What does the non stereotypcial "aspie" look like?

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kicker
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16 Aug 2017, 1:30 pm

Preface:

Since joining I have read thousands of threads and equally replies to threads regarding autism and what people believe to be accurate and inaccurate in it's regard. With the vast majority decisively against perceived stereotypes without explicitly explaining their idea of a non stereotypical person with autism. This has been done for researchers whom individuals here disagree with, movies and TV shows, books, even others who identify as being on the spectrum.

I have seen people argue that being able to be adaptable and non rigid in different environments (situations) and being empathetic is characteristic of people who still fall on the spectrum. While being rigid and non adaptable being portrayed as being stereotypical and in a sense not representative of autism. It has led me to question what exactly do people believe to be an accurate perception of autism.

End Preface

So in that framing I am curious as to what people believe characterizes autism and what a non stereotypical portrayal would look like. Be very specific and avoid using generalized statements such as "They don't rock back and forth." instead write, "They don't rock back and forth, instead they may tap a pencil on a desk or play with their hair by twirling it when they are anxious." Pretend if you will that you are writing a character for a show that would represent what you believe is a non stereotyped representation of autism that someone else will have to act for you.

No answer is incorrect and this isn't a debate as whose portrayal is best and or worst. It is meant as an exercise to fine tune what is the current consensus amongst the users here as to what they believe autism would be like if portrayed/defined accurately. Consider this your chance to work out what the average autistic person looks like, does, doesn't do, behaves, doesn't behave, etc.



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16 Aug 2017, 3:18 pm

The problem with stereotyping autism is that the world doesn't know enough about it to do so. It took science years to even come up with norms for NTs let alone autism.

Autism is like a whole different kind of brain that people barely even know about, so it's wrong to ask what a non stereotypical aspie behaves like even through no one really knows how a stereotypical aspie behaves!(though I think stereotyping in general is bad!)

We are now just realizing that autism is more prevalent in females than we originally thought! So maybe after we can get much more information then we can start trying to figure out a norm for autism.


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16 Aug 2017, 3:43 pm

AquaineBay wrote:
The problem with stereotyping autism is that the world doesn't know enough about it to do so. It took science years to even come up with norms for NTs let alone autism.

Autism is kinda like a whole different kind of brain that people barely even know about, so it's wrong to ask what a non stereotypical aspie behaves like even through no one really knows how a stereotypical aspie behaves!(though I think stereotyping in general is bad!)

We are now just realizing that autism is more prevalent in females than we originally thought! So maybe after we can get much more information then we can start trying to figure out a norm for autism.


Thanks for responding, however I think it is more than fair to ask the question since there is so much being said regarding the unfairness of stereotypes of autism, as I prefaced with. If you are advocating, which it sounds like you are, that autism isn't defined then how would anyone know a stereotype to be a stereotype at all? It could be an accurate representation.

For example the discussion thread about Atypical is loaded with people stating that the show only shows the stereotypical autism. So if people are able to define what is stereotypical it reasons to assume they have an idea of what is non-stereotypical even if the answer may be evolving.



naturalplastic
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16 Aug 2017, 4:23 pm

Are you trolling?

Or just joking?

Is this an attempt at using double-talk for laughs?

Or are you being serious?



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16 Aug 2017, 4:43 pm

kicker wrote:
AquaineBay wrote:
The problem with stereotyping autism is that the world doesn't know enough about it to do so. It took science years to even come up with norms for NTs let alone autism.

Autism is kinda like a whole different kind of brain that people barely even know about, so it's wrong to ask what a non stereotypical aspie behaves like even through no one really knows how a stereotypical aspie behaves!(though I think stereotyping in general is bad!)

We are now just realizing that autism is more prevalent in females than we originally thought! So maybe after we can get much more information then we can start trying to figure out a norm for autism.


Thanks for responding, however I think it is more than fair to ask the question since there is so much being said regarding the unfairness of stereotypes of autism, as I prefaced with. If you are advocating, which it sounds like you are, that autism isn't defined then how would anyone know a stereotype to be a stereotype at all? It could be an accurate representation.

For example the discussion thread about Atypical is loaded with people stating that the show only shows the stereotypical autism. So if people are able to define what is stereotypical it reasons to assume they have an idea of what is non-stereotypical even if the answer may be evolving.


You just confused the mess out of me! Everytime I read this post I literally get confused after the "if you are advocating part". So could you say that again in a simpler way?


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16 Aug 2017, 4:43 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
Are you trolling?

Or just joking?

Is this an attempt at using double-talk for laughs?

Or are you being serious?


I am quite serious. People have been quick to point out that others have stereotypes about autism without defining what is a non-stereotyped presentation so I am very curious as to what a non-stereotypical presentation looks like.



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16 Aug 2017, 4:55 pm

AquaineBay wrote:
kicker wrote:
AquaineBay wrote:
The problem with stereotyping autism is that the world doesn't know enough about it to do so. It took science years to even come up with norms for NTs let alone autism.

Autism is kinda like a whole different kind of brain that people barely even know about, so it's wrong to ask what a non stereotypical aspie behaves like even through no one really knows how a stereotypical aspie behaves!(though I think stereotyping in general is bad!)

