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What can I do to help my brother get women more?

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drwho222
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06 Oct 2017, 4:52 pm

ironpony wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Sweetleaf wrote:
ironpony wrote:
My brother has been feeling very lonely when it comes to the opposite sex and I talked about it before in this previous thread from months ago:

https://wrongplanet.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=334869

But I was thinking maybe it's time I try to help him get some dates. However, he doesn't act like the majority of women would want him to act. He is not an 'alpha-male', or suave at all, and I want to teach him, but since he is autistic and has trouble with social skills, is there anything I can do or any type of approach I should take?


Well he'd probably be better off with less typical women...if he's not an 'alpha male' then it wont help to try to pretend to be one just to attract a women who likes that. A better goal would be for him to be his best self not put on an entirely different false persona. What kinds of things is he interested and what activities does he do?


But almost all women want an alpha male. Even years ago, when I would be myself around women I would go through hundreds of women over the years and never got a single one. Then I started to read books on how to get women, took on the alpha male persona, and I got women here and there, and finally got dates and relationships, after getting good at it enough.

So it's just the price you have to pay to get women, or at least not being alpha male-ish has never worked for me in my experience.


I am going to challenge that. My son is in no way an alpha male yet there have always been girls that like him. He didn't always see it, but I could. Even if he didn't know what flirting looked like, I did and my sisters did. He's just an average kind of guy looks wise and even has some grooming habits I find distasteful, but I think he is also what people view as accessible, ie easy to start a conversation with and not intimidating. He's done a lot of social skills training, his sister has nagged him on his worst grooming habits, and we've all talked to him about how to behave around women. I don't think he has ever asked a crush out cold; everyone is a "friend" until they make it beyond obvious they want to date him. He isn't into sports or rock concerts; he's a Magic and DnD kind of guy who also loves to hike, bike and eat out, the last 3 of which make decent dating opportunities. But he is also someone who regularly engages in leadership roles in the various clubs he joins, and in that way he is visible and, again, I think, accessible. He is also clearly smart, and not afraid to talk in class. People notice him, and its usually positive. Whether or not people falsely think he'll be the next Bill Gates, that I can't say; he is pretty clear about not caring about success or money (he has good income earning prospects regardless, but will probably become a teacher). It seems to work; he currently has a pretty serious girl friend.

For those who haven't recently had preteen daughters in the house, understand that TV shows and movies geared to the tween set often romanticize, for better or worse, the awkward smart kid. A lot more girls go for the type than used to. I understand that the stereotype severely limits how many people can benefit from it, but I would assume that for a lot of ASD guys it is a more realistic projection than the alpha male model.

I would suggest working on social skills, grooming and creating an accessible (non-threatening but somewhat attractive) presence. I would also suggest doing things that help a person get noticed in a positive way: taking on leadership roles in clubs and volunteer organizations, for example. Excelling in hobbies and exhibiting the results. Etc.


Oh okay. I'm just going by own personal experience, and I never got positive results from women, until I act all alpha male-ish. For some reason it's been like that for me.

As for finding him an aspie girl, where would I find them, especially since it's very much less common in women compared to men, I hear.

I gotta say though, this is complete opposite advice than what I got when asking other people. Other people say he is better off with a neurotypical woman, cause if he goes with an autistic or aspie girl, they will have even more trouble communicating with each other as a couple, and the lack of communication and progress would be double, therefore.


I met mine at Comic Con. She started the conversation. We click and understand each other on ever level. I thank God for her every day.



ironpony
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08 Oct 2017, 9:15 pm

Okay thanks. I tried a dating site for people with Aspurgers but there were only 2 members on the site. I read that only 1% of the world population have it. If that's true, he would be severely limiting his options. He already had trouble getting women and telling him to boycott the remaining 99% of women, seems like it limit his chances much higher.

I have autism too and I considered boycotting neurotypical at one point, and I was told not too cause my chances would severely decrease if I date autistic women only, and I can see why, especially if the neurotypical population is as high as 99%!

I mean he could try boycotting that much and just sticking to the 1%, but I wouldn't know where he would find them.



drwho222
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09 Oct 2017, 12:51 pm

ironpony wrote:
Okay thanks. I tried a dating site for people with Aspurgers but there were only 2 members on the site. I read that only 1% of the world population have it. If that's true, he would be severely limiting his options. He already had trouble getting women and telling him to boycott the remaining 99% of women, seems like it limit his chances much higher.

