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anti_gone
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18 Jul 2017, 5:45 pm

starkid wrote:
Not every autistic person has routines. The diagnostic criteria—restricted, repetitive, and/or stereotyped behaviors—can be satisfied with other traits.


Thank you, starkid.

I definitely have some repetitive patterns... like when I'm obsessed about some question (like "can aspies be happy") I will google this and I will read ALL websites I can find both in English and my mother tongue till there are no more search results left. It's not something that makes me feel good, it makes anxiety even worse.

Routines seem to be for coping, but the obsessions don't help me coping :/



kraftiekortie
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18 Jul 2017, 6:05 pm

I don't have to do Internet research in order to determine if "Aspies can be happy." I know, from real life, that Aspies can be happy.

I know you were just using that as an example LOL.

One thing about Germany that's unusual: The climate is actually warmer in the north, on average, than in the south. Because of the higher elevation of the south.

Are you looking for programming work now?



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18 Jul 2017, 6:59 pm

I think a life with routine needs a foundation to build around, otherwise things instead are very adrift like things never being organized or cleaned.

In a strange way, this can also arise from being to critical or perfectionist. By that I mean a person might think they want something done to a certain standard or they have a vision of how it should be done, but it can't be done do to lack of resources needed like Space, Time, or Money.

Maybe you have a very high ideal of a routine life, but Perfectionist, Critical, or All-Or-Nothing thinking comes into play.

There is also the sleep issue, but that might also be the result of more Perfectionism pounding out projects on the PC or doing research.



PaperMajora
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19 Jul 2017, 7:42 am

This is one of the main things that has made me question if I have ASD or not. I pretty much procrastinate all day (really a bad problem) with no rhyme or reason, and the only thing that's mostly consistent is lunch at 11-1 and my run from 4-5. I'm slowly breaking free of my procrastination problem (yes it's a really crippling serious thing to me) so maybe a more complete schedule will start to form. I do hate it when I DO have something planned and something gets in the way.


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kraftiekortie
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19 Jul 2017, 7:55 am

I'm a bad procrastinator, too.

It's prevented me from really succeeding in life.



Aristophanes
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19 Jul 2017, 9:57 am

I don't have routines either, I just do what needs to be done when it needs to be done. If I have clothes lining the floor of my room I could care less, I'll take care of laundry when I need clean clothes. As Starkid mentioned: restricted, repetitive, and/or stereotyped behaviors are the diagnostic criteria, not routine. When I work my plants I've very pedantic, same when I program, but that doesn't apply to my life only my interests/work.



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19 Jul 2017, 10:09 am

anti_gone wrote:
Haha, thank you :)

But the lack of routine IS getting in the way. Because I forget my keys, I'm always late, I'm often hungry and thus in bad mood when I shouldn't, I can't get up in the morning because I don't have fixed bed times and not bedtime routine, my flat is a mess... about making a living, I was recently fired, but that had mostly other reasons I guess (even though being late and being too messy certainly contributed).

I have to say, however, that when I'm focused on something like programming, I'm quite eager to stick to the task and to follow some rules.

So, yeah, more routines would definitely help me :D

...


I wonder how those with executive function disorder can keep their routines? E.g. say you are really, really immersed in your special interest. You are about to discover something new and you are really obsessed and excited and "in the flow". You don't want to stop what you are currently doing. How are you able to follow a routine like having dinner at 6 PM? I mean, wouldn't this interrupt what you are currently doing?


I don't go to bed at a regular time on my own...I have to keep track of what time it is and make myself go to bed, to get enough sleep for work. You could try to go to bed a half hour before you need to...I do that so I actually end up going to sleep on time, otherwise I'll be up longer than I plan to.

Also maybe stock up on some healthy snacks, so when you realize you've forgotten to eat you can just munch on something. I forget to eat quite a bit or my appetite just isn't there when it should be and once I am hungry enough it effects my mood I certainly don't want to make anything or navigate a grocery store so a quick snack helps. At my work I don't even have time for an actual lunch so I just bring Cliff bars to eat because they have tasty ones not like dried out granola bars my mom used to buy.


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AshtenS
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19 Jul 2017, 11:04 am

I'm really bad about maintaining a schedule to the point of being self destructive sometimes. If I don't have someone constantly reminding me I will just wander aimlessly. So for me its not that I have a compulsion for orderly schedules rather I "need" to keep a routine or I won't get anything done.



Knofskia
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20 Jul 2017, 12:35 pm

starkid wrote:
Not every autistic person has routines. The diagnostic criteria—restricted, repetitive, and/or stereotyped behaviors—can be satisfied with other traits.

