What Can I Reasonably Expect from Therapy?

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Surf Rider
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04 Feb 2017, 2:37 am

I'm exploring the possibility that I'm on the autism spectrum, and I'm going to make an appointment to go see an autism therapist. I've been quite distressed for a very long time with my inability to hold on to a romantic relationship for more than a few months, and with my chronic feelings of being rejected socially.

I don't really know why friends and romantic partners lose interest in me and wander off. They rarely complain about anything I do or say; rather, they usually just stop calling after awhile and wander off, or they stop answering my messages, and I find myself alone again. Or I ask them to go to do something with me, like surfing or whatever, and they're always "busy." It's not that people feel angry or upset or annoyed with me; it's more that they seem to lose interest in me and then fade away, or they're always "too busy" to hang out with me.

My question is, what can I reasonably expect therapy to do for me? What tools would I learn to keep people interested in me so they don't stop calling and fade away? What tools would I learn to get women to stick around instead of losing interest in me over time? And what is it about my autism that would cause people to lose interest in me over time?


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This_Amoeba
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04 Feb 2017, 12:58 pm

My problem with maintaining friendships is that people tend to take me on as a project in which they have this ideal that they are going to break me out of my "shell." When they can't do that they tend to get bored and fade away. So I guess if that's the kind of people you attract then you will run into the fade away situation a lot. If you don't engage in a lot of social chit chat and only talk about your special interest (like surfing), then people tend to get bored. It's could also be that they think you are uninterested in them too. In my experience, if you don't contact them a lot , they usually get offended and start to ignore you, especially if all you ever talk about is your interest. People tend to be dishonest and won't express that they have a problem with you, and instead ignore you. If you ask them to go surfing, they lie and say they are busy because they rather do something social, like go to parties or gossip. I don't know though. I haven't been able to maintain many friendships or connections, I do have one friend that I've maintained for years, and that's because we have the exact same interests. We hang out maybe twice a month max, yet are still close throughout the years.



Surf Rider
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04 Feb 2017, 1:41 pm

This_Amoeba wrote:
In my experience, if you don't contact them a lot , they usually get offended and start to ignore you, especially if all you ever talk about is your interest.


This is something I'm not sure of, because a lot men's dating advice tells men to basically ignore the women they like, because that show's that you're different from the 20 losers that are throwing themselves at her every day. The ideas is that most women have lots of men approaching them, so if you don't approach her, and instead do you own thing and act aloof and uninterested, she'll see that you're different from the other men, and that you have your own interesting life going on, and that you couldn't care less whether or not she likes you because you have lots of other women chasing you, which makes you attractive.

The same does seem to be true in friendships too, though. If I was a really popular and in-demand friend, I would never need to call anyone because everyone would always call me. If I call someone and ask them to do something, that implies that they're a more interesting person than me, because if I was more interesting than them, they would have called me.

This_Amoeba wrote:
People tend to be dishonest and won't express that they have a problem with you, and instead ignore you.

This is super annoying. It's so hard to get feedback about why I get rejected by friends and lovers. It's easier for most people to just fade away than to have a difficult conversation. Even if they were willing to talk about it, it's likely they would not be able to give me much help. They'd really only be able to tell me something like, "I don't know, the relationship/friendship just didn't feel right."


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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 107 of 200
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You seem to have both neurodiverse and neurotypical traits


This_Amoeba
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04 Feb 2017, 3:12 pm

Surf Rider wrote:
a lot men's dating advice tells men to basically ignore the women they like, because that show's that you're different from the 20 losers that are throwing themselves at her every day.


That's a problem because that advise doesn't work. It's not that women (and not all women are the same) ignore people who show too much interest, it's that they ignore people they are not interested in. As a female you get used to males treating you like a piece of meat and learn to ignore anyone who is seeking them out in a superficial way. If you engage with them on deeper level and have similar interests or whatever, then they will contact you. It's not about how popular you are or how aloof you are, although for some people it is. Everyone is different.

You can try to act as mysterious and aloof as you want, and naturally people, regardless of sex, will be inquisitive, but as soon as they get to know you more, they find that they have nothing in common with you then stop contacting you. So that incoming communication becomes a temporary thing and fools the person using the "ignoring" technique into thinking it works and that they should of kept ignoring, which just leads to more bitterness. Communication is a two way street.

There are all kinds of reasons someone won't contact you or seem interested, and sometimes you won't even realize how your your coming off as, which I think is a major problem for people on the spectrum. One of my problems is that I intimidate people. I'm shy and socially awkward which comes off as being "stand-offish" and arrogant, when really I am none of those things. I don't have a lot going on either, and people find that I'm friendly and not intimidating at all after they get to know me. In fact, I've had several people tell me that they thought I was a complete stuck-up a-hole before they actually got to know me. It's doesn't help that my body language appears aloof to most people, especially NTs since they rely on body language to communicate. Hope that makes sense.