I have autism too and I considered boycotting neurotypical at one point, and I was told not too cause my chances would severely decrease if I date autistic women only, and I can see why, especially if the neurotypical population is as high as 99%!

I mean he could try boycotting that much and just sticking to the 1%, but I wouldn't know where he would find them.


He will never be happy with an NT girl. NT females are by and large catty shrews that view men only as a source of resources. When NT females marry NT guys it doesn't usually end well--high divorce rates, they stop having sex by year four, etc. An NT girl will demand that he make all kinds of lifestyle changes to suit her, which seem perfectly natural to her because she is NT! His needs wont be taken into account because he is "strange" and expected to fit the NT norm. The ASPartners hate site is full of people like this. And of course they think a relationship between two Aspies wont work! Because they don't get us at all and don't care to!

Many Aspie males have the unfortunate curse of a strong sex drive coupled to a complete inability to make sex happen. Do NT males have relationships just for sex? Sure. But they have the social skills to disguise this and make the sex happen. For many Aspie males prostitutes are the only viable option to easily get this, because you are right, Aspie females are hard to find.



blast335
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09 Oct 2017, 2:12 pm

Marknis wrote:
The "bro" culture is not aspie friendly at all and needs to be avoided. Please encourage your brother to follow his passions and expand his knowledge. Saying things like "You need to get your dick wet!" like my jerk of an older brother did will just hurt him even more. I refuse to go anywhere that reeks of "bro" or alpha male culture due to the damage it caused me and I refuse to smoke or drink (Besides the occasional wine or champagne or sweet drink).


And how!
(Also I find your profile pic a bit ironic given this post.)


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DW_a_mom
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09 Oct 2017, 4:49 pm

drwho222 wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Okay thanks. I tried a dating site for people with Aspurgers but there were only 2 members on the site. I read that only 1% of the world population have it. If that's true, he would be severely limiting his options. He already had trouble getting women and telling him to boycott the remaining 99% of women, seems like it limit his chances much higher.

I have autism too and I considered boycotting neurotypical at one point, and I was told not too cause my chances would severely decrease if I date autistic women only, and I can see why, especially if the neurotypical population is as high as 99%!

I mean he could try boycotting that much and just sticking to the 1%, but I wouldn't know where he would find them.


He will never be happy with an NT girl. NT females are by and large catty shrews that view men only as a source of resources. When NT females marry NT guys it doesn't usually end well--high divorce rates, they stop having sex by year four, etc. An NT girl will demand that he make all kinds of lifestyle changes to suit her, which seem perfectly natural to her because she is NT! His needs wont be taken into account because he is "strange" and expected to fit the NT norm. The ASPartners hate site is full of people like this. And of course they think a relationship between two Aspies wont work! Because they don't get us at all and don't care to!

Many Aspie males have the unfortunate curse of a strong sex drive coupled to a complete inability to make sex happen. Do NT males have relationships just for sex? Sure. But they have the social skills to disguise this and make the sex happen. For many Aspie males prostitutes are the only viable option to easily get this, because you are right, Aspie females are hard to find.


I don't think you can generalize like that. My son's girlfriend isn't the type of NT you are envisioning. The NT population is extremely diverse. The key is making sure both partners are on the same page and capable of meeting each other's needs, whatever those are.

I am happy to read you have your person. There does seem to be a lot of luck involved, doens't there? I am grateful I found mine, too.


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blast335
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12 Oct 2017, 8:23 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
drwho222 wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Okay thanks. I tried a dating site for people with Aspurgers but there were only 2 members on the site. I read that only 1% of the world population have it. If that's true, he would be severely limiting his options. He already had trouble getting women and telling him to boycott the remaining 99% of women, seems like it limit his chances much higher.

I have autism too and I considered boycotting neurotypical at one point, and I was told not too cause my chances would severely decrease if I date autistic women only, and I can see why, especially if the neurotypical population is as high as 99%!

I mean he could try boycotting that much and just sticking to the 1%, but I wouldn't know where he would find them.


He will never be happy with an NT girl. NT females are by and large catty shrews that view men only as a source of resources. When NT females marry NT guys it doesn't usually end well--high divorce rates, they stop having sex by year four, etc. An NT girl will demand that he make all kinds of lifestyle changes to suit her, which seem perfectly natural to her because she is NT! His needs wont be taken into account because he is "strange" and expected to fit the NT norm. The ASPartners hate site is full of people like this. And of course they think a relationship between two Aspies wont work! Because they don't get us at all and don't care to!

