Female traffic light signals at pedestrian crossings

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b9
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19 Mar 2017, 4:08 am

RetroGamer87 wrote:
^ I get what you're saying. You're saying that extra help for women is insulting for women.

Sort of like if they made exams easier for women it would imply that they think women are less intelligent.

Of course we know the truth is that women are more intelligent than men. This is why men are mistrustful of women. Because there's nothing to stop women from taking unfair advantage of their superior brains.


yeah wow. way to twist my words into your obsequious meaning.

i wanted strong girls to call me a complete sexist and bigot because i like the feel of their claws.



BettaPonic
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19 Mar 2017, 4:51 am

jrjones9933 wrote:
None taken. If going off about this makes you feel better, okay. Fringe feminists do less harm than cars.

Social movements in my opinion are more important than car crashes. What is your opinion on Anita Sarkesian?



RetroGamer87
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19 Mar 2017, 5:18 am

b9 wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
^ I get what you're saying. You're saying that extra help for women is insulting for women.

Sort of like if they made exams easier for women it would imply that they think women are less intelligent.

Of course we know the truth is that women are more intelligent than men. This is why men are mistrustful of women. Because there's nothing to stop women from taking unfair advantage of their superior brains.
yeah wow. way to twist my words into your obsequious meaning.

i wanted strong girls to call me a complete sexist and bigot because i like the feel of their claws.
For the love pizza do I need to add a /sarcasm label every single time I'm sarcastic?

I thought that one was to obvious to require a label.

Or is that too subtle for you? Do you require a sign?
Image


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b9
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19 Mar 2017, 5:31 am

RetroGamer87 wrote:
b9 wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
^ I get what you're saying. You're saying that extra help for women is insulting for women.

Sort of like if they made exams easier for women it would imply that they think women are less intelligent.

Of course we know the truth is that women are more intelligent than men. This is why men are mistrustful of women. Because there's nothing to stop women from taking unfair advantage of their superior brains.
yeah wow. way to twist my words into your obsequious meaning.

i wanted strong girls to call me a complete sexist and bigot because i like the feel of their claws.
For the love pizza do I need to add a /sarcasm label every single time I'm sarcastic?

I thought that one was to obvious to require a label.

Or is that too subtle for you? Do you require a sign?
Image


yeah fail to you. you can't squirm out. i don't care anyway



RetroGamer87
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19 Mar 2017, 5:49 am

b9 wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
b9 wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
^ I get what you're saying. You're saying that extra help for women is insulting for women.

Sort of like if they made exams easier for women it would imply that they think women are less intelligent.

Of course we know the truth is that women are more intelligent than men. This is why men are mistrustful of women. Because there's nothing to stop women from taking unfair advantage of their superior brains.
yeah wow. way to twist my words into your obsequious meaning.

i wanted strong girls to call me a complete sexist and bigot because i like the feel of their claws.
For the love pizza do I need to add a /sarcasm label every single time I'm sarcastic?

I thought that one was to obvious to require a label.

Or is that too subtle for you? Do you require a sign?
Image


yeah fail to you. you can't squirm out. i don't care anyway
You claim you don't care yet you respond? :lol:

Image


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jrjones9933
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19 Mar 2017, 8:30 am

BettaPonic wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
None taken. If going off about this makes you feel better, okay. Fringe feminists do less harm than cars.

Social movements in my opinion are more important than car crashes. What is your opinion on Anita Sarkesian?

Not much except that I have many higher priorities. While I'll always make time to argue principles if confronted by a leftist with the kind of aggressive stupidity that you worry about, I don't seek it out. I have plenty of things to oppose in the mainstream, and mainstream social barriers cause more problems than fringe nuts.


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BettaPonic
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19 Mar 2017, 8:39 am

jrjones9933 wrote:
BettaPonic wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
None taken. If going off about this makes you feel better, okay. Fringe feminists do less harm than cars.