Surf Rider
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04 Feb 2017, 3:58 pm

This_Amoeba wrote:
As a female you get used to males treating you like a piece of meat and learn to ignore anyone who is seeking them out in a superficial way.


See, I struggle with believing this. I try my best to have deeper conversations with women, but the deeper I try to go in the conversation, the less interested they seem to be. If she tells me she's a grad student in neuroscience, I'll say, "Oh, I read this really interesting article about the science of consciousness....." and the she gets this look on her face like she really really doesn't want to have that conversation. Maybe I'm wrong about what a "deep" conversation is. Maybe a deep conversation is much more emotional and less cognitive. And I get it that, at least when I first meet a woman, her interest in what I say is directly proportional to how much she likes the way I look. If she doesn't think I'm good-looking, then no amount of depth or sincerity on my part is going to matter.

This_Amoeba wrote:
There are all kinds of reasons someone won't contact you or seem interested, and sometimes you won't even realize how your your coming off as, which I think is a major problem for people on the spectrum.


I don't know how I come off to other people, and I'm dying to know. I actually set up a video camera and filmed myself a couple times, and I was a little surprised that when I talked, I sounded like a college professor giving a lecture. That was several years ago, and I don't know how I sound now. The problem here is that feedback is so hard to get. Have you ever met someone, and it just felt like something about them was "off" or "not quite right" but you couldn't point out what it is? I feel like that's the way I come off. Other people describe me as "intense" but that description is not the least bit helpful. It's like, there's something about me that bothers people, though no one can exactly describe what it is. Other people have described my communication style as "formal," though again, this isn't really helpful.


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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 107 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 122 of 200
You seem to have both neurodiverse and neurotypical traits


This_Amoeba
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04 Feb 2017, 5:08 pm

Surf Rider wrote:
I struggle with believing this. I try my best to have deeper conversations with women, but the deeper I try to go in the conversation, the less interested they seem to be. If she tells me she's a grad student in neuroscience, I'll say, "Oh, I read this really interesting article about the science of consciousness....." and the she gets this look on her face like she really really doesn't want to have that conversation.


Something I've come to realize is that people often think you're trying to "one up" them or that you're being a "know it all" when exchanging information and stating facts, which could be the reason the person starts pulling away.

Another possibility is that you misread her . It's common for people on the spectrum to misread people. It could also be that since she probably studies neuroscience all day, it was the last thing she wanted to talk about.

I'm not exactly sure what I meant by "deeper" conversation, but for me it's exchanging information and ideas. I only talk about things I'm interested in, and only talk to people I think are interesting, unless I think they are uninterested. Sometimes I don't feel like talking at all even if I find them interesting, which has nothing to do with the other person but people tend to take that personally. For some people, maybe most, deeper conversations consist of more emotional topics. I don't know.

Surf Rider wrote:
And I get it that, at least when I first meet a woman, her interest in what I say is directly proportional to how much she likes the way I look. If she doesn't think I'm good-looking, then no amount of depth or sincerity on my part is going to matter.

That's natural though when it comes to dating regardless of whether you're female or male, unless you were friends first and a romantic attraction developed out of them liking you as a person. It's good to improve your looks if you want to attract women, but you don't have to start acting uninterested and play mind games with them. Plus people usually see right through those games.

Surf Rider wrote:
Have you ever met someone, and it just felt like something about them was "off" or "not quite right" but you couldn't point out what it is? I feel like that's the way I come off. Other people describe me as "intense" but that description is not the least bit helpful. It's like, there's something about me that bothers people, though no one can exactly describe what it is. Other people have described my communication style as "formal," though again, this isn't really helpful.


If you feel like that's the way you are coming across then you probably are. The way you speak probably intimidates people. They may feel like they don't have anything to add to the conversation or that you don't appreciate their company. People seem to take speech and body language really personally and read to much into it. You just need to find other eccentric and "off" people to relate to I guess. Some normal people like eccentric folks and find them charming though.



Surf Rider
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04 Feb 2017, 9:17 pm

This_Amoeba wrote:
Something I've come to realize is that people often think you're trying to "one up" them or that you're being a "know it all" when exchanging information and stating facts, which could be the reason the person starts pulling away.


When I was a kid, people would accuse me of "bragging." I didn't have any idea what they were talking about, because to me, I was just telling it like it is. Maybe I do come off as pedantic, academic, and a little hoity-toity, and maybe that puts people off. I score quite highly on verbal tests, and I like using big words, and sometimes people have to ask me what a word means. I realize that I also talk the same way I write, which is in a style that sounds like an academic paper. I don't really know what to do about that.

This_Amoeba wrote:
If you feel like that's the way you are coming across then you probably are. The way you speak probably intimidates people. They may feel like they don't have anything to add to the conversation or that you don't appreciate their company. People seem to take speech and body language really personally and read to much into it. You just need to find other eccentric and "off" people to relate to I guess. Some normal people like eccentric folks and find them charming though.