Many Aspie males have the unfortunate curse of a strong sex drive coupled to a complete inability to make sex happen. Do NT males have relationships just for sex? Sure. But they have the social skills to disguise this and make the sex happen. For many Aspie males prostitutes are the only viable option to easily get this, because you are right, Aspie females are hard to find.


I don't think you can generalize like that. My son's girlfriend isn't the type of NT you are envisioning. The NT population is extremely diverse. The key is making sure both partners are on the same page and capable of meeting each other's needs, whatever those are.

I am happy to read you have your person. There does seem to be a lot of luck involved, doens't there? I am grateful I found mine, too.


I agree, you can't generalize NT's like that, just like how they can't generalize us. I know plenty of NT women who aren't like that. (Of course I know an equal number who are, but my point still stands).


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SportsGamer35728
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11 Dec 2017, 5:16 pm

Marknis wrote:
The "bro" culture is not aspie friendly at all and needs to be avoided. Please encourage your brother to follow his passions and expand his knowledge. Saying things like "You need to get your dick wet!" like my jerk of an older brother did will just hurt him even more. I refuse to go anywhere that reeks of "bro" or alpha male culture due to the damage it caused me and I refuse to smoke or drink (Besides the occasional wine or champagne or sweet drink)


Sorry to hear your experience with this culture is so negative :( I'm curious as to the experience of other Aspies on this forum with bro/jock culture. I was particularly fortunate because my middle/high school aide had two daughters who were female jocks plus three pro athletes are family friends as well as a cousin who was a cheerleader at two NCAA DI schools, combined with the fact that I've enjoyed going to sporting events since I was about five has meant that my personal experiences with jocks and cheerleaders has been overwhelmingly positive in spite of (or maybe because of) my various quirks. Just my two cents.



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11 Dec 2017, 5:39 pm

ironpony wrote:
Okay thanks. I tried a dating site for people with Aspurgers but there were only 2 members on the site. I read that only 1% of the world population have it. If that's true, he would be severely limiting his options. He already had trouble getting women and telling him to boycott the remaining 99% of women, seems like it limit his chances much higher.

I have autism too and I considered boycotting neurotypical at one point, and I was told not too cause my chances would severely decrease if I date autistic women only, and I can see why, especially if the neurotypical population is as high as 99%!

I mean he could try boycotting that much and just sticking to the 1%, but I wouldn't know where he would find them.


There are plenty of neurotypicals who don't really fit in with the typical neurotypicals with super mainstream interests who care a ton about social standing and such. So no need to limit to just women on the spectrum...there are neurotypicals involved in things like sub-cultures and alternative life styles or who have less common interests and such who wouldn't fit in with the 'normies' as much either. For instance I have aspergers but my boyfriend is neurotypical...however we have some similar interests like metal music. He's not into stuff like sports or tabloid hype and pop culture.


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11 Dec 2017, 5:56 pm

drwho222 wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Okay thanks. I tried a dating site for people with Aspurgers but there were only 2 members on the site. I read that only 1% of the world population have it. If that's true, he would be severely limiting his options. He already had trouble getting women and telling him to boycott the remaining 99% of women, seems like it limit his chances much higher.

I have autism too and I considered boycotting neurotypical at one point, and I was told not too cause my chances would severely decrease if I date autistic women only, and I can see why, especially if the neurotypical population is as high as 99%!

I mean he could try boycotting that much and just sticking to the 1%, but I wouldn't know where he would find them.


He will never be happy with an NT girl. NT females are by and large catty shrews that view men only as a source of resources. When NT females marry NT guys it doesn't usually end well--high divorce rates, they stop having sex by year four, etc. An NT girl will demand that he make all kinds of lifestyle changes to suit her, which seem perfectly natural to her because she is NT! His needs wont be taken into account because he is "strange" and expected to fit the NT norm. The ASPartners hate site is full of people like this. And of course they think a relationship between two Aspies wont work! Because they don't get us at all and don't care to!

Many Aspie males have the unfortunate curse of a strong sex drive coupled to a complete inability to make sex happen. Do NT males have relationships just for sex? Sure. But they have the social skills to disguise this and make the sex happen. For many Aspie males prostitutes are the only viable option to easily get this, because you are right, Aspie females are hard to find.


So you'd only want a relationship for sex? I mean nowhere do you mention anything about relationships....just 'inability to make sex happen'. I mean how are you going to attract any female for anything long-term if the main thing on your mind is 'make sex happen'? Maybe a one night stand if you ran into a woman who is into that kind of thing. But yeah if you just come of as someone who's sex starved and desperate to 'get off' that's likely going to be a turn off to any potential relationship partners.