Social movements in my opinion are more important than car crashes. What is your opinion on Anita Sarkesian?

Not much except that I have many higher priorities. While I'll always make time to argue principles if confronted by a leftist with the kind of aggressive stupidity that you worry about, I don't seek it out. I have plenty of things to oppose in the mainstream, and mainstream social barriers cause more problems than fringe nuts.

What are some mainstream social boundaries for women? I have seen these nuts and they are pretty mainstream. Anita Sarkessan is mainstream. She makes feminist frequency.



jrjones9933
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19 Mar 2017, 8:51 am

On this site, I've disagreed with other feminists on topfree equality and legal prostitution, for starters. I don't feel the need to hunt down arguments with my fellow feminists, but I do enjoy them when they come my way.

Likewise, I don't need to go out hunting for places where I see women treated dismissively with regard to their talents, or subjected to harassment. I have the opportunity to address that far more often. I expect to have even more opportunities, as people get more comfortable defining their own gender roles in ways that stir up the haters. My feminism includes all genders.

People should totally pursue their special interests, but don't imagine that the topic contains the importance. The importance of an obsession is in the obsession, and an interest can turn into an obsession if you start to think everyone should feel your level of emotional charge.


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BettaPonic
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19 Mar 2017, 8:54 am

jrjones9933 wrote:
On this site, I've disagreed with other feminists on topfree equality and legal prostitution, for starters. I don't feel the need to hunt down arguments with my fellow feminists, but I do enjoy them when they come my way.

Likewise, I don't need to go out hunting for places where I see women treated dismissively with regard to their talents, or subjected to harassment. I have the opportunity to address that far more often. I expect to have even more opportunities, as people get more comfortable defining their own gender roles in ways that stir up the haters. My feminism includes all genders.

People should totally pursue their special interests, but don't imagine that the topic contains the importance. The importance of an obsession is in the obsession, and an interest can turn into an obsession if you start to think everyone should feel your level of emotional charge.

Feminist Frequency frequently lies and scams.



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19 Mar 2017, 9:04 am

Shame on them, in that case. Lying gives our opponents unlimited ammunition to mull over again and again. The truth hurts plenty, and we should keep hitting people with the truth, over and over.

I feel their pain, too. I grew up in West Texas, believing I was a good person with a clear picture of human decency. Then I somehow got A Handmaid's Tale, and suddenly those traditional values didn't look so decent. It hurt. I felt really tormented, obviously, an undiagnosed teenage aspie who suddenly has to rebuild his value system. I guess I was a Culture War Baby, but I dealt with it.

The actual bullies were the malicious jerks who physically bullied me for gender nonconformity, not the brutally frank Ms. Atwood and her confrontational ideas.


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BettaPonic
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19 Mar 2017, 9:10 am

jrjones9933 wrote:
Shame on them, in that case. Lying gives our opponents unlimited ammunition to mull over again and again. The truth hurts plenty, and we should keep hitting people with the truth, over and over.

I feel their pain, too. I grew up in West Texas, believing I was a good person with a clear picture of human decency. Then I somehow got A Handmaid's Tale, and suddenly those traditional values didn't look so decent. It hurt. I felt really tormented, obviously, an undiagnosed teenage aspie who suddenly has to rebuild his value system. I guess I was a Culture War Baby, but I dealt with it.

The actual bullies were the malicious jerks who physically bullied me for gender nonconformity, not the brutally frank Ms. Atwood and her confrontational ideas.

I am sorry for that happening to you, but that doesn't seem like a gendered issue.



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19 Mar 2017, 9:16 am

BettaPonic wrote:
Feminist Frequency frequently lies and scams.


Anita Sarkeesian only became big because people tried to silence her. She'd have been forgotten a long time ago if people had just ignored her instead of getting up in arms over her nonsense. The more people rant and rave about her, hurling all sorts of ridiculously immature abuse at her, the more ammo she has to boost her publicity with. Controversy gets attention.



