Page 1 of 3 [ 48 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

dianthus
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 25 Nov 2011
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,138

26 Jul 2016, 4:09 pm

androbot01 wrote:
To my mind he was avoiding the problem by ignoring a good solution.


I think the same way when I hear someone talking about taking medication for a problem that I think could be resolved without taking a pharmaceutical drug, with a lifestyle change or diet change or a natural remedy. But if they don't ask my opinion then it's really none of my business. People are different and what works for me might not work for someone else or vice versa.

I don't take any medications, other than an occasional mild OTC drug. For me they are ALL mind altering drugs. I don't like the way most medicines me feel, physically, emotionally, or mentally. Most have side effects I can't deal with. So the last thing I want to hear from anyone is how their favorite medication helps them so much or how it could help me too.

I feel like if other people choose to take medication and they feel like it helps them then good for them. But all the same I don't expect them to prescribe the same for me. Once they open that door then all bets are off. If it comes across as prejudice, it IS, because I am prejudiced for my own health and well-being.

Quote:
Is it truly better to have to move because of a ridiculous phobia than it is to take medication to deal with it.


That's pretty dismissive to call it ridiculous. It's understandable to see it that way, when you don't see the inner workings of a person's mind, but underneath even some of the strangest behaviors there is still a reason why their mind works that way. Sometimes phobias can be resolved in therapy. Or maybe he wants to move for some other reason, and his mind has to come up with a convoluted reason to act on it.

Medication for mental illness is best prescribed in conjunction with therapy and proper healthcare, by someone who knows what they are doing. But ultimately people need to seek their own treatment - and if they don't, unless they are completely non-functional or dangerous to others, then they have the right to decline any type of treatment they don't want.



dianthus
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 25 Nov 2011
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,138

26 Jul 2016, 4:13 pm

SteelMaiden wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
I took Prozac for years and it didn't do me much good, like a band-aid for a break.


Fluoxetine (Prozac) was like a sugar pill for me. No side-effects but no positive effects either. Even at 40mg/day.


Prozac made me feel overstimulated and wildly angry...and then I got suicidal and tried to overdose on it. All within just 2-3 weeks of taking it.



SteelMaiden
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,722
Location: London

26 Jul 2016, 4:19 pm

Pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics are interesting topics. As well as pharmacogenomics.


_________________
I am a partially verbal classic autistic. I am a pharmacology student with full time support.


kraftiekortie
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 4 Feb 2014
Gender: Male
Posts: 87,510
Location: Queens, NYC

26 Jul 2016, 4:24 pm

I hope you get into pharmacological research eventually, Steel Maiden. You'd be good at it.



SteelMaiden
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,722
Location: London

26 Jul 2016, 4:57 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
I hope you get into pharmacological research eventually, Steel Maiden. You'd be good at it.


Thank you.


_________________
I am a partially verbal classic autistic. I am a pharmacology student with full time support.


animalcrackers
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Feb 2011
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,207
Location: Somewhere

26 Jul 2016, 5:16 pm

androbot01 wrote:
That's his business, of course, but I couldn't help but wonder at his weighing of the pros and cons. Is it truly better to have to move because of a ridiculous phobia than it is to take medication to deal with it. To my mind he was avoiding the problem by ignoring a good solution. So, I left him to his anxiety and went back to bed.

But why do people not want to take medication for mental illness? Why do they think they will be less of who they are? I take a lot of meds and I find that I am able to be myself with them rather than being crippled by illness.


He may not perceive himself as crippled, or at least not as crippled as you may perceive him to be.

And different people weigh the pros and cons differently. Moving may, to him, be a much smaller thing than taking medication -- the fact that for you moving would be a way bigger thing than taking medication doesn't change that. Everyone is different. It's his life and his experience you're talking about, so he is the only person who can ever know whether or not taking medication truly is harder or a bigger deal for him than taking medication.

I would not assume he was "avoiding the problem" just because he rejected your proposed solution. Perhaps if there was a solution he was more comfortable with, he would try it.

androb01 wrote:
Does a person with high blood pressure become not as much themselves when they take pills to regulate it?


That's not necessarily a fair comparison -- high blood pressure medication may not have an affect on a person's mental state (not saying it never would, there are medicines used for both lowering blood pressure and dealing with neurological problems, like guanfacine .... anything that changes your body chemistry can have an effect on your mind), but psychoactive drugs are specifically designed to have such effects.

A person's mental state is often connected in some way to their sense of self, whereas their blood pressure likely isn't. So for some people it's a different thing to take a medication to deliberately change your mental state than it is to take a medication to change something else (even if the latter might end up having an unanticipated affect on your mental state.....probably any unintended psychoactive effect would be just one of many side effects you'd be hoping to not experience, if you wanted only to change your blood pressure and were perfectly happy with your mental state the way it was).


_________________
"Coming back to where you started is not the same as never leaving." -- Terry Pratchett, A Hat Full of Sky

Love transcends all.


Last edited by animalcrackers on 26 Jul 2016, 5:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

androbot01
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Sep 2014
Age: 53
Gender: Female
Posts: 6,746
Location: Kingston, Ontario, Canada

26 Jul 2016, 5:53 pm

animalcrackers wrote:
A person's mental state is often connected in some way to their sense of self, ...


This is what I am curious about, animalcrackers, where is the boundary between self and chemistry?



BeaArthur
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 11 Aug 2015
Posts: 5,798

26 Jul 2016, 6:01 pm

There have been doctrinaire opponents of psychiatry, such as Thomas Szasz, of whom Wikipedia states, "Szasz argued throughout his career that mental illness is a metaphor for human problems in living, and that mental illnesses are not real in the sense that cancers are real." I think he has done as much harm to progress in treating mental illness as Andrew Wakefield has done to eliminating communicable disease.

