthoughts.wordpress.com/


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12 Mar 2015, 11:41 am

Kiriae wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
When I was a kid I would act different too at places because I was aware of the rules. I was aware my school had rules that were different than I had at home so at school I didn't do things I could do at home I wasn't allowed to do in school. When I was seven I discovered I was allowed to scream in school so I always did but at home I didn't. Then one time I decided to start doing it a home and my mom put a stop to it and I apologized and said it was school behavior. My mom sure learned I was in the wrong teaching environment and I needed to be in mainstream where I could be with normal kids and learn appropriate behavior. When I was eight, I would go to school and use words I wasn't allowed to use at home because I was that literal. I didn't know, my mom's rules applied everywhere. I would go to school and do school rules and school behavior and go home and do home behavior and follow my mom's rules. I didn't even know NTs did this too until I was an adult but for them it might be for a different reason while for me I was just being literal and it was about rule following. I copied behaviors which is what all kids do but for me it was an issue because I didn't understand what I was doing and my mom always had to figure out what caused my behavior because most of the time it was learned behavior. I was a copycat.


I was even worse. For me rules were situation specific and short lasting. The rule "don't interrupt when adults are talking" applied while parents were arguing but not when they were talking with a friend or when teachers were talking. The rule "don't jump on bed" applied only for a few minutes after grandma said it but not the next time I wanted to jump. And "don't sit on the window sill" never applied.

I was reminded about the rules all the time but unless I understood the rule as something other than "Stop doing it because it is currently pissing me off" and agreed with it I was ignoring it over and over.

I had to see a clear reason of the rule to follow it. For example I learned to stop using "bad words" when my mom explained to me that they "stink". I took it literally of course and smelled the air to see if it really stinks and it was since we were in a dirty train. So I supposed that my "bad word" caused the smell. I was never using "bad words" after that because I didn't want to make the air stinky. :lol:

And if I knew the reason but didn't agree with it ("don't jump on bed because you will break it", "don't sit in the window or you fall out") I was arguing it's not right till I experienced it myself. 8)

There was no real difference between school and home for me. Situation specific rule was situation specific. There was no classrooms or school halls at home so why should I follow school rules there?

Yet I never copied other kids. I was not breaking understood rules when adults were not around because I knew the reasons for the rules and considered other kids stupid. And during our free time classes in elementary school I was never playing with other kids. I was walking around schoolfield collecting bugs and stones when they were playing ball in spring/fall. And during winter when the schoolfield was frozen all kids were playing with snow or gliding together on the part of ice cleared by school I found my own spot of ice, cleared it myself and was gliding there, away from everyone.

I was immune to peer pressure (and adults pressure too :D) because I was always following what I personally considered right.



When I was in the self contained room when I was 6 and 7 years old and I was in there for only ten weeks when I was 8 after school started before I was put in my new school in mainstream, I noticed kids had different rules. The rules the teacher made applied to all of the kids but not to certain kids. I thought the teacher assigned rules for each kid and each kid was given a special rule to do things so I used to break them sometimes to see what I was allowed to do. One boy was allowed to yell 29 and then 39 whenever we were counting and whenever we got to a number with the nine in it, he would shout 59 and none of us were allowed to do that but him so saw he was allowed to do it because he is Samner. When I was seven I discovered I could scream and that was my special rule I had so I did it. One time I decided to tell a occupational teacher she is a butthead because I wanted to see if that rule applied to me like everyone else or if I was allowed to call people that so I made the sacrifice and got in trouble and saw that rule applied to me too. I sometimes tested my teacher's rules to see what I was allowed to do and not allowed to do because of different rules kids had. I even asked my teacher once if I could go potty because I wanted to see if that rule was still in place than the year before because she didn't tell us the rules again like she did the year before and I overheard her telling the new kids the classroom rules so I tested her to see if they were the same for me.

That was the problem in special ed and then in 6th grade my school wanted me in a behavior program and my parents said no way to that because they knew if I got exposed to those kids, I would start having true behavior problems because I would think it was normal and school behavior and then bring it home and realize it's school behavior.