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19 Mar 2017, 9:22 am

Sabreclaw wrote:
BettaPonic wrote:
Feminist Frequency frequently lies and scams.


Anita Sarkeesian only became big because people tried to silence her. She'd have been forgotten a long time ago if people had just ignored her instead of getting up in arms over her nonsense. The more people rant and rave about her, hurling all sorts of ridiculously immature abuse at her, the more ammo she has to boost her publicity with. Controversy gets attention.

Who tried to silence her? She is known for finding sexism in anything, collecting huge sums for her charity to complete a project and not finish them. She claims harrasnent for disagreeing with her. Plenty of her opponents are at risk of being silenced. Plenty of her opponents get threats. She is the one complaining.



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19 Mar 2017, 2:18 pm

androbot01 wrote:
Just to beat this metaphor to death, I would say that the problem may be in the connection.


Which makes no sense whatsoever considering what I just wrote, but whatever.


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I don't think this compensates. I am a fan of careful analysis and constantly do so (to the point of agitation) and it does produce results. But what I am talking about does not need to be worked at.
Also, I believe this deficit is intrinsic to autism; it may vary in degree, but it is a defining characteristic.


And onwards marches the doublespeak! It doesn't compensate, but it can produce results, but it doesn't need to be worked at. What. If it produces results that mitigates the effect of the deficit, then that is compensation. It might not fully cancel it out, but it is still compensating. And if working on skills that help mitigate the impact of the deficit increases the degree to which it does just that, then what sense does anything you just said make?

And yes, deficits in the social realm is a defining characteristic of autism. But you seem to be confused as to what "deficit" means. It means a value that falls short of an expected benchmark. It does not mean that someone excised a part of your brain and cauterized the area, setting whatever value could have been there to a permanent 0.


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To be clear I am drawing the comparison to the effect of both disorders on the partner. The cause and motive may be completely different, but the result can be the same.


Yes, and it still doesn't make sense. In what way is a spouse leading a perfectly happy existence with their seemingly normal but secretly psychopathic partner in any way similar to another spouse who meets, dates, falls for and eventually marries an autistic person? The pair with the autistic partner would likely be a case of "what you see is what you get", while the psychopath couple would be literally the opposite.


Quote:
So fault lies with the wronged person for not drawing attention to their wronging? This doesn't make sense.
The person who commits the wrong is at fault regardless of whether the one harmed voices it.


So, "being autistic" is a wrongful act that one inflicts on others now? Do you even listen to yourself?

And yes, if one person feels they are not being hugged, kissed and told they are loved enough by their partner, and instead of saying something they secretly resent their partner for it, then they are at fault. They're not wronged, they are comitting a wrong. And we are talking about people who have known each other for long enough, and like eachother enough to get married. I'm not sure how they manage to suddenly be surprised when the autistic person behaves like an autistic person.

androbot01 wrote:
And she's entitled to express her experience.


She is. And I'm entitled to express that she's a histrionic, hateful, scientifically illiterate, disingenuous woman-child throwing a temper tantrum rather than practicing even the slightest bit of introspection. She, if anyone, is having a harmful influence on those unfortunate enough to be in her presence.


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Makes me feel like a lonely Medusa.


I'm not sure what to say to that. Watch out for naked greeks carrying shiny shields?


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19 Mar 2017, 3:03 pm

Wolfram87 wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
Just to beat this metaphor to death, I would say that the problem may be in the connection.


Which makes no sense whatsoever considering what I just wrote, but whatever.


Resubmitted for review: (sorry, my turn with the Zinfandel.)

Wolfram87 wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
I tend to think that the problem is not with the lack of a receptor, but rather a flawed output.
I suppose that's a matter of perspective, but I'm not sure I agree. I think aspies tend to do things more deliberately than NTs do. So without the perception of a potential "receptor" ("This is someone of my species"/"someone I could get along with"/"I think like this person") there is no output to begin with. This was certainly my experience when I met the girl I mentioned before. Very deliberate. Planned out. Waited for an opportunity. A deliberate and specific message to someone I wanted to spend time with, rather than a passive and generalized signaling for someone to please spend time with me.

