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0_equals_true
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30 Sep 2015, 5:45 pm

Feyokien wrote:
The foes list function is broken Monstercrack and it only hides your foes comments from your eyes, it can't stop them from commenting.

It was never possible to do that as far as I'm aware, it is against the spirit of the site.



MonsterCrack
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30 Sep 2015, 5:47 pm

The Quran says to obey God and obey his messenger, and there are numerous sayings of the Prophet Muhammad endorsing obedience to him in all matters.



Feyokien
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30 Sep 2015, 5:47 pm

0_equals_true wrote:
Feyokien wrote:
The foes list function is broken Monstercrack and it only hides your foes comments from your eyes, it can't stop them from commenting.

It was never possible to do that as far as I'm aware, it is against the spirit of the site.


Actually it does, but only it only hides them when you're trying to post something and they post again before you can post in the tread, so it stops your post so you can see what was added before you could post. It's supposed to do that all the time, but it's broken.



Feyokien
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30 Sep 2015, 5:48 pm

MonsterCrack wrote:
The Quran says to obey God and obey his messenger, and there are numerous sayings of the Prophet Muhammad endorsing obedience to him in all matters.


Who is "him"? God?



MonsterCrack
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30 Sep 2015, 5:50 pm

"Him" is muhammad.



Feyokien
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30 Sep 2015, 5:52 pm

MonsterCrack wrote:
"Him" is muhammad.


MonsterCrack wrote:
there are numerous sayings of the Prophet Muhammad endorsing obedience to him in all matters.



The prophet Muhammad endorsed himself many times?



Aniihya
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30 Sep 2015, 5:53 pm

0_equals_true wrote:
MonsterCrack wrote:
Exactly they only follow the Quran, and leave out a large portion of the religion which is the sayings and moral example of Prophet Muhammad.


Which is open to speculation.

Even conservative sects pick which rulings and interpretations they consider correct. However Mohamed never actually endorsed these rulings.


Thanks, that was my point about Quranism. However no group is without it's flaw. The biggest problem of Islam is the sectarian infighting and the willful ignorance you can encounter.



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30 Sep 2015, 5:55 pm

Yes because not only was he the Messenger of God, but the Quran (which is seen by Muslims as the verbatim word of God) orders us to obey Muhammad. There is even a hadeeth saying that there will be 73 sects, and the only one that will be saved is the one that follows Islam like Muhammad and his companions... (sahaba)



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30 Sep 2015, 5:56 pm

Aniihya wrote:
0_equals_true wrote:
MonsterCrack wrote:
Exactly they only follow the Quran, and leave out a large portion of the religion which is the sayings and moral example of Prophet Muhammad.


Which is open to speculation.

Even conservative sects pick which rulings and interpretations they consider correct. However Mohamed never actually endorsed these rulings.


Thanks, that was my point about Quranism. However no group is without it's flaw. The biggest problem of Islam is the sectarian infighting and the willful ignorance you can encounter.

I agree, WAY too much bickering....



Feyokien
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30 Sep 2015, 6:02 pm

Does your choice in a more stricter version of Islam have something to do with you having issues with your more liberal fathers constant absence? Are you trying to be a better man than him? I think I remember correctly that you said your father is usually absent, where does he go and does it bother you that he's gone a lot?



Aniihya
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30 Sep 2015, 6:04 pm

MonsterCrack wrote:
Aniihya wrote:
0_equals_true wrote:
MonsterCrack wrote:
Exactly they only follow the Quran, and leave out a large portion of the religion which is the sayings and moral example of Prophet Muhammad.


Which is open to speculation.

Even conservative sects pick which rulings and interpretations they consider correct. However Mohamed never actually endorsed these rulings.


Thanks, that was my point about Quranism. However no group is without it's flaw. The biggest problem of Islam is the sectarian infighting and the willful ignorance you can encounter.

I agree, WAY too much bickering....


It annoys me the most when muslims accuse each other of being unbelievers. That is why I am worried about you joining Wahabis or Salafis because they do it the most.



Last edited by Aniihya on 30 Sep 2015, 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Aniihya
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30 Sep 2015, 6:09 pm

MonsterCrack wrote:
Yes because not only was he the Messenger of God, but the Quran (which is seen by Muslims as the verbatim word of God) orders us to obey Muhammad. There is even a hadeeth saying that there will be 73 sects, and the only one that will be saved is the one that follows Islam like Muhammad and his companions... (sahaba)


However hadiths are pretty much: "That is what he supposedly said" being written down more than 100 years after him leaving. The only reliable source of Muhammad's will is the Quran as he had written it. You don't believe everything someone tells you either, even if a great figure supposedly said it. It would be like believing someone who says: "Einstein once said that meat once grew on trees."



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30 Sep 2015, 6:33 pm

Feyokien, I think that might be it in part, but I think it is also because a lot of people in the Gulen movement community hate me and I have failed to get close to them, so I am trying to be different from them, kinda like how orthodox jews grow out the hair on the sides of their heads so as not to imitate the pagans... and yes, I've decided I'm not gonna be a salafi.... in part because of what I just said, and in part due to some methodological problems they have, such as taking the Quran literally (the athali school of theology says to follow the quran's "apparent meaning") as for Quranism, I don't know if I'll go that far, but I might.... because anniha brought up a good point about how they are not as reliable....



Aniihya
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30 Sep 2015, 6:48 pm

I am glad to hear that. I was just worried that you might rush into something you could regret. There are plenty of conservative groups that you could join, but the more radical groups aren't worth recommending. As a muslim from Kuwait once told me, "Allah gave you a brain for a reason, you should use it more often." He is right, I would agree that virtuous muslims should be thankful for what they are given by birth. If you don't just follow but also think, you could be a leader someday.



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30 Sep 2015, 6:57 pm

MonsterCrack wrote:
Feyokien, I think that might be it in part, but I think it is also because a lot of people in the Gulen movement community hate me and I have failed to get close to them, so I am trying to be different from them, kinda like how orthodox jews grow out the hair on the sides of their heads so as not to imitate the pagans... and yes, I've decided I'm not gonna be a salafi.... in part because of what I just said, and in part due to some methodological problems they have, such as taking the Quran literally (the athali school of theology says to follow the quran's "apparent meaning") as for Quranism, I don't know if I'll go that far, but I might.... because anniha brought up a good point about how they are not as reliable....


I can understand that, same reason I left Christianity for good, I never fit in with my community and a lot of people just didn't like me. There was also some political BS involved with the Methodist Church trying to use my father, who used to be an influential man in my old community, to get more people involved with the church. I can understand why you want to stay with religion, life can be hard without it, without the sense of security it gives especially when you're on your own, I know mine has been. Make whatever choice you have to make man, just do it for the right reasons.



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30 Sep 2015, 7:09 pm

Feyokien, if I do decide to join Quranism, how do I tell my father? As he always asks over the phone if Ive prayed my extra prayers? (Which aren't exactly "extra" according to most Muslims)? That presents an entirely different issue... Should I lie?