I didn't understand as a kid how kids will break rules or how people won't follow them and I didn't understand about disorders and stuff as a child, it was all too abstract. It was either okay or it wasn't so if a kid broke a rule, I would get confused and then it would be hard to get me to follow that rule because I would argue about it and keep pointing out that kid did it but if he was stopped or got in trouble for it, then I wouldn't be confused.


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I have a quilt of labels. I had a language disorder and a speech disorder. Then communication disorder NOS. My other diagnoses have been Language Processing disorder, dyspraxia, SPD, OCD, ADD, Asperger’s, anxiety disorder, adjustment disorder, anorexia nervosa. My mom’s labels of me are: eating disorder, anorexia, social anxiety, PTSD, just being sensitive and having the victim complex when I was a kid. And of course she says I’m normal and says the only thing I had as a child was language. Huh? I must have been a shitty person then and maybe a difficult child I was who had to be labeled because of incompetent school staff and mean kids who didn’t accept differences and because I was trying to be “normal.” :/

My blog: https://mynoneabdlthoughts.wordpress.com/


Sherry221B
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12 Mar 2015, 12:22 pm

Quote:
if you like to drink or like to party or sit around and play video games and you are a slob, you can't do that at work. You are there to work. Not goof around. This is changing the way you act. If you like to sleep in and you get a call for an interview, they may think you will be an unreliable worker because you were still sleeping when they called you so they don't call you back again for an interview. They don't realize that you'll adjust your sleeping schedule if you work.

You just mentioned how you have to change somethings about yourself to adjust in social situations and to your work settings.


I think, that if you go to work, is to actually work, not do something else. In those cases, if someone was doing something else, it would be better to leave their job to someone who actually want it, and need it; because there are others who want to work, but find themseleves unable to find a job, for example, or things which prevent them from doing so. I have read about others doing things that are not realted to actually doing their job.

It is the same as with the university: you go there to study, and learn, and get your degree, not something else. I understand now what you mean on this; I was thinking about something else, thank you for your clarification. I was worried that you could have misunderstood me too...


I have read about others, who: ended up in a wheelchair because of an accident provoked, another one was thrown a bomb in a ball, and he had surgery on his hands because of it, another one got stabbed on the neck, because those who did it, they claimed that he looked at them funny. All kind of things like this can happen at anytime....





If they experienced it, they would not longer want it. Yes, what you describe here has also happened to me. I actually expected you to criticize for writing to want to be left alone as well... It is good that you get it. The prepared answer was: Well, if someone is mistreating me, I am not going to want to do anything at all with that someone. But, it is good that you understood. It is ok, maybe I should have written it better.



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12 Mar 2015, 3:41 pm

As Tony Attwood says... I'll paraphrase, he says wearing masks is a great way to fit in but it eventually becomes very exhausting and you'll never get any long term relationships with it because you can't keep the facade up forever and when that person sees what's really behind the mask, they'll be gone.

Keeping the mask on will eventually burn you out and that you're better off being the real you. Just say to NT's, "I'm the sort of person who..." and let them respect your honesty and like the real you and you'll like yourself much more for it... Or words to that effect. He describes it a lot better than I can.

There's a YouTube video he does on it. If you're interested, I'll provide the link in a later post. I'm going to have breaky now. I'm HUNGRY :pig:


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Sherry221B
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13 Mar 2015, 4:56 am

I do not know if that aspie boy was your friend or not...Anyway, what I would have done myself, is to go where the bullies where, and tell them to come after us, if they dare to do so. I would have not left him to go through that alone. I think that, experiencing a bad situation, it would be better to handle it if you were not all by yourself to deal with it. So, I would have defended him as soon as I saw them doing something bad to him. Then, it is not a mob against just one, but two against a mob of savages.

Yes, I agree that it is exhausting if you are not able to be yourself. As I wrote, I find it to be very depressing to not be allowed to be yourself. I know that part was not directed at me either; I just wanted to write about that, that I agree with Tony Attwood.



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19 Oct 2016, 4:09 pm

I can't tell the difference between tired, sick and angry and probably a couple other mental states that look similar to those. If someone is any of them I ALWAYS instinctively assume they are directly angry at me. Even if I logically know there's no reason they'd be mad at me, it just feels like its directed at me for some reason.

I can think of several times someone has said someone else looks tired or jealous and I've had to ask them "how can you tell that?".