Plus what if you get sex early on and then come to find out you don't really care much for the person you're getting it from...are you going to lead her on for a little while trying to figure out what to do, or just straight up tell her you made a mistake getting involved with her.

Also I don't think all guys with aspies have an abnormally high sex drive do you have a reference for that claim? Also though even if that is true the way to handle it isn't obsessing over it or telling yourself how unfair it is sterotyping neurotypical women as all being nasty shrews. There is masturbation if that's not enough stimulation to get it out of your system for a bit, then get a 'flesh-light' or something.


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Last edited by Sweetleaf on 11 Dec 2017, 6:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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11 Dec 2017, 6:02 pm

If a man decides to adopt a false persona to get a woman, any woman he gets will be a poor fit - because she's looking for something he's not, and will probably be ticked off at the deceptive approach. You already know there won't be anything like long-term success or happiness in a relationship based on deceit.

There are women out there with a genuine preference for guys who reject toxic masculinity and bro culture. Sadly, we don't all congregate in convenient, easy-to-find groups.

I don't know you or your brother, but I know relationships - and the ones based on a desperate desire to "get a woman" and a willingness to pretend to be what you're not are doomed from the start.


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ironpony
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14 Dec 2017, 1:35 am

Well it's gotten to the point where I find that all hope is lost for my brother. He keeps getting more and more angry and depressed over it, and I feel that maybe he has reached the point where all he can do is keep trying, but will probably just have to wait until he gets old and dies and then hopefully he can leave this world and go to a better, not so unaccepting place for him.



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14 Dec 2017, 4:45 am

Clicked over and read the OP of your other thread.

Sounds like your brother is an as*hole.

Why would I want to give you advice on setting him up with women so they can be mistreated by your as*hole brother?

Step 1: Tell your brother to stop being such a f*****g as*hole to women & he won't have such difficulties attracting them on his own.


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ironpony
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14 Dec 2017, 12:07 pm

Well I think the reason why he has become that way is because of all the constant rejection over the years and it all built up to a breaking point.

So if he was to actually get women and get some positive dating experiences, then the as*hole-ness will go away, and he can go back to being the happier person he was before.

But he's nice to the women until he gets rejected and the rejection is what spurs on the anger.



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14 Dec 2017, 3:23 pm

Thats's a horrible justification for being an as*hole.

Other women rejected me so I'm going to treat all women like s**t.

Tell him I said f**k off. :)

He's got to Not be an as*hole to women BEFORE anyone would want to give him advice meeting any new ones, or introduce him to any etc.

IF you're saying he IS nice to new women now, but turns to being an as*hole to them IF they reject him, that's just as unacceptable. Women do not have to find him attractive. They might not be attracted to his height, face, body, attitude, voice, any number of things & then reject his advances. At that point, it is what it is, he needs to learn to accept their rejection as the reality of the moment and not react to it with anger and hostility. That's the sort of thing that lands people in JAIL. Once he can accept that he's not everyone's cup of tea and can easily move on to chatting up some other girl, then he may be ready to start trying to date. Until then, f**k your brother, he's an as*hole to women and doesn't deserve their company.


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14 Dec 2017, 3:30 pm

ironpony wrote:
Well I think the reason why he has become that way is because of all the constant rejection over the years and it all built up to a breaking point.

So if he was to actually get women and get some positive dating experiences, then the as*hole-ness will go away, and he can go back to being the happier person he was before.

But he's nice to the women until he gets rejected and the rejection is what spurs on the anger.


Well that is a huge problem...sure rejection sucks but no one is obligated to date anyone else. I mean what does he think is so special/great about him that no one should reject him? I don't want to make a bunch of assumptions but it's possible he may need to work on things like improving his attitude, good hygiene, perhaps finding some hobbies to keep himself occupied and not miserable and things like that and then worry more about a girlfriend. I mean if he is so bitter what would he do with a woman even if he did get one?


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ironpony
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14 Dec 2017, 3:41 pm

I assume if he did get the one, the reasons he has to be bitter would go away. However, I thought maybe his medication was making him behave this way, cause he was put on anti-anxiety medication as a result of being depressed.

Before he was much nicer and much better, but really depressed. So they put on medication and it's not until after he started taking it, that he started acting out. So I think it's the medication that is making him act out towards women if they reject him. Or at least the timing is very coincidental since it started a few weeks after he was put on medication.