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K_Kelly
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21 Sep 2017, 7:15 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:

Oh ... is that so?

In that case, we are overdue for a change. Remember: The elites want political stagnation. When society moves forward, it is usually the result of populist outcry. Watch the documentary "Hypernormalization" by Adam Curtis. America has been in a state of political stasis for several decades. While you're at it, you should watch everything else by Adam Curtis since he is a genius.

Both Obama and Trump got elected because they promised to shake up the system. Obama just repeated the words "Hope" and "Change" and people loved it! They loved it because they wanted change. Trump won because he, again, seemed like someone who would make stuff change. The people want change!

Nether of them ended up making significant changes because they were bought out by the corporate elites. With Obama, this was a tragedy, since the guy dabbled in Marxism when he was a lad. With Trump ... well ... we should have seen that coming, since he practically advertises himself as a real-world Scrooge McDuck.

In other words, America's state of political stasis is, arguably, continuing under Trump. He is just using foul language in order to make himself look like a rebel.

When Trump got elected, Return of Kings (a notorious far-right, pro-Trump website) made an article entitled "How the Media Could Have Stopped Trump". The article basically said "The liberal media should have accused Trump of being a typical politician posing as a maverick." I agree with RoK on this one, except that the "liberal" media had no reason to call Trump a poser. That would have broken up their pro-corporate narrative. The "liberal" media is run by rich people who didn't really have anything at stake during that last election. MSNBC and CNN are not really scared of Trump. Those networks are controlled by rich bastards who aren't really suffering as a result of the Trump presidency. Bernie was a threat to them though. That's why the "liberal" media drew attention away from him and acted as though Clinton's victory was inevitable.

Meanwhile, Noam Chomsky was saying "The other Republican candidates are not that different from Trump." even before Trump won the nomination. Stay woke Chomsky! 8)

America will vote for a social democrat once they realize that Trump is a false maverick. We are still in the period of hypernormalization. Bernie is the cure.

We can move forward every 3 generations? I'm pretty sure that our state of political stagnation has been going since the end of WW2. Our time is coming.


I usually agree more with the right than the people on the left, even though I safely say that I hate both Republicans and Democrats. I know you walk with pride as an "anti-corporate" leftist thinker, are you registered with a party or are you independent? Sigh, I guess you don't really need to like major large corporations to support free enterprise, though.

But I'm losing even more respect for the democrats than I ever had. It seems like the democrats are becoming more similar to a dangerous cult than a movement that should be treated seriously. It even seems that those on the left who are otherwise independent or third party don't have enough credibility to support them wholesale as candidates. I'm sorry, I know that the left doesn't want or hates Trump. But still realize that the way a lot on the left are reacting and also calling for his forced removal/impeachment is naive immaturity in the very least. How can you honestly believe your opponent (or "enemy" may be more appropriate) is a name-calling, immature monster idiot, when a lot of supporters on your side are similar?

But, to be fair with what OP said, Trump's political career is no more than <8 years from being over. The political longevity of Hillary is by her days in local and state office. Trump is only a few, if any, he's the one who didn't really do the leg work. The man was already an "elite" background mogul and TV host in years past.



DarthMetaKnight
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21 Sep 2017, 8:16 pm

K_Kelly wrote:
I usually agree more with the right than the people on the left, even though I safely say that I hate both Republicans and Democrats. I know you walk with pride as an "anti-corporate" leftist thinker, are you registered with a party or are you independent?


Independent

I follow principles, not a party.

Quote:
But I'm losing even more respect for the democrats than I ever had. It seems like the democrats are becoming more similar to a dangerous cult than a movement that should be treated seriously. It even seems that those on the left who are otherwise independent or third party don't have enough credibility to support them wholesale as candidates.


Bernie Sanders has been an active leftist for most of his life. He's also the most popular politician in America. It's only a matter of time.

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I'm sorry, I know that the left doesn't want or hates Trump. But still realize that the way a lot on the left are reacting and also calling for his forced removal/impeachment is naive immaturity in the very least.


Yeah. Removing Trump is a bit of a longshot. I still think it's worth a try.

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How can you honestly believe your opponent (or "enemy" may be more appropriate) is a name-calling, immature monster idiot, when a lot of supporters on your side are similar?