This can include:
• Sensory Sensitivities
(e.g. over-reacting to being touched)
Repetitive Body Movements (e.g. hand flapping or toe walking)
Repetitive Object Movements (e.g. spinning wheels on toy cars)
Repetitive Speech (e.g. repeating questions over and over)
Restricted Interests (e.g. reciting facts or train schedules)
Patterns (e.g. lining up and organizing objects)
Organized Belongings (i.e. "A place for everything and everything in its place.")
Rituals (e.g. always using the same chair, plate, bowl, cup, and utensil)
Routines (e.g. always make bed, then use bathroom, and finally eat breakfast)

I have all of these, but not every autistic does. We also do not have each to the same degree. But we do not need to to fit the criteria.
anti_gone wrote:
I wonder how those with executive function disorder can keep their routines? E.g. say you are really, really immersed in your special interest. You are about to discover something new and you are really obsessed and excited and "in the flow". You don't want to stop what you are currently doing. How are you able to follow a routine like having dinner at 6 PM? I mean, wouldn't this interrupt what you are currently doing?

Although I 1) desperately need routines because my executive dysfunction negatively affects my ability to plan, 2) actually do have routines, and 3) get upset if there are any changes to my routines, I still have difficulty following my routines because my executive dysfunction also negatively affects my memory, attention, and self-monitoring. I use alarms, visual schedules, step-by-step instructions, and checklists to mitigate these problems.


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anti_gone
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20 Jul 2017, 1:45 pm

VIDEODROME wrote:
I think a life with routine needs a foundation to build around, otherwise things instead are very adrift like things never being organized or cleaned.

In a strange way, this can also arise from being to critical or perfectionist. By that I mean a person might think they want something done to a certain standard or they have a vision of how it should be done, but it can't be done do to lack of resources needed like Space, Time, or Money.

Maybe you have a very high ideal of a routine life, but Perfectionist, Critical, or All-Or-Nothing thinking comes into play.

There is also the sleep issue, but that might also be the result of more Perfectionism pounding out projects on the PC or doing research.


I can be (quite) perfectionist regarding some things (like spelling in my native language), but otherwise I don't think that's the cause. I don't even have high standards, would be great just to have a routine to brush my teeth twice a day. It's just so difficult not to forget these things, and difficult for me to remember or event define an order (I have also difficulty planing something like shopping groceries...I alway forget to make a list and when I'm at the shop I cannot remember what I wanted to buy, sometimes I don't even have any money with me :D). Otherwise, my memory is quite good. It's just that I totally suck at planning anything and I'm often stuck at things. And when I'm doing thing A, I can't follow routine B at the same time. Maybe my executive functioning is just way more impaired then yours?

I have been trying to tidy up my room now for days. Usually, after some time I keep getting back here just to procrastinate. I feel helpless somehow (now, I'm not perfectionist. would be great if the floor was not covered with stuff and everything was halfway clean. doesn't have to look like Instagram :D)

Quote:
There is also the sleep issue, but that might also be the result of more Perfectionism pounding out projects on the PC or doing research.

Sleep issues have different reasons for me. Sometimes I'm just not tired and don't want to lie awake in bed for too long (and too lazy to do progressive muscle relaxation), sometimes there are things I find more exciting right now (like Netflix) and often enough I negatively obsess about something (spend hours googling some illness e.g., the kind of OCD stuff). Most of the time I don't do anything useful...

Maybe some ADD co-morbidity?



anti_gone
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20 Jul 2017, 1:47 pm

PaperMajora wrote:
This is one of the main things that has made me question if I have ASD or not. I pretty much procrastinate all day (really a bad problem) with no rhyme or reason, and the only thing that's mostly consistent is lunch at 11-1 and my run from 4-5. I'm slowly breaking free of my procrastination problem (yes it's a really crippling serious thing to me) so maybe a more complete schedule will start to form. I do hate it when I DO have something planned and something gets in the way.


So you even have some fix times. I usually don't even look at the clock.



anti_gone
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20 Jul 2017, 1:50 pm

Quote:
Although I 1) desperately need routines because my executive dysfunction negatively affects my ability to plan, 2) actually do have routines, and 3) get upset if there are any changes to my routines, I still have difficulty following my routines because my executive dysfunction also negatively affects my memory, attention, and self-monitoring. I use alarms, visual schedules, step-by-step instructions, and checklists to mitigate these problems.

Problem with checklists for me is: I cannot stand it when some things have ticks beside them and don't. Like ALL of my emails have to be read all the time (which leads to not reading them thoroughly). Again, this is an OCD thing, I know. On every list, all items have to be checked for me. This is NOT perfectionism, this goes for all kind of lists or notifications.

Alarms: Very stressful. Also, I tend to ignore them if I'm really, really stuck.

Step-by-step instructions: Not really tried yet. Maybe I should...

Visual schedules: You mean like calendars?



anti_gone
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20 Jul 2017, 1:55 pm

Sweetleaf wrote:
anti_gone wrote:
Haha, thank you :)

But the lack of routine IS getting in the way. Because I forget my keys, I'm always late, I'm often hungry and thus in bad mood when I shouldn't, I can't get up in the morning because I don't have fixed bed times and not bedtime routine, my flat is a mess... about making a living, I was recently fired, but that had mostly other reasons I guess (even though being late and being too messy certainly contributed).

