Why do Americans love guns so much?

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I almost forgot about you.
Yes, we hit that warehouse on a cold moonless drizzly night, approaching stealthily from the woods to the east. We hacked the security system and disabled it earlier. I saw Joe walking a beat around the warehouse perimeter with my night vision goggles and had my designated marksman, 75 yards behind me and on a wooded knoll, take the shot.

The report of his suppressed AR-15 in .300 Blackout made less noise from where I was standing than when the 125 grain bullet beached Joe's skull 45 yards away from me hiding in my "foul cover". His knees buckled instantly and he dropped to the pavement. The five of us, armed to the teeth, rushed the warehouse and seized it.

We split up all those "AR type weapons" between us and I now have a garage full of them with the boxes stacked to the ceiling from one end to the other. I'm having a sale on them this Saturday; buy one and get another at half off.

How's that for a happy ending?

That's exactly it. They ignore all the inconvenient facts and focus on the ones they like. They have exactly demonstrated my original point.

That's really the issue right there. Under the current system none of those groups are denied access to weapons. Your personal experience is also anecdotal, of course that happens as well. What if someone was visiting your home though and stumbled upon a loaded gun because it was improperly stored? With loaded guns all over the place this is an absolutely plausible scenario.

I'm pretty sure the articles I linked were not opinion pieces created by me and were actual news articles. This really avoids my point anyway, that being it's easy to find news articles about this subject. The problem is that it needs a proper scientific study.



While anyone can study the issue, maybe you arn't aware of this but, a large portion of the unbiased research done is funded by the government. Private corporations have no interest in such issues, the have interest in ventures that generate profit. eg The selling of arms and all the other items that go along with the culture.




Which studies are these? Are they from an unbiased source? The issues in Chicago are a poor example. Banning guns in a particular city when they are easily accessible all around it does nothing. It doesn't take a lot of thought to figure this out.



I think you missed my overall point. That being we both could link articles all day of the good and bad outcomes of carrying weapons. The point is that an unbiased and comprehensive study of the issue is needed. It is more common than it could be is the point. I'm not sure why you wouldn't want a proper study done as it would surely prove you are correct. You could proceed to cite that research any time someone says something contradictory. Then we could start getting rid of all the onerous gun laws so we could all be safer.



I'm sure you know but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Not allowing the government to fund a study of the issue means it will likely never happen. That was the entire point of blocking them from doing so.



First we need to define some terms. What you describe with the knife is indeed an accident. Why is it an accident? It is an accident because he was distracted and left a knife where a child could reach it. It happens to all humans. If she had kept the knife within reach of the child as a matter of policy and normal storage, it would not be an accident. As a matter of policy knives are kept up and away from the edges of the counter the children cannot reach them. If someone accidentally forgot to put a gun away, it would be an accident. If it is stored loaded under a couch cushion of other place easily reached by children as a matter of normal storage procedure, it is not an accident but irresponsible.

I agree people get far more emotional when it comes to accidents with firearms. Some people are adamant in their desire to "ban all guns" and I don't agree with that either. If laws were put in place to better train gun buyers and enforce better storage of weapons a lot of these "accidents" would cease to exist. That would leave the media with less to sensationalize which would only benefit the cause of gun owners. The less people see this stuff in the media the less they will favor banning guns.

Well, first-of-all, I don't see how what I related, about my personal experience, was anecdotal----because, to ME, "anecdotal" would be if I said: "I heard my neighbor was..." (what I was relating, was firsthand experience)----but, anyway.....

Secondly, I can't imagine your scenario happening, in a "gun-culture" home. We, generally, keep to our own kind----and, we're taught morals and manners, from day one, and that means people don't go around snooping in other people's drawers / closets, and so-forth, so they wouldn't "stumble upon" a loaded gun; and, even if they did, again, we're taught, from day one, not to touch.

