Has anyone ever met an extreme narcissist?

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SilverProteus
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02 Apr 2008, 9:33 am

Compensatory Narcissistic Personality Disorder: a pervasive pattern of unstable, "overtly narcissistic behaviors [that] derive from an underlying sense of insecurity and weakness rather than from genuine feelings of self-confidence and high self-esteem", beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by ten (or more) of the following:

:arrow: seeks to create an illusion of superiority and to build up an image of high self-worth;

:arrow: has disturbances in the capacity for empathy;

:arrow: strives for recognition and prestige to compensate for the lack of a feeling of self-worth;

:arrow: may acquire a deprecatory attitude in which the achievements of others are ridiculed and degraded;

:arrow: has persistent aspirations for glory and status;

:arrow: has a tendency to exaggerate and boast;

:arrow: is sensitive to how others react to him or her, watches and listens carefully for critical judgment, and feels slighted by disapproval;

:arrow: is prone to feel shamed and humiliated and especially hyper-anxious and vulnerable to the judgments of others;

:arrow: covers up a sense of inadequacy and deficiency with pseudo-arrogance and pseudo-grandiosity;

:arrow: has a tendency to periodic hypochondria;

:arrow: alternates between feelings of emptiness and deadness and states of excitement and excess energy;

:arrow: entertains fantasies of greatness, constantly striving for perfection, genius, or stardom;

:arrow: has a history of searching for an idealized partner and has an intense need for affirmation and confirmation in relationships;

:arrow: frequently entertains a wishful, exaggerated, and unrealistic concept of himself or herself which he or she can't possibly measure up to;

:arrow: produces (too quickly) work not up to the level of his or her abilities because of an overwhelmingly strong need for the immediate gratification of success;

:arrow: is touchy, quick to take offense at the slightest provocation, continually anticipating attack and danger, reacting with anger and fantasies of revenge when he or she feels frustrated in his or her need for constant admiration;

:arrow: is self-conscious, due to a dependence on approval from others;

:arrow: suffers regularly from repetitive oscillations of self-esteem;

:arrow: seeks to undo feelings of inadequacy by forcing everyone's attention and admiration upon himself or herself;

:arrow: may react with self-contempt and depression to the lack of fulfillment of his or her grandiose expectations.

---

All of this while hiding behind "ethics". :roll:

From http://www.ptypes.com/compensatory-narpd.html


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Last edited by SilverProteus on 02 Apr 2008, 10:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

Icheb
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02 Apr 2008, 10:02 am

That's me you're describing, SilverProteus. 8O :? :lol:



SilverProteus
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02 Apr 2008, 10:04 am

LOL. :lol:

Don't worry, the original narcissist I'm describing isn't you.

This one's high on the narcissistic spectrum, where I doubt admitting to things is easy.


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Kaleido
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02 Apr 2008, 10:16 am

I know a woman exactly like this, I hadn't heard of it before she herself described a member of her family as being like this. It was only after knowing her for five years that I realized that she may have been talking about herself. Many people were taken in by her goodness but many have abandoned her now.

Is there a treatment, does it heal?



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02 Apr 2008, 10:47 am

From wikipedia:

Quote:
Treatment and prognosis

Most psychiatrists and psychologists regard NPD as a relatively stable condition when experienced as a primary disorder. James F. Masterson's outlines a prominent approach to healing NPD, while discusses a continuum of severity and the kinds of therapy most effective in different cases. Typically, as narcissism is an ingrained personality trait, rather than a chemical imbalance, medication and therapy are not very effective in treating the disorder. Schema Therapy, a form of therapy developed by Jeffrey E. Young that integrates several therapeutic approaches (psychodynamic, cognitive, behavioral etc.), also offers an approach for the treatment of NPD.

It is unusual for people to seek therapy for NPD. Subconscious fears of exposure or inadequacy are often met with defensive disdain of therapeutic processes.

Pharmacotherapy is rarely used. In a review of the literature, one patient responded to Wellbutrin.


From Mental Help Net

Quote:
If possible, long-term individual psychotherapy is the treatment of choice for those with narcissistic personality disorder because it helps to establish a strong therapeutic alliance between therapist and patient. Yet, even within this framework, expectations should focus on small changes in personality traits as opposed to expecting large changes as being possible.

Goals in therapy should focus on helping the patient develop some empathy for others by learning to appreciate other's feelings and points of view, acknowledging his/her "specialness" while helping the patient learn how to put it into perspective, and helping the patient learn how to appropriately handle slights and rejections from others without feeling one's sense of self as being extremely threatened. These goals can all be developed within the safety of a strong therapy relationship between therapist and patient so that when the patient's vulnerabilities are exposed, the therapist can help the patient feel okay about these vulnerabilities while gently putting the patient's exaggerated sense of self-importance back in perspective.