We are now just realizing that autism is more prevalent in females than we originally thought! So maybe after we can get much more information then we can start trying to figure out a norm for autism.


Thanks for responding, however I think it is more than fair to ask the question since there is so much being said regarding the unfairness of stereotypes of autism, as I prefaced with. If you are advocating, which it sounds like you are, that autism isn't defined then how would anyone know a stereotype to be a stereotype at all? It could be an accurate representation.

For example the discussion thread about Atypical is loaded with people stating that the show only shows the stereotypical autism. So if people are able to define what is stereotypical it reasons to assume they have an idea of what is non-stereotypical even if the answer may be evolving.


You just confused the mess out of me! Everytime I read this post I literally get confused after the "if you are advocating part". So could you say that again in a simpler way?


I am sorry that it confused you. I simply said that you can't say something isn't defined, yet have a diagnosis let alone a stereotype about it. By your reasoning autism is unknown/undefined therefore there are no stereotypes or even non stereotypes.



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16 Aug 2017, 5:09 pm

A "non stereo type" version of anything is.....something that is opposite of, or is fundamentally different from what ever the stereotype version of that thing is.

And here is the...."kicker" (no pun intended): something (anything) that does not conform to a stereotype can fail to conform to that stereotype for any number of reasons. Vastly different, and even opposite, things can ALL be non stereotypical versions of something that stereotypically comes is one narrow flavor. So a nonstereotypical version of something can be more than one thing.

As an example lets take "Hispanic American citizens". And lets just take body coloration. The stereotype Latino US person is brown skinned but is only brown enough to be called brown, and not darker than that. But actual Latin immigrants to the US actually range in coloration from blue eyed blond European looking folks all of the way to folks who are as Black and as African looking as any Anglo African American.

The stereotypical Latin American looks like George Lopez. But in reality Latin Americans can look like anyone from Taylor Swift to Oprah Winfrey.

So if you were to ask "what does a nonstereotypical Hispanic look like?" there would be no one positive answer. Just the negative answer of "someone who does not look like George Lopez, or like Sofia Vargaras". So its a dumb meaningless question to ask.

The "stereotypical aspie" ( and I'm talking the stereotype in pop culture, not necessarily a clinical stereotype) would be a sitcom character like Sheldon Cooper. A brainaic who puts Einstein and Hawkins in the dust, but who has the social acumen of box of hammers.

So a nonstereotypical aspie would be "someone not like Sheldon Cooper, but who still fits the diagnostic criteria for aspergers". And that would not be just one kind of person. It would be many different types of individuals.



Last edited by naturalplastic on 16 Aug 2017, 6:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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16 Aug 2017, 5:12 pm

As Naturalplastic put it:

A non-stereotypical Aspie doesn't look like the stereotypical one---who looks nerdy, wears somewhat unkempt, unmatched clothes, has a "neckbeard," walks around in a clumsy gait, etc. But it's just a "stereotype." It shouldn't mean that much to an intelligent person. It should be obvious that most Aspies don't fit the "stereotype," though some do.

Most look like a "non-stereotypical" Aspie.



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16 Aug 2017, 5:51 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
A "non stereo type" version of anything is.....something that is opposite of, or is fundamentally different from what ever the stereotype version of that thing is.

And here is the...."kicker" (no pun intended): something (anything) that does not conform to a stereotype can fail to conform to that stereotype for any number of reasons. Vastly different, and even opposite, things can ALL be non stereotypical versions of something that stereotypically comes is one narrow flavor. So a nonstereotypical version of something can be more than one thing.

As an example lets take "Hispanic American citizens". And lets just take body coloration. The stereotype Latino US person is brown skinned but is only brown enough to be called brown, and not darker than that. But actual Latin immigrants to the US actually range in coloration from blue eyed blond European looking folks all of the way to folks who are as Black and as African looking as any Anglo African American.

The stereotypical Latin American looks like George Lopez. But in reality Latin Americans can look like anyone from Taylor Swift to Oprah Winfrey.

So if you were to ask "what does a nonstereotypical Hispanic look like?" there would be no one positive answer. Just the negative answer of "someone who does not look like George Lopez, or like Sofia Vargaras". So its a dumb meaningless question to ask.

The "stereotypical aspie" ( and I'm talking the stereotype in pop culture, not necessarily a clinical stereotype) would be a sitcom character like Sheldon Leonard. A brainaic who puts Einstein and Hawkins in the dust, but who has the social acumen of box of hammers.

So a nonstereotypical aspie would be "someone not like Sheldon Leonard, but who still fits the diagnostic criteria for aspergers". And that would not be just one kind of person. It would be many different types of individuals.


Minor thing, but I believe you mean Sheldon Cooper. Sheldon and Leonard are both characters, but separate ones.


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16 Aug 2017, 6:03 pm

Lost_dragon wrote:
naturalplastic wrote:
A "non stereo type" version of anything is.....something that is opposite of, or is fundamentally different from what ever the stereotype version of that thing is.