I have to say, however, that when I'm focused on something like programming, I'm quite eager to stick to the task and to follow some rules.

So, yeah, more routines would definitely help me :D

...


I wonder how those with executive function disorder can keep their routines? E.g. say you are really, really immersed in your special interest. You are about to discover something new and you are really obsessed and excited and "in the flow". You don't want to stop what you are currently doing. How are you able to follow a routine like having dinner at 6 PM? I mean, wouldn't this interrupt what you are currently doing?


I don't go to bed at a regular time on my own...I have to keep track of what time it is and make myself go to bed, to get enough sleep for work. You could try to go to bed a half hour before you need to...I do that so I actually end up going to sleep on time, otherwise I'll be up longer than I plan to.

Also maybe stock up on some healthy snacks, so when you realize you've forgotten to eat you can just munch on something. I forget to eat quite a bit or my appetite just isn't there when it should be and once I am hungry enough it effects my mood I certainly don't want to make anything or navigate a grocery store so a quick snack helps. At my work I don't even have time for an actual lunch so I just bring Cliff bars to eat because they have tasty ones not like dried out granola bars my mom used to buy.


Yeah, snacks are a good thing. I should try to think of that.

Quote:
You could try to go to bed a half hour before you need to...I do that so I actually end up going to sleep on time, otherwise I'll be up longer than I plan to.

Often enough, I know I should get to bed now. It's just the compulsion to do something else, so I think to myself: Ok, ten minutes, but after that I will really, really go to bed. And then after 10 minutes, I don't go to bed, but delay it even further. Really weird.



Knofskia
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21 Jul 2017, 4:42 pm

anti_gone wrote:
Quote:
Although I 1) desperately need routines because my executive dysfunction negatively affects my ability to plan, 2) actually do have routines, and 3) get upset if there are any changes to my routines, I still have difficulty following my routines because my executive dysfunction also negatively affects my memory, attention, and self-monitoring. I use alarms, visual schedules, step-by-step instructions, and checklists to mitigate these problems.

Problem with checklists for me is: I cannot stand it when some things have ticks beside them and don't. Like ALL of my emails have to be read all the time (which leads to not reading them thoroughly). Again, this is an OCD thing, I know. On every list, all items have to be checked for me. This is NOT perfectionism, this goes for all kind of lists or notifications.

Alarms: Very stressful. Also, I tend to ignore them if I'm really, really stuck.

Step-by-step instructions: Not really tried yet. Maybe I should...

Visual schedules: You mean like calendars?

Image
This is a visual schedule.

I should correct my statement: I said I use these tools to mitigate these problems, but actually my attempts are, for the most part, unsuccessful. Either because of the extent of my executive dysfunction, the use of the wrong tools for my needs, or my improper use of these tools, or all of the above, I have failed to improve more than a small portion of the vast neglect to my health and my responsibilities.


_________________
31st of July, 2013
Diagnosed: Autism Spectrum Disorder, Auditory-Verbal Processing Speed Disorder, and Visual-Motor Processing Speed Disorder.

Weak Emerging Social Communicator (The Social Thinking-­Social Communication Profile by Michelle Garcia Winner, Pamela Crooke and Stephanie Madrigal)

"I am silently correcting your grammar." :lol:


anti_gone
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23 Jul 2017, 2:25 pm

Knofskia wrote:
anti_gone wrote:
Quote:
Although I 1) desperately need routines because my executive dysfunction negatively affects my ability to plan, 2) actually do have routines, and 3) get upset if there are any changes to my routines, I still have difficulty following my routines because my executive dysfunction also negatively affects my memory, attention, and self-monitoring. I use alarms, visual schedules, step-by-step instructions, and checklists to mitigate these problems.

Problem with checklists for me is: I cannot stand it when some things have ticks beside them and don't. Like ALL of my emails have to be read all the time (which leads to not reading them thoroughly). Again, this is an OCD thing, I know. On every list, all items have to be checked for me. This is NOT perfectionism, this goes for all kind of lists or notifications.

Alarms: Very stressful. Also, I tend to ignore them if I'm really, really stuck.

Step-by-step instructions: Not really tried yet. Maybe I should...

Visual schedules: You mean like calendars?

Image
This is a visual schedule.

I should correct my statement: I said I use these tools to mitigate these problems, but actually my attempts are, for the most part, unsuccessful. Either because of the extent of my executive dysfunction, the use of the wrong tools for my needs, or my improper use of these tools, or all of the above, I have failed to improve more than a small portion of the vast neglect to my health and my responsibilities.


Thank you for explaining, I've never seen anything like this.

I had also thought about hanging up some lists (without images), but I always wonder what guests would think if they saw them... somehow I find it embarrassing because these things are so trivial for most people :oops:



kraftiekortie
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24 Jul 2017, 6:03 am

If the lists would help you, why not use them?

Yes, there are people who would find them weird should they see them.

Other people (the ones who are friend-worthy), might ask questions--but would accept you for who you are.