Fascism/Communism not just horseshoe - they ARE the same!

Page 2 of 4 [ 53 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next

shlaifu
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 26 May 2014
Age: 40
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,659

17 Aug 2017, 10:59 am

rick sanchez wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Dinesh D'Souza w/ Stefan Molyneux

[/quoWow

Wow, that is exceptionally stupid.



I only now made it through the whole thing. yes, it's impressively dumb.
First time I heard someone call hitler a bohemian.
First time I heard someone call the nazis "left", and libertarians/neo-cons "right". (btw. left-wing/right-wing is a nomenclature that is historical, describing the sides on which the factions were seated in the national assembly at times of the french revolution. left were the revolutionaries who wanted rule of the people, right the monarchists who wanted a divine leader. And that's how it stayed: progressives here, traditionalists there.)

edit: read a bit about D'Souza, and this is on his wikipedia:
D'Souza has argued the Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse scandal was a result of "the sexual immodesty of liberal America." He further asserted that the conditions of prisoners at Abu Ghraib "are comparable to the accommodations in mid-level Middle Eastern hotels." [53][54]

so... yeah, he's a nut-job, I guess, to whom I just listened for an hour. I keep forgetting that youtube is no different from just any street corner, where your average schizoid sits and drinks and rants all day.
The one I passed by yesterday, IRL, was shouting stuff about how the catholic church covers up child abuse- which one should think about more often, really.


_________________
I can read facial expressions. I did the test.


KagamineLen
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jun 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,633

17 Aug 2017, 12:08 pm

Of course the op of this thread is a supporter of D'Souza. He already had made it clear that he believes people who protest against Nazis are inherently bad.



techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,150
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi

17 Aug 2017, 12:20 pm

One of the greatest gifts that a crazy person can give the sane is to wear their craziness on their sleeve.


_________________
“Love takes off the masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within. I use the word "love" here not merely in the personal sense but as a state of being, or a state of grace - not in the infantile American sense of being made happy but in the tough and universal sense of quest and daring and growth.” - James Baldwin


KagamineLen
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jun 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,633

17 Aug 2017, 12:21 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
One of the greatest gifts that a crazy person can give the sane is to wear their craziness on their sleeve.


There is nothing more insane than crying about how Nazis deserve legitimacy.



adifferentname
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,885

17 Aug 2017, 12:46 pm

KagamineLen wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
One of the greatest gifts that a crazy person can give the sane is to wear their craziness on their sleeve.


There is nothing more insane than crying about how Nazis deserve legitimacy.


Unlike the sane and rational legitimacy you're granting them by using them as a straw-representative of anyone who disagrees with you?

:roll:



KagamineLen
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jun 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,633

17 Aug 2017, 12:49 pm

adifferentname wrote:
KagamineLen wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
One of the greatest gifts that a crazy person can give the sane is to wear their craziness on their sleeve.


There is nothing more insane than crying about how Nazis deserve legitimacy.


Unlike the sane and rational legitimacy you're granting them by using them as a straw-representative of anyone who disagrees with you?

:roll:


Don't say I didn't tell you so when neo Nazi violence escalates in America.



adifferentname
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,885

17 Aug 2017, 12:58 pm

KagamineLen wrote:
adifferentname wrote:
KagamineLen wrote:
techstepgenr8tion wrote:
One of the greatest gifts that a crazy person can give the sane is to wear their craziness on their sleeve.


There is nothing more insane than crying about how Nazis deserve legitimacy.


Unlike the sane and rational legitimacy you're granting them by using them as a straw-representative of anyone who disagrees with you?

:roll:


Don't say I didn't tell you so when neo Nazi violence escalates in America.


You assume I expect anything else. Where we differ is on our understanding of the cause.

That is to say, I do and you seem not to. I might even be tempted to elaborate if I weren't already convinced by your recent posts that this would be a thorough waste of my time. This should stand doubly as a reminder that one reaps what one sows.

Should...



KagamineLen
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jun 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,633

17 Aug 2017, 1:01 pm

Give the Nazis an inch, and they'll take your life. Remember that.



techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,150
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi

17 Aug 2017, 1:21 pm

KagamineLen wrote:
Give the Nazis an inch, and they'll take your life. Remember that.

And by the ever-broadening definition of nazi we'll all be dead.


_________________
“Love takes off the masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within. I use the word "love" here not merely in the personal sense but as a state of being, or a state of grace - not in the infantile American sense of being made happy but in the tough and universal sense of quest and daring and growth.” - James Baldwin


KagamineLen
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jun 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,633

17 Aug 2017, 1:23 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
KagamineLen wrote:
Give the Nazis an inch, and they'll take your life. Remember that.

And by the ever-broadening definition of nazi we'll all be dead.