I think what I understand you to be saying is that there is a failure to produce an output because of a lack of awareness of a receptor. Is this right?

Anyway,
Wolfram87 wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
I don't think this compensates. I am a fan of careful analysis and constantly do so (to the point of agitation) and it does produce results. But what I am talking about does not need to be worked at.
Also, I believe this deficit is intrinsic to autism; it may vary in degree, but it is a defining characteristic.


And onwards marches the doublespeak! It doesn't compensate, but it can produce results, but it doesn't need to be worked at.

I don't understand what is unclear.

Wolfram87 wrote:
What. If it produces results that mitigates the effect of the deficit, then that is compensation. It might not fully cancel it out, but it is still compensating. And if working on skills that help mitigate the impact of the deficit increases the degree to which it does just that, then what sense does anything you just said make?

That is what I said.

Wolfram87 wrote:
And yes, deficits in the social realm is a defining characteristic of autism. But you seem to be confused as to what "deficit" means. It means a value that falls short of an expected benchmark. It does not mean that someone excised a part of your brain and cauterized the area, setting whatever value could have been there to a permanent 0.

The benchmark in this case would be satisfying one's partner's emotional needs.

Wolfram87 wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
To be clear I am drawing the comparison to the effect of both disorders on the partner. The cause and motive may be completely different, but the result can be the same.


Yes, and it still doesn't make sense. In what way is a spouse leading a perfectly happy existence with their seemingly normal but secretly psychopathic partner in any way similar to another spouse who meets, dates, falls for and eventually marries an autistic person? The pair with the autistic partner would likely be a case of "what you see is what you get", while the psychopath couple would be literally the opposite.

Similarities can appear in the dissimilar.

Wolfram87 wrote:
androbot01 wrote:
So fault lies with the wronged person for not drawing attention to their wronging? This doesn't make sense.
The person who commits the wrong is at fault regardless of whether the one harmed voices it.


So, "being autistic" is a wrongful act that one inflicts on others now? Do you even listen to yourself?

Being autistic is not a wrongful act; it is what it is. "Inflicting" one's autism on another, which I take to mean as offering more than possible, is wrong.

Bluntly, autism is not a picnic for others to be around. You mentioned before that you have been in relationships with autistic people and are close to autistic people. The same is true of me. Being around other autistics has been useful in that their behaviour has made me aware of my own annoying characteristics. I agreed already that compensation can result in improved communication. However, this does not replace the intrinsic connection that NTs experience with each other. It is not defeatist to realize what is impossible and to adjust one's plans accordingly. It is a waste of time lament the impossible.

I feel that autistic people have let NTs set the agenda (well, I guess it couldn't be otherwise.) But their game works for them, not everyone.

Wolfram87 wrote:
And yes, if one person feels they are not being hugged, kissed and told they are loved enough by their partner, and instead of saying something they secretly resent their partner for it, then they are at fault. They're not wronged, they are comitting a wrong. And we are talking about people who have known each other for long enough, and like eachother enough to get married. I'm not sure how they manage to suddenly be surprised when the autistic person behaves like an autistic person.

Two wrongs make a marriage. ;)



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21 Mar 2017, 3:07 am

Sabreclaw wrote:
BettaPonic wrote:
Feminist Frequency frequently lies and scams.


Anita Sarkeesian only became big because people tried to silence her. She'd have been forgotten a long time ago if people had just ignored her instead of getting up in arms over her nonsense. The more people rant and rave about her, hurling all sorts of ridiculously immature abuse at her, the more ammo she has to boost her publicity with. Controversy gets attention.


It's the Streisand Effect allover again.


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