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Neuroman
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02 Aug 2005, 1:11 pm

Sarah wrote:
Apparently in some primates including gorillas eye-contact is a sign of aggression.


So is the showing of teeth. So maybe I don't have all those filters NTs have developed via evolution. Its my belief that a lot of them are no longer functional.

Jack is glad to be less civilized....


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adversarial
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02 Aug 2005, 1:33 pm

Sarah wrote:
Apparently in some primates including gorillas eye-contact is a sign of aggression.


Possibly with other Mammals, this happens too. If you stare at a Dog's eyes, it will become defensive and start barking. I did that once when I was 17 and that is when I realised it. I no longer do it. Interestingly, Cats do not react with hostility if you look at their eyes.

The Eye Staring/Contact as Aggression scenario might indicate the jockeying for social position and prestige, even on a 'one to one' basis; much as some people will do things like touch your arm or another part of your body to emphasise a point, and try to physically manipulate you into their point of view. I dislike that intensely, too. I am told that it is a 'sign of friendship', it seems to me like a sign of attempts to Dominate, but if I try to put a stop to it, they react defensively, when it is they who are over-stepping the boundary.

I think a large part of my dislike of these two things (eye contact and physical touch), is because the people doing it are over-stepping boundaries and trying to dominate you. It makes me really quite uncomfortable.



Tak
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02 Aug 2005, 3:19 pm

Eyes can tell you an incredible amount if you look, I'm always looking at eyes, even how dilated they are can read interest or lack of same.

Its funny, I DO make eye contact, but unless I'm very careful how I handle it people don't like it. I'm often told eye contact with me feels like being X-rayed, or like they are under a microscope.

I suppose its true, I intensely scrutinise EVERYONE, for stance, posture, speech level. If I don't I cant tell what they want or how I'm supposed to react. If I let this level of examination stop even for a second, I'm completely lost.

My ex plays "games" with me by making obscure or weird statements in a normal tone of voice to see if she can bluff me into taking her seriously, she thinks its funny. Notice I said "ex".

I was an adult before aspergers was a diagnosis, so I learned a lot of the things therapists are apparently teaching you folks on my own. I've had "real" eye contact, not just "eye scrutiny" but very rarely and only with people I've had long term relationships with.


But it can be learned, or at least simulated well enough to function.



spacemonkey
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02 Aug 2005, 4:32 pm

There was an article on here once about findings that eye contact stimulated the fight or flight response in people on the spectrum.
The amygdyla I think it is. This is the reason for the painful or anxious feeling.

I remember being blamed for things as a child, based mostly on my avoidance of eye contact when questioned. I did not understand this at the time and found it incredibly frustrating and hurtful. No one ever said that it was because I didn't make eye contact, they would just refuse to believe me when I denied responsibility, and I ended up feeling like no one trusted me.