Maybe. There's always the possibility of giving up on being "normal" and accepting whatever friends and lovers that come my way who don't mind my pedantic communication style.

I've always done OK socially in more formal settings, like work settings and academic settings - anytime we're talking about "serious" stuff. But I often feel lost in informal settings, where I'm expected to joke around and have fun. I have had a fair number of comments from people that were on the order of "lighten up" and "you're so serious."

Maybe there's actually something else going on with my friendships. Maybe people fade away less because of my autism behaviors themselves, and more because there isn't enough friendship chemistry to sustain the friendship, because the other person doesn't have autism. I have been able to sustain friendships with a few guys, and I still consider them my friends even though we don't live close to each other any more. I can do it, and I have done it, but it's pretty rare for me to find the right friendship chemistry.


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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 107 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 122 of 200
You seem to have both neurodiverse and neurotypical traits


Summer_Twilight
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05 Feb 2017, 11:14 am

Usually one on one therapy in the autism world consists of "Cognitive Behavioral Therapy" and it's more practical application than relational therapy. Though it can be helpful for learning how to read social skills, it's a very cold and scientific branch in the world of counseling.

Yet, their tactics will teach you to ask them if they

1. Were offended at something that you did and were turned off
2. Are they interested in being your friend.

However, I don't think it's just Aspies who get the rotten end of the deal. I have known plenty of NTs who suddenly stopped talking to each other over the littlest things.



Surf Rider
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06 Feb 2017, 7:28 am

Summer_Twilight wrote:
Usually one on one therapy in the autism world consists of "Cognitive Behavioral Therapy" and it's more practical application than relational therapy. Though it can be helpful for learning how to read social skills, it's a very cold and scientific branch in the world of counseling.

Yet, their tactics will teach you to ask them if they

1. Were offended at something that you did and were turned off
2. Are they interested in being your friend.

However, I don't think it's just Aspies who get the rotten end of the deal. I have known plenty of NTs who suddenly stopped talking to each other over the littlest things.


For me, I don't think that people reject me because they were offended by something I said or did, or possibly even because something about me turned them off. My impression is that it's more common for people to reject me because they're bored with me. I often find that I feel I am losing people's attention, and I also often feel that I need to compete for their attention.


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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 107 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 122 of 200
You seem to have both neurodiverse and neurotypical traits


Summer_Twilight
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06 Feb 2017, 4:14 pm

Are you just interested in surfing or have limited interests? Sometimes limited interests can turn people off



Surf Rider
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06 Feb 2017, 11:35 pm

Summer_Twilight wrote:
Are you just interested in surfing or have limited interests? Sometimes limited interests can turn people off


I have quite a wide diversity of interests, and I feel like I can talk intelligently about a variety of topics. But that doesn't necessarily make for an interesting person.


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Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 122 of 200
You seem to have both neurodiverse and neurotypical traits


Summer_Twilight
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07 Feb 2017, 1:21 pm

It sounds like there isn't anything wrong with you but rather, what's wrong with them. Most people are not capable of being good friends. It also has become a fad to be passive aggressive rather than honest as to why they can't associate with you.

On the other hand, I don't know these people and have never spoken to them but it could also be that they are so off in their own little world that they aren't even self-aware of how they are treating you.



colina
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24 Feb 2017, 6:43 pm

There are half a dozen types of therapy. Some are useless for aspies, some are worse than nothing, some can give u tools for coping. There is a big debate about the loss of self from therapies that train u to fake it or practice becoming neurotypical. The best seem to provide enough comfort to start actual, honest conversations for gaining self awareness.
Try describing the main thing u want from therapy--as specifically as u can---and I'll suggest possibilities. later this year my university team will be posting a way aspies can do therapy with each other.
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24 Feb 2017, 7:02 pm

People often find it easier to "connect" or find a deep bond when they have similar backgrounds. This may be the problem you are having.



Surf Rider
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24 Feb 2017, 10:51 pm

colina wrote:
Try describing the main thing u want from therapy--as specifically as u can---and I'll suggest possibilities. later this year my university team will be posting a way aspies can do therapy with each other.
Old Professor.


The thing that I really want in my life is that I want to find a partner. I do attract women, but they always end up leaving, and I'm really not sure why.

I have other issues, like poor time management, but I feel like that comes from being so distracted by my constant worry about finding a partner.

BTDT wrote:
People often find it easier to "connect" or find a deep bond when they have similar backgrounds. This may be the problem you are having.


This is true. I have had close friends, and yes, they are usually people whose background and problems are similar to mine.


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Your neurodiverse (Aspie) score: 107 of 200
Your neurotypical (non-autistic) score: 122 of 200
You seem to have both neurodiverse and neurotypical traits


colina
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26 Feb 2017, 4:51 pm

My real computer is in shop. I will respond carefully in 2-4 days. OK?
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