And here is the...."kicker" (no pun intended): something (anything) that does not conform to a stereotype can fail to conform to that stereotype for any number of reasons. Vastly different, and even opposite, things can ALL be non stereotypical versions of something that stereotypically comes is one narrow flavor. So a nonstereotypical version of something can be more than one thing.

As an example lets take "Hispanic American citizens". And lets just take body coloration. The stereotype Latino US person is brown skinned but is only brown enough to be called brown, and not darker than that. But actual Latin immigrants to the US actually range in coloration from blue eyed blond European looking folks all of the way to folks who are as Black and as African looking as any Anglo African American.

The stereotypical Latin American looks like George Lopez. But in reality Latin Americans can look like anyone from Taylor Swift to Oprah Winfrey.

So if you were to ask "what does a nonstereotypical Hispanic look like?" there would be no one positive answer. Just the negative answer of "someone who does not look like George Lopez, or like Sofia Vargaras". So its a dumb meaningless question to ask.

The "stereotypical aspie" ( and I'm talking the stereotype in pop culture, not necessarily a clinical stereotype) would be a sitcom character like Sheldon Leonard. A brainaic who puts Einstein and Hawkins in the dust, but who has the social acumen of box of hammers.

So a nonstereotypical aspie would be "someone not like Sheldon Leonard, but who still fits the diagnostic criteria for aspergers". And that would not be just one kind of person. It would be many different types of individuals.


Minor thing, but I believe you mean Sheldon Cooper. Sheldon and Leonard are both characters, but separate ones.


That is correct :D . Sheldon is the more far-gone roommate of the more moderately geeky Leonard.

I think that there IS some person named "Sheldon Leonard" (book author?) out there in the world that I am transposing the BBT characters name with.



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16 Aug 2017, 6:11 pm

naturalplastic wrote:

That is correct :D . Sheldon is the more far-gone roommate of the more moderately geeky Leonard.

I think that there IS some person named "Sheldon Leonard" (book author?) out there in the world that I am transposing the BBT characters name with.


Maybe linking Leonard Nimoy ? that's the way my crazy brain links things up :lol:

or maybe that is illogical :D


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16 Aug 2017, 6:18 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
A "non stereo type" version of anything is.....something that is opposite of, or is fundamentally different from what ever the stereotype version of that thing is.

And here is the...."kicker" (no pun intended): something (anything) that does not conform to a stereotype can fail to conform to that stereotype for any number of reasons. Vastly different, and even opposite, things can ALL be non stereotypical versions of something that stereotypically comes is one narrow flavor. So a nonstereotypical version of something can be more than one thing.

As an example lets take "Hispanic American citizens". And lets just take body coloration. The stereotype Latino US person is brown skinned but is only brown enough to be called brown, and not darker than that. But actual Latin immigrants to the US actually range in coloration from blue eyed blond European looking folks all of the way to folks who are as Black and as African looking as any Anglo African American.

The stereotypical Latin American looks like George Lopez. But in reality Latin Americans can look like anyone from Taylor Swift to Oprah Winfrey.

So if you were to ask "what does a nonstereotypical Hispanic look like?" there would be no one positive answer. Just the negative answer of "someone who does not look like George Lopez, or like Sofia Vargaras". So its a dumb meaningless question to ask.

The "stereotypical aspie" ( and I'm talking the stereotype in pop culture, not necessarily a clinical stereotype) would be a sitcom character like Sheldon Leonard. A brainaic who puts Einstein and Hawkins in the dust, but who has the social acumen of box of hammers.

So a nonstereotypical aspie would be "someone not like Sheldon Leonard, but who still fits the diagnostic criteria for aspergers". And that would not be just one kind of person. It would be many different types of individuals.


I don't think you have the depth of understanding required of the question to answer it as the nonchalant and belittling attitude demonstrated. May I suggest you reread the original post and try again once you have been able to formulate an answer that more represents your views on the subject being discussed rather than your views of me.



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16 Aug 2017, 6:26 pm

The thing about the topic question is that in order to actually answer it you would have too many factors to look at. Environment, race, culture, genetics, etc. Basically it would be the same as asking what is a non-stereotypical NT.

Autism is a type of brain structure(to put it simple), I find it weird that people attempt to stereotype autism, I dare someone to go on a NT website and ask that question for NTs, most wouldn't even bother because it would be an outrageous question!

It's like asking what's a non-stereotypical human.


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16 Aug 2017, 6:29 pm

*deleted*

should learn to keep my mouth shut :roll:


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Last edited by SaveFerris on 16 Aug 2017, 6:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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16 Aug 2017, 6:37 pm

Well .. I was turned off halfway through your OP. And I just did re read the OP all of the way through.

The answer to your question is that a stereotype autistic person has all of the diagnostic traits of autism.
A nonstereotype autistic just has four out of five of those traits ( or whatever percentage- and there is such a percentage- that clinician tick off to give the diagnosis). BUT....us nonstereotypical folks each have a DIFFERENT four out five of those traits. So we all "look" as different from each other as we do from a "stereotypical" autistic (or aspie, or whatever).

So again- as I said before-you can not state "what a nonstereotypical Anything (automobile, baby, or aspie)" looks like as if it were one thing with one face.