It's as misguided to state no one needs meds, as to state they can cure everything. The respectable practitioner and researcher acknowledges both perspectives and the fallibility, as well as the hope, of modern medicine. And the patient who wants to make a sensible choice needs to be equally broad-minded.


_________________
A finger in every pie.


RabidFox
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 21 Jul 2016
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 159

26 Jul 2016, 6:11 pm

I am terrified of centipedes. I would be searching the house too. They're the only thing I'm really afraid of other than spiders.

Should a person move if they're afraid of centipedes? Well, it depends on how bad the infestation is. If it's just a few centipedes and it's a one time thing, then, no, they shouldn't move. But if there's a ton of them and they just won't go away, yeah, I would honestly move.

Good thing the only pests I've had a problem with are mice and ants. I'm not afraid of either. Even after having seven mice in the house and an endless army of ants on the kitchen counters. It really bothered me that I had to use mouse traps. They usually kill the mice, which makes me feel horribly guilty. The ants? Nothing kills them. They seem to think they live here too. :D Those ants better be careful or I'm going to start naming them.



Last edited by RabidFox on 26 Jul 2016, 8:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

friedmacguffins
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 10 Feb 2010
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,539

26 Jul 2016, 8:29 pm

What about the stigma of mental illness.



dianthus
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 25 Nov 2011
Gender: Female
Posts: 4,138

26 Jul 2016, 8:59 pm

You made a lot of good points animalcrackers, well said.

animalcrackers wrote:
That's not necessarily a fair comparison -- high blood pressure medication may not have an affect on a person's mental state


And another reason it's not a fair comparison is because high blood pressure can kill. Getting up in the middle of the night to kill centipedes does not have a high mortality rate.

But going with the comparison, people who take medications like blood pressure medicine are usually advised to make lifestyle changes too. If the place they lived in was causing them stress, the doctor might suggest that they move.



BTDT
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Jul 2010
Age: 60
Gender: Female
Posts: 7,088

26 Jul 2016, 9:04 pm

Tenormin, a popular beta blocker for controlling high blood pressure, may also control anxiety--it is sometimes used to combat stage fright. It is also illegal for some athletes to use--you can't use it if you are an Olympic Archer.



androbot01
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Sep 2014
Age: 53
Gender: Female
Posts: 6,746
Location: Kingston, Ontario, Canada

27 Jul 2016, 4:49 am

Well, I am not belittling my roommate's phobia. He was really in quite a state and I don't think he slept in his room last night.
His experience is an example of a mental issue effecting a person's life. That's why I mention him.

I am still puzzled as to where the actual self begins and where one's chemistry is in need of modification. I wonder if in 100 years everyone will be chemically optimized to be the best they can be.

BeaArthur wrote:
There have been doctrinaire opponents of psychiatry, such as Thomas Szasz...

I don't think he could get away with such nonsense now that science has become more informed about the brain.

friedmacguffins wrote:
What about the stigma of mental illness.

Do you mean that if you take medication then you are admitting that you are ill and are open to stigmatization?



naturalplastic
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Age: 69
Gender: Male
Posts: 33,873
Location: temperate zone

27 Jul 2016, 5:16 am

RabidFox wrote:
I am terrified of centipedes. I would be searching the house too. They're the only thing I'm really afraid of other than spiders.

Should a person move if they're afraid of centipedes? Well, it depends on how bad the infestation is. If it's just a few centipedes and it's a one time thing, then, no, they shouldn't move. But if there's a ton of them and they just won't go away, yeah, I would honestly move.

Good thing the only pests I've had a problem with are mice and ants. I'm not afraid of either. Even after having seven mice in the house and an endless army of ants on the kitchen counters. It really bothered me that I had to use mouse traps. They usually kill the mice, which makes me feel horribly guilty. The ants? Nothing kills them. They seem to think they live here too. :D Those ants better be careful or I'm going to start naming them.


There are such things as bug exterminators.

If the centipedes in questions were actually real then her roommate should call the Orkin man.

If they aren't real then her room mate should call his shrink to refill his perscriptions.



TheSilentOne
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 10 Aug 2015
Gender: Female
Posts: 2,820
Location: Torchwood Three

27 Jul 2016, 7:27 am

My father was always against me being on medication. I think the whole "zombie" thing was the reason why. I think some people have an opposition due to the stigma about mental illness and people who take medication for it as well as some people who might be in denial about needing help and seeing if medication can help them. I know not all people react well to medication. I've been on anti-depressants and anti-anxiety medication since I was seven years old and have reacted well to most of my medications, I only had issues with a couple. The problem for me is that I build up a tolerance for them and then they stop working for me.


_________________
"Have you never seen something so mad, so extraordinary... That just for one second, you think that there might be more out there?" -Gwen Cooper, Torchwood


RabidFox
Snowy Owl
Snowy Owl

User avatar

Joined: 21 Jul 2016
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 159

27 Jul 2016, 12:30 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
There are such things as bug exterminators.

If the centipedes in questions were actually real then her roommate should call the Orkin man.

If they aren't real then her room mate should call his shrink to refill his perscriptions.


Yes, but sometimes no matter what you do, bugs just keep coming back and coming back. I've had poison sprayed several times both in and outside. It didn't work. Then some exterminators came to the house and sprayed, and it still didn't work.

But I wouldn't move over ants. It's a bit creepy sometimes, but I don't find them scary like centipedes.

I can't even stand the word. Cen-ti-pedes. I have found them inside my house a few times. I always freak out and have somebody else kill them.