Most of the loonies on the left are at least trying to fight for equality. Additionally, most lefties aren't putting the fate of the earth in jeopardy.

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But, to be fair with what OP said, Trump's political career is no more than <8 years from being over. The political longevity of Hillary is by her days in local and state office. Trump is only a few, if any, he's the one who didn't really do the leg work. The man was already an "elite" background mogul and TV host in years past.


They're both corporate shills.

Yes, Clinton isn't as bad a Trump. She's still awful.


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auntblabby
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21 Sep 2017, 8:25 pm

in our rotten political system, "isn't as bad" counts for a LOT. :o



DarthMetaKnight
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21 Sep 2017, 8:41 pm

auntblabby wrote:
in our rotten political system, "isn't as bad" counts for a LOT. :o

Auntblabby, with all due respect, could you please stop missing the point?

I didn't even make this thread to compare Clinton and Trump. I primarily made this thread to compare Clinton and Sanders.

Clinton's retirement is a good thing. It's good because plenty of American politicians are more progressive than she is. Hopefully, her replacement will be a real liberal.

I'm glad that people voted for Clinton when Trump was the only realistic alternative. That era is over now.

Bernie is a candidate who is actually good. He is going to run in 2020. We need to ensure that he wins. That's our task at the moment.

The 2016 election is over. It's time to move on and prepare for the next one, because we've got a LOT of work to do.


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K_Kelly
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21 Sep 2017, 10:25 pm

DarthMetaKnight wrote:
auntblabby wrote:
in our rotten political system, "isn't as bad" counts for a LOT. :o

Auntblabby, with all due respect, could you please stop missing the point?

I didn't even make this thread to compare Clinton and Trump. I primarily made this thread to compare Clinton and Sanders.

Clinton's retirement is a good thing. It's good because plenty of American politicians are more progressive than she is. Hopefully, her replacement will be a real liberal.

I'm glad that people voted for Clinton when Trump was the only realistic alternative. That era is over now.

Bernie is a candidate who is actually good. He is going to run in 2020. We need to ensure that he wins. That's our task at the moment.

The 2016 election is over. It's time to move on and prepare for the next one, because we've got a LOT of work to do.


Okay, well thanks for clarifying your OP DarthMetaKnight :)

Now I understand what you're saying. I wouldn't "let" (read: recommend) anyone gamble on Bernie Sanders as a candidate. Even if you could get some of us who lean more on the right or even middle-of-the-road voters who are still more liberal on some issues, to get behind supporting a democrat or liberal candidate (not for me at this point in a million years, despite the pain of your objection), I can't stand behind supporting a candidate who is knocking on the door to their 80's. So he shouldn't be a "good" candidate at all, whether you support his platform ideology or not.



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21 Sep 2017, 10:42 pm

K_Kelly wrote:
I can't stand behind supporting a candidate who is knocking on the door to their 80's. So he shouldn't be a "good" candidate at all, whether you support his platform ideology or not.


Sanders will have no difficulty finding a competent vice president. There are plenty of other people who agree with Sanders on nearly every issue.

If Sanders dies in office, he'll doubtlessly have a younger replacement.


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DarthMetaKnight
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22 Sep 2017, 12:00 am

Good news! Clinton finally said something right!


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BaalChatzaf
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22 Sep 2017, 10:46 am

DarthMetaKnight wrote:
It's not even a prediction anymore! She's thrown in the towel!

It's time for a musical celebration!

Let the era of Bernie commence! We can't let another corporate "liberal" take over!
Perhaps we will need to wait until 2024. Perhaps Trump will get impeached before then. Either way, our time to work for the future is now. Our time to wake people up is now.

I'm not just talking about American liberals. This shall be a global effort, since the American military-industrial complex is ruining the entire world.

"The working men have no country. We cannot take away from them what they have not got. "


Like in the Wizard of Oz --- Ding Dong, the Witch is dead, the wicked Witch is dead....


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22 Sep 2017, 10:59 am

I'd rather have an eighty year old man that was competent in charge of the country than a fifty year old dumb ass.
If a person is dumb as a box of rocks at fifty,it's just not going to get any better.Where I live has a large population of elderly.I've seen plenty of octogenarians still sharp of mind.
Ageism,funny how the young don't like to be judged on their lack of life experience,but they are willing to assume all elderly people are senile and incontinent.


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