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thinkinginpictures
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17 Nov 2017, 4:15 pm

Not only in Christianity, but in all religions and cultures, being proud of something good, ie. working hard to achieve some result, is considered a sin (in religious communities) or at least morally wrong, this goes for non-religious communities too.

The "Law of Jante" is a good example of this. It is a social crab-mentality list of sayings that all have the purpose of telling "you are nothing, you are worth of nothing and you deserve no respect" - it exists not only in Denmark but in all cultures.


You can make a work of art and have an entire crowd like it. But the very moment you as an artist show any sign of being proud of your work, that very same crowd will turn their back on you.


Why?

However, I find being proud as a member of a group being a sin. Proud of Group = conformity = evil, because you are being proud not of your own achievements, but that of the group. You achieve nothing yourself in a group.

Worse is it that people generally accept being proud of a certain political party, religious community, sports or in other situations where they had done absolutely NOTHING to deserve being proud! Being proud of any type of team ie. politics, sports etc. without even participating, is totally foolish, because you have achieved NOTHING in that team yourself!

Example: Many people are proud of their nationality. Why? Nationality should not define who you are! Personal achievements and your OWN personal traits alone define who you are!



the_phoenix
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17 Nov 2017, 11:56 pm

thinkinginpictures wrote:
Not only in Christianity, but in all religions and cultures, being proud of something good, ie. working hard to achieve some result, is considered a sin (in religious communities) or at least morally wrong, this goes for non-religious communities too.

The "Law of Jante" is a good example of this. It is a social crab-mentality list of sayings that all have the purpose of telling "you are nothing, you are worth of nothing and you deserve no respect" - it exists not only in Denmark but in all cultures.


Christian artist here.

Pride can be good or bad. The good form of pride merely consists of living up to a good standard ("taking pride in your work"). The bad, or sinful, form of pride is when you consider yourself superior to others or attempt to place yourself above God.

thinkinginpictures wrote:

You can make a work of art and have an entire crowd like it. But the very moment you as an artist show any sign of being proud of your work, that very same crowd will turn their back on you.


Why?


Envy.
Trust me, I know.
I've won awards and had my artwork exhibited in art galleries, museums, and solo shows, including at City Hall.

thinkinginpictures wrote:
However, I find being proud as a member of a group being a sin. Proud of Group = conformity = evil, because you are being proud not of your own achievements, but that of the group. You achieve nothing yourself in a group.

Worse is it that people generally accept being proud of a certain political party, religious community, sports or in other situations where they had done absolutely NOTHING to deserve being proud! Being proud of any type of team ie. politics, sports etc. without even participating, is totally foolish, because you have achieved NOTHING in that team yourself!


If you do in fact participate, you should in fact reap the rewards.

thinkinginpictures wrote:
Example: Many people are proud of their nationality. Why? Nationality should not define who you are! Personal achievements and your OWN personal traits alone define who you are!


I love the different cultures of the world. The world would be a boring place without the different nationalities, if everyone tried to be all the same. Globalism = conformity. "The banality of evil."



thinkinginpictures
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18 Nov 2017, 5:12 am

the_phoenix wrote:
Christian artist here.

Pride can be good or bad. The good form of pride merely consists of living up to a good standard ("taking pride in your work"). The bad, or sinful, form of pride is when you consider yourself superior to others or attempt to place yourself above God.


Thanks. I think I may have totally misunderstood the concept.

the_phoenix wrote:
I love the different cultures of the world. The world would be a boring place without the different nationalities, if everyone tried to be all the same. Globalism = conformity. "The banality of evil."


I agree with you, but I think nationalism leads to more conformity than globalism.
Different national traits can be good. The many ways of perspective on different matters are also important.

But that doesn't mean any given nationality or ethnicity is better or worse than any other. After all, we are all humans! Nationality is not the same as nationalism, the latter gives rise to conformity.



the_phoenix
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18 Nov 2017, 10:33 am

thinkinginpictures wrote:
the_phoenix wrote:
I love the different cultures of the world. The world would be a boring place without the different nationalities, if everyone tried to be all the same. Globalism = conformity. "The banality of evil."


I agree with you, but I think nationalism leads to more conformity than globalism.
Different national traits can be good. The many ways of perspective on different matters are also important.

But that doesn't mean any given nationality or ethnicity is better or worse than any other. After all, we are all humans! Nationality is not the same as nationalism, the latter gives rise to conformity.


Nice conversing with you, thinkinginpictures! :)

As for nationalism, I still believe it leads to variety, which as they say, is the spice of life.

Here's a real-world example from my own life: I own an Etsy shop, and dearly love buying from other Etsy shops around the world. But it's frustrating when I look at a shop from, say, Australia or Israel ... and everything they sell looks American, like I could just go to the local Walmart and buy it (and a Walmart product will likely be made in China but still look American)! I finally was happy recently when I found an Etsy shop from Japan that sold origami paper and washi paper ... now that is very cool, so I bought some. 8)

We agree when you say that no nationality or ethnicity is better or worse than any other.

What nationality does is allows different cultures to creatively express themselves in their own unique ways.

I would even say that globalism is like forcing everyone on the autism spectrum to be NT
while nationalism (when handled correctly) is respectful of differences the same way that neurodiversity is.
I find the differences between different countries fascinating and fun! :D