If you wave around swastika flags while pulling off Roman salutes, you are a Nazi.

Or are you seriously trying to argue otherwise?



techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,150
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi

17 Aug 2017, 1:32 pm

Police departments don't hire heroin addicts to watch their search and seizure vaults.

I'm sure I can come up with more homemade Chinese proverbs as the day goes on. :)


_________________
“Love takes off the masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within. I use the word "love" here not merely in the personal sense but as a state of being, or a state of grace - not in the infantile American sense of being made happy but in the tough and universal sense of quest and daring and growth.” - James Baldwin


KagamineLen
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Jun 2012
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,633

17 Aug 2017, 1:38 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
Police departments don't hire heroin addicts to watch their search and seizure vaults.

I'm sure I can come up with more homemade Chinese proverbs as the day goes on. :)


Nope. The police hire people who stage scenarios where Nazi violence is certain to erupt instead. Just so Trump could use it to further his agenda.



techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,150
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi

17 Aug 2017, 1:40 pm

KagamineLen wrote:
Nope. The police hire people who stage scenarios where Nazi violence is certain to erupt instead. Just so Trump could use it to further his agenda.

True, the governor and mayor are southern democrats after all.


_________________
“Love takes off the masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within. I use the word "love" here not merely in the personal sense but as a state of being, or a state of grace - not in the infantile American sense of being made happy but in the tough and universal sense of quest and daring and growth.” - James Baldwin


techstepgenr8tion
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,150
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi

17 Aug 2017, 4:05 pm

There's something else and this might be a good time to add it:

I have been listening to Stefan Molyneux a lot in the past couple days and what I'd say is that he's a mixed bag. I do think he's approaching his own thought processes with a lot of honesty but I do also think that he can get a bit lost in some of the moralisms. I was, for example listening to him talk to a guy about problems with foreign migrants in the UK and cultural Balkanization. Stefan's suggestion is that our top sin in the west is our welfare system and that once that goes away or burns itself out (due to the state's inability to pay) the people on the system at that point who were from other countries would, in the case of high IQ, stay and be productive or, in the case of low IQ, go home or find some other way of melting into the background. That last part obviously seems a bit wishful just like it also doesn't explain what then happens to the ethnic poor of that country as well, and it gets nowhere near the automation bomb that'll be hitting our economy and that if we've been doing the welfare state perniciously for all this time tough luck - we'll need UBI or something like it soon just to have social order and if Stefan thinks that the welfare system, along with politicians desire for votes, is in and of itself the driver of immigration I have no idea what he's suggesting we do once we have 35-40% of people either permanently displaced from the labor economy or unable to hold down enough minimum wage jobs to make ends meet.

I think this is where I just say I aim for novel ideas, evaluating them, and I can take or leave - usually eventually leave - the messenger. For what it's worth I tend to see ideas as transient rather than properly having one group or thinker's DNA necessarily unless we're talking about religious customs, laws, etc.. which are primarily tribal or cultural.

As for anyone saying that Stefan is a crackpot or that Dinesh is an ex-con, that's great but I suppose it's not really my concern. I think the main thing I wanted to look at is the idea that the notion of communism and fascism as dipole opposites is a fiction. Even the horseshoe analogy seems like an attempt to try massaging a destructive tautology (ie. that they're opposites) when I don't even know that the tautology is necessary or even helpful to begin with. I strongly advocate holding both views responsible for their horrors in the 20th century and even taking them as a joint monstrosity, the main differences being circumstantial - ie. one tending to target race or foreign powers, the other targeting some layer of class or whoever the 'kulaks' are decided to be.


_________________
“Love takes off the masks that we fear we cannot live without and know we cannot live within. I use the word "love" here not merely in the personal sense but as a state of being, or a state of grace - not in the infantile American sense of being made happy but in the tough and universal sense of quest and daring and growth.” - James Baldwin


rick sanchez
Pileated woodpecker
Pileated woodpecker

User avatar

Joined: 21 May 2017
Age: 39
Gender: Male
Posts: 185

17 Aug 2017, 5:39 pm

techstepgenr8tion wrote:
One of the greatest gifts that a crazy person can give the sane is to wear their craziness on their sleeve.


Yep, same reason s**t stinks, so you know not to eat it.


_________________
Peace among worlds!


Sweetleaf
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 6 Jan 2011
Age: 34
Gender: Female
Posts: 34,440
Location: Somewhere in Colorado

17 Aug 2017, 6:11 pm

Well that is false...of course soviet style communism could be described as just as bad as fascism. But communism and fascism aren't different words for the same thing.

That said with all the neo-nazis crawling out of their caves, I think fascism is more of a concern than communism.


_________________
We won't go back.