30 Aug 2017, 8:04 pm
ASPartOfMe wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
johnnyh wrote:
ASPartOfMe wrote:
Overhyping autistics as gifted has drawbacks but in a lot of respects it is the "lesser evil". When we were thought of as diseased and not really quite human we were institutionalized and the subject of drug experiments. That does not sound compassionate to me.
"we" weren't the only people institutionalized. And it is a disorder/disease of the brain.
Schizophrenics, bipolar people, alzheimers, brain damaged, fetal alcohol syndrome, OCD. Do they also have a gift? Of all the disorders, autism is somehow special that people insist it is a good thing, but nobody says a single word of the others.
What a joke.
Back in the day most "mental defectives" or "mental cripples" as people with all sorts of conditions were called were either institutionilized, locked in attic, or thrown away into the streets. Autistics and thier families due to that fact that autism was a new concept and the "refrigerator mother" theory got a special kind hell. All sorts of drug experiments were done on autstics. Thier parents (mothers mostly) were perscribed years of therapy to try and find what they did to thier kid and why they hated him so much. Parents were told to get rid any reminders of the autistic child. This harm was done out of compassion. The home was considered so toxic it was thought removal from that environment forever was for the best. The drug experiments were justified as trying to bring back the humanity of the person that was taken away by thier mom. The shock treatments of the original Applied Behavoial Therapy was justified by Ivan Lovass as the compassionate thing to do because it was better then the treatments of that era.
Today there are all these nice politically correct diversity words used. But you have to see what they do not what they say. For the most part ABA is far removed from what it was in 1965. But it still usually requires 25 to 40 hours a week and is pretty much the go to treatment for Autistic Kids. Disregarding the controversy of whether ABA is a good treatment forcing any toddler or younger to do something all those hours is cruel. If ABA is so wonderful it should be the standard treatment for most behavioral issues. But is used mainly on autistic kids and not because they think autism is a gift.
Yes I agree seeing Autism as a gift only and the media stereotypes of autistics as cute, socially awkward brainiacs is harmful. It causes people to see autistics (really Aspie/HFA autistics) as spoiled brats that do not need help but to just try harder. Which is not all that different from back in the day when most of us were not recognized. That said I stand by my earlier statement that seeing autism only as a gift is GENRALLY less evil than horrible mutation it has been traditionally seen as. Of course it would be actually good if Autism was seen as many things are in life a mixture of bad, good and everything in between, pretty horrible for some, something to deal with and still be succesful with for others. For some reason I do not understand it can't be that way. It has to be a superpower or a horrible a damaging mutation so bad anything can be justified as compassion.
Cry me a river. Institutionalization and creul treatment went on for ages to many people with different disorders. You still haven't replied to my question why schizophrenics etc. dont view their condition as gifts or have a neurodiversity movement.
And again you are trying to pull "middle of the road" crap. Running over 10 people instead of zero or 20 isnt somehow the best option. Im giving you one more chance to answer my question about why people with other disorders feel no need for this histrionic sacharrine nonsense. Are they stupid somehow for not embracing their alzheimers, ocd, schizophrrnia, brain damage, etc?
Come on, shoot, let me see what you have to say.
You have to ask them or read a survey about their views on their condition. Since on WP I cry myself a river about autistics not being asked how they feel and not bieng involved in a lot of Autism policy decision making it would be pretty hypocritical of me to speak for them. I know society in general and myself make negative assumptions about living with those conditions based on stereotypes, partial truth, and my experiences. I do not read thier forums.
As an autistic I am not supposed to think middle of the road. But from bieng told I am too negative and just from reading about bieng with and hearing people talking varoius conditions mental and physical for almost six decades most people experience good and bad. I have been on WP pretty constantly for four years and the topic of how do you feel comes about autism up all the time. I have read plenty of writings from neurodiversity advocates as well as oppenents. Where this idea that ND advocates think Autism is a mostly a gift comes from I do not know. Sure on occasion you have a poster mocking NT's as inferior and claiming Autism is the next stage in evolution. Pretty much all the leading ND advocates call it a disability. The experiences of WP posters vary greatly. Many if not most posters say Autism is a lot of challegers but describe benifits also. I am not going to say this is what autism is because this is how I experience it.
Maybe just maybe Autism is different and not as generally as negative as those other conditions. Maybe everybody labled Autism has different conditions. We just know only some of the facts because this is all relatively new.