Thirdly, IMO, "improperly stored" is subjective. It is NOT, IMO, "improperly stored" to put a loaded gun in the nightstand drawer in a "gun culture" home----it IS, however, "improperly stored" to store a loaded gun in the nightstand drawer of a NON-gun-culture home (the home of one of those other groups, I mentioned).

Lastly, as for your "none of those groups are denied access to weapons": It never ceases to amaze me that people seem to believe that any type of ban / partial ban on guns, will simply make guns disappear. Even if every gun owner, voluntarily handed-in their guns (which will never happen----my family, ALONE, is of the "from my cold dead hands", type), there would still be millions of criminals, WITH guns. Also, if there was a gun ban in the U.S., all those guns being funneled-through the U.S. to Mexico, would just STOP HERE, as the market for guns, here, would pick-up, exponentially.

Baltimore City has had more-than-one "Turn-in Your Guns Day"----and, you know what happened? People who were low on cash, turned-in their guns, and the very first time they had the available cash, again, went and bought another one----or, just went and stole another one, which is more convenient.

I know you were talking to Dox, but I wanted to make a comment on this part, right here:

And, how do you propose we do that? Do you think the local police should go-around to everyone's home, for unannounced safety inspections? Meanwhile, the REAL criminals will be running rampant.

Also----and I really don't mean to be rude, in saying this----but, why is it that non-Americans / non-citizens, are so often giving us flak about our guns? When you've walked a mile, in my shoes.....

Nobody likes unsolicited advice----and, even if an American started a thread on here, to ask advice on how we could get rid of guns, that would be ONE American's request.

here's three ways:
1) require that a gun safe is installed if you're purchasing firearms/applying for a firearms-related license
2) tax ammo sales and have said inspections, though not unannounced
3)regulate ammo(and components to manufacture same) maybe it's how the US is ranked 4th in the world for firearm related deaths(http://vizhub.healthdata.org/gbd-compare/# C3.2.1 Physical violence by Firearm, deaths) and 2nd for prevalence of firearm related deaths(http://vizhub.healthdata.org/gbd-compare/# C3.2.1, prevalence). Brazil leads the world in gun violence, but the US beats them in unintentional firearm fatal injuries.(C2.5.1, deaths).

P.S. you can't really call it unsolicited with a straight face when nearly half the country wants more firearms control

congrats on redefining what 'anecdote' means. as for the rest of us, it still means the same thing; that your story of your personal experience is an anecdote(with little value to anyone else)

Yes, anecdotal knowledge on firearms is especially scary when there are people on this forum who actually know the subject so well. Statistics with graphs and all are much more comfy. I mean gee willikers, you toss a few graphs in there and you KNOW it has to be all factual and $hit.

These anti-gun people have themselves and thier pet politicians to thank for the proliferation of firearms in more recent years. Or is it that all those guns and ammo sold in the past 8 years, especially after Sandy Hook, just imaginary? Shooting ranges have become so crowded with new shooters that it's not even fun to be a range officer any more. But hey, that's all just anecdotal and means nothing.

Well, here you are again, all in the mustard, tryin' to ketchup!! I wasn't even talking to you----but, I'll go this round with ya, just so the THINKING people will see how silly your posts, are.....

Those three suggestions you made, up there, are for regulating LAW-ABIDING citizens, and most of them already have gun cabinets; and, I would venture to guess that most CRIMINALS, DON'T----so, what do you propose, to regulate CRIMINALS?

If you don't have "unannounced" inspections, how do you figure they're gonna be effective? I mean, if law enforcement announces that they're gonna inspect houses, then CRIMINALS will just let their "cousin" hold their firearms, until the heat passes (LAW-ABIDING citizens will already be following regulations, to a "T").

Ammunition is already regulated. California, for instance----one of thee most-regulated states in the country----says one can't LEGALLY buy / possess magazines that hold more than 10 rounds; AND, they require a background check, just for ammunition.

