The Friend/Lover Dichotomy

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My problem in dating has not so much been finding interested women, because I have found quite a few. The problem has been getting them to stick around. I believe that part of the reason for this difficulty is my failure to solve what I'd call the "friend/lover dichotomy."

The problem is, at least for men, the qualities in a man that make him a good supportive friend are often the opposite of the qualities that make him an appealing romantic partner. This is why Nice Guys incessantly complain that women are attracted to jerks.

A supportive friend is available, upfront, kind, emotionally stable, agreeable, egalitarian, and unselfish. However, an appealing lover - a man who is romantically and sexually exciting - is more on the side of unavailable, mysterious, emotionally dynamic, dominant, powerful, and self-oriented.

So I have a problem. I can either be one or the other with a woman, but not both. If I display more of the friendship traits with a woman, then I can have a good friendship with her, but she insists that she has no romantic interest in me. If I display the lover traits, she will often be attracted to me and may become physically intimate with me in some way, but the relationship is brief and she doesn't stick around.

But some men do manage to pull off being both a friend and a lover. They know when to respond as a friend and when to respond as a lover. I think this is part of the social intuition that I'm missing.

So what can you suggest for me? How do I know when to be a friend and when to be a lover, so that I can both attract a woman and get her to stick around?

I disagree that they can't be mixed. Someone can be agreeable, but still have their own unique opinions. Someone can be available, but not all the time because they have their own life. Someone can be emotionally stable, but still have things they're passionate and dynamic about without being a loose cannon.

This is a more healthy balance than sticking one's neck all the way out for someone.

I have to disagree aswell my fiance is my best friend (I know it sounds cliché but it's true). We game together, Joke together and he is kind, supportive, unselfish and sexually exciting. I fact what you deem to be wanted in a lover sound awful.

Realistically in a evolutionary perspective why on earth would a woman want someone unstable, unavaliable and mysterious if your going to have offspring with that person. You wouldn't want those traits to be passed on.

The relationship that work are the ones where you are friends and lovers.

Figures the female respondents would say the exact opposite of what happens in real life. I'm with surf, I have both good-guy and bad-boy qualities, and mixing them drives women away instead of being the ideal combo.

Or we're describing the men we're dating (real-life) and not stereotypes (fantasy). The last guy who was unavailable, I left. So there goes your theory.

Maybe you're doing it wrong.

Actuall marrying your best friend and lover is real life. Not only are most couples I know great friends as well studies have found the same thing.

http://www.iflscience.com/editors-blog/ ... st-friend/

Why would you deny our personal experiences and then substitute them for your own. Could you not perhaps see that some women might prefer a mixture.

Just because most NTs are both friends and lovers, doesn't mean this works for NDs. I'd agree with the OP that they cannot be mixed, and when they are mixed, it's similar to an arranged marriage.

But I'm wih a guy who is the mixture and I am autistic

Huh?

Of course some people diagnosed with autism can do it, but many can't or won't. It doesn't work for me at least.

But how do you know many can't?

Also you assume they are all NT in the study but that may not be the case

I would prefer the person I love to also be my best friend.

I believe these sorts of relationships work best.

Lyrics are relevant.

Because they have problems with it.



No need for that. If 85% in a study are NT, then the results will be for NTs. The 15% NDs will be hidden as statistical noise.

I can do it. In fact, in some respects, it might be easier for me that way. I've always believed firmly in the notion that friendship is the ideal basis for a romantic relationship. You know each other inside out, you're not afraid of voicing your concerns to the other, and most importantly, you know and respect every single quirk of each other - that's the kind of relationship that'd fit me perfectly. I like to think of it as a "romantic friendship".

How do you know it's not just 'some' have problems being with someone who is a friend and lover?