I have not heard about rights movements for the specific conditions you mentioned. There has been a general disability rights movement for decades. The closest to the Autism Rights/ND movement I can think of is the Deaf community
They have right's movements, but not pride movements. Also they also deny things are wrong with them (typical of mental disorders or abnormalities) but professionals do not listen to them and go ahead and treat them. It's only autism the professionals have learned to bow down and cater to their patients as special snowflakes even when their symptoms cause disruptions.
Autism is as bad as those other disorders. Both for the person and the people around him. It's evolutionary disadvantageous for lord's sake. Unless you are willing to bring good arguments to the table with evidence backing it up. Hold your postmodernist subjectivity and romanticism. I try to argue and debate you and you respond with "Feelings".
I've read everything else, and you should go to their forums and see how they view things, how they are treated. Many do get discriminated against too but don't resort to pseudo-science or idiocy.
And now people troll autistic people on the internet and use it as a slur because yall've made everyone lose sympathy or pity with your flagrant celebration and pride movements. Autism is a slur because so many of yall keep thinking you are badass when you just looks like asses.
30 Aug 2017, 9:48 pm
30 Aug 2017, 9:57 pm
31 Aug 2017, 1:01 am
31 Aug 2017, 2:39 am
31 Aug 2017, 2:56 am
31 Aug 2017, 7:47 am
31 Aug 2017, 7:51 am
ASPartOfMe
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Age: 66
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Posts: 34,462
Location: Long Island, New York
31 Aug 2017, 1:53 pm
johnnyh wrote:
B19 wrote:
A man who was very probably autistic saved millions of lives. His name was Alan Turing. Without ASD input, chemistry would never have advanced as quickly as it did, and so on and so on. But you don't seem to want to look at any positives at all, or perhaps you just can't see them.
By and large, Wrong Planet is a support site (source: Alex). Insulting other members is the antithesis of its support ethos, so please express your views in ways that don't cast aspersions on members who disagree with you, it would be appreciated.
By and large, Wrong Planet is a support site (source: Alex). Insulting other members is the antithesis of its support ethos, so please express your views in ways that don't cast aspersions on members who disagree with you, it would be appreciated.
You didnt reply to my post! Ah well, i will reply to this. Diagnosing someone from the past is tricky. And you dont onow if they were autistic while being skilled. It seems so masochustic to not take credit for an achievement but to dedicate it to Autism, the holy god thing.
Stephen Hawking has a muscular disorder, Hemingway was bipolar, John Nash was schizophrenic, Brian Wilson is schizoaffective, whatever. A person can be disabled and be talented. Turing, if he was supposedly autistic, should be praised instead for achieving in spite of a handicap.
Dont forget Adam Lanza was also autistic, so was Rodger.
I am not a fan of retro and celebrity diagnosing either. At most, you can say the historical figures had a number of Autistic traits and that shows you can accomplish both great and horrible things with autistic traits.
Adam Lanza was diagnosed at Yale autism center and showed numerous core traits. With Elliot Rodger a psych hired by one parent said he had it a psych hired by the other said he did not. I do not think he was formally diagnosed. At the time several articles said he had it but within a few days they removed the mention of Aspergers from the articles.
johnnyh wrote:
And now people troll autistic people on the internet and use it as a slur because yall've made everyone lose sympathy or pity with your flagrant celebration and pride movements. Autism is a slur because so many of yall keep thinking you are badass when you just looks like asses.
This is called blaming the victim. A person gay or straight gets gay bashed and it is the fault of the gay rights movement and all those gay celebrities bringing attention?
I agree autism is a slur because autism is very public now. Bullies are attracted to anything that sticks out as different. Right now autism is very public so we stick out. The ND movement in public is very recent. Autism has been prominent in the news for a couple of decades. The ND movement is the least of the reasons why this happened. The main reason autism is so visible is the prevalence rate has gone up so much that at this point most people know somebody or knows somebody that knows somebody that is autistic and that includes the media. All this has done is changed what the bullying victim is being called when they are getting the crap beat out of them. Now it is autistic instead of ret*d or spazz or homo. Viewing ourselves as flawed horribly disabled people did not do us any good because we stuck out anyway so why keep doing the same thing?
Every change the occurs happens because people do stuff that brings them attention plenty of it negative.
01 Sep 2017, 1:57 pm
02 Sep 2017, 7:52 am
07 Sep 2017, 10:13 pm
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