As for our rankings, you've linked: I don't care if we rank no. 1 in every single category there is, regarding guns----unless Americans are coming to YOUR country, and trying to illegally sell YOUR citizens, guns, it shouldn't matter to any other country, what we're doing. (Suggestion: If you want to successfully dupe/bait people by putting only "Dallas" in your profile, you should know that Americans consider using the word "spelt", as bad English, and we don't spell "color", with a "u".)

As for your P.S.: Well, if "nearly half the country wants more firearms control", than MORE-THAN-HALF, DOESN'T!! LOLOLOL TOO funny!!

As for your problem with the way I define, "anecdotal": My dictionary says (copied and pasted):

"consisting of or based on secondhand accounts rather than firsthand knowledge or experience"

So, by that definition, the word "anecdotal" doesn't apply to what I was relating, because it was firsthand experience. Most people on here, cry "anecdotal" because they want some kind of "scientific" something----and, while I respect / appreciate science, it is not, IMO, the be-all-and-end-all.

Just post a picture of a plate of fried fish and hushpuppies, or a fillet knife.
Scares the hell out of him.

I'm a Pro-Gun Democrat. Why? When you have a society where only the government and criminals (criminals will always get their hands on guns) have the guns, you get unarmed autistic men and unarmed black men getting shot on the street by bigoted cops (hired goons). And you become a sitting duck for criminals.

Malcolm X and many Marxists are in favor of the right to bear arms for a reason. The whole leftism thing being associated with gun control is a more modern thing. Originating in the 60s I think? Maybe later.

Not to mention that the government wants to take away guns from people who are "mentally ill". This is a slippery slope because mentally ill can be a subjective term. Does that mean as an autistic person, the government wants to take away our guns? (I don't have guns because it's hard to get a gun up here in Canada. But if it was easy to get a gun, I would get one).

Exactly, and what qualifies as mentally ill depends on which beliefs are in vogue at the time and often based on current events and media agitation. In the US, gun laws have their roots in Jim Crow laws back in the days of old.


I don't live in Canada but most say it's fairly easy to obtain basic Purchase and Acquisition Licence (PAL) that will allow you to buy non-restricted rifles and shotguns. The RPAL for restricted firearms (any handgun and some semi-auto rifles and carbines) is a step above that. The rules for Quebec, I believe, are more stringent.

Old dude who thought it must work just like an M1 carbine?

I'm fairly tolerant of the general public not understanding the finer points of how guns actually work (until it comes to legislating it, of course), but you'd really think that the head of the design and function (i.e. how guns work) section of the only accredited gunsmithing school in the Western US would know how a fairly popular shotgun worked, especially when we had all the reference books right there on his desk. Double stupid when just taking the gun apart proves pretty definitively how it works, and that's literally what we do in that section.

Another good one was the time a kid at one of my jobs tried to tell me that the whole holding the gun sideways thing was a CIA room-clearing technique to use the recoil to make the gun kick sideways towards the next target and refused to listen even after he found out what I was in school for. No amount of explaining basic physics could budge him off that one, and he looked like he wanted to hit me by the end of it, which would have provided an excellent opportunity for a practical demonstration of how recoil works, but I wanted to keep the job.

Additionally, if you have a Restricted license, you can only use the guns it covers at licensed firing ranges, so most people don't even bother with them. Myself, I'd be in favor of amending the laws so that people could legally use restricted firearms on their own property, or for hunting.

I told him enough to get started in the right direction if he's interested.

What surprises me is that the Tavor or a Vz-58 to name a few are not on the restricted list but the AR's and AK's are. I guess I shouldn't be too surprised since before 2004 in the US it was illegal to install even a standard birdcage flash suppressor on a post-94 AR-15. You could put a muzzle brake on one but not the flash suppressor.

This is something else about Canadian gun laws that surprised the $hit out of me.
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/powder-poudre-eng.htm

A flintlock single-shot handgun is restricted?!?!
Wow!
I've ordered two percussion revolvers from Cabela's or Bass Pro and had them mailed directly to me. They aren't even legally considered firearms in the US.