Group therapy for those with narcissistic personality disorder tends to be ineffectual. Usually in a therapy group, narcissists will tend to dominate the group or tire other group members with their list of accomplishments and grandeur. Because they do not respond well to critical feedback, narcissists are likely to drop out of group therapy once others start providing feedback about their behavior. Or, on the other hand, the other group members might drop out of the group because they get tired of the narcissists dominating the therapy.


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Kaleido
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02 Apr 2008, 11:12 am

Interesting. The lady I know is a bit older than me, I wonder if there is hope of change when someone is much older.



aguales
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02 Apr 2008, 12:26 pm

MissConstrue wrote:
It almost sounds like AS, they dissassociate from people.


After years of speculating on my behaviors, I diagnosed myself as having Narcisstic Personality Disorder. However, that didn't explain everything about me and was still searching for a more authentic diagnosis. When I started my own extensive research into Asperger's Syndrome, I realized I found something that fit my life story holistically. I believe I developed the narcisstic personality disorder as an overcompensation strategy for my aspieness. The negative charisma of pathalogical narcissism overshadowed and hid my aspie nature from myself and others. The narcisstic persona was a pre-emptive chameleon strategy. After coming to conclusion that I have Asperger's, the narcisstic facade had to crumble, and I'm glad of it.

I have this "alpha aspie" theory where there are undiagnosed aspies that have some kind of obtuse hold on power and status (whether real or fantasy) and use that as pre-emptive camaflouge to overcompensate or hide their aspie nature. Similar to the logic of homophobes really being repressed homesexuals themselves, "alpha aspies" have a phobia of having their "handicapped nature" found out and go on a power trip, railroading all those who are explicit examples of what s/he secretly is.

Of course, concocting speculative theories like these might be just a consequence of part of my narcisstic personality disorder still popping up at times.

I do feel that for aspies to break out of his/her "aspie shell", the person has to have a level of courageous narcissism to do so. There is healthy narcissism. It's when it becomes pathological that it severely distorts reality for the NT or aspie who harbors it.



Last edited by aguales on 02 Apr 2008, 1:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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02 Apr 2008, 1:25 pm

I used to be considered a narcissist.



SilverProteus
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02 Apr 2008, 2:33 pm

Kaleido wrote:
Interesting. The lady I know is a bit older than me, I wonder if there is hope of change when someone is much older.


The guy I'm talking about is a lot older than me, and I doubt he'll change. Sad.


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SilverProteus
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02 Apr 2008, 2:34 pm

Aguales, how did it crumble? Did you undergo therapy?


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aguales
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17 Apr 2008, 7:52 pm

SilverProteus wrote:
Aguales, how did it crumble? Did you undergo therapy?


The "crumbling" started as soon as I discovered myself to be an aspie and then I eventually returned to therapy. It was like I could no longer lie to myself, and narcissism requires an inordinate amount of lying to oneself. Before finding out what Asperger's was, I was without a clue as to what was challenging me. Everything outside or inside me seemed to be so contrarian. I suppose I mimicked a narcissistic personality because that seemed to be a role that I could fit and seemed available to me. Assuming a narcisstic personality takes alot of cognitive energy both in bursts and in the long-term. After deciding that, "Yes, I am 99% sure that I have Asperger's", it's like my brain took a deep sigh and began dismantling the elaborate cognitive trickery that comes with intense narcissism--the "theme-park" was closing down.

Therapy does help, but I'm seeing a Jungian instead of a Freudian this time around. A different approach than what I'm used to, so I'm still unsure how to frame the effect it's had on me.

Narcissism is like a force of nature, like a tornado dying out, that part of me is wisping away. If challenged severely, I don't know if pathalogical narcissism will return as a defensive measure once again. I hope I've had developed more constructive strategies by then.



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28 Apr 2008, 11:56 pm

Let's see here...my ex-girlfriend, her mom, and one of my friends (just traits of narcissism though). I seem to attract these kinds of people for some reason. :?

With my ex, everything revolved around her...her needs, her feelings, her interests, her, her, her. I remember her comparing what I and other people would do for her. She had no empathy, no interest in anything I said or done, no sense of humor, and was just really hard to get along with. I always felt like I was walking on eggshells around her and her mom, for fear I would do something wrong, or it wasn't good enough. Her mom always played the blame game with me and everyone else she deemed inferior to her. her favorite saying was "a real man would do this or that for me". She would take whatever she could get from people, without any guilty conscience, and half the time, not even a thank you.

She is the most confusing, contradicting, lying, shallowest person I have met. People that know her either adore her, or hate her. When we broke up, all she said to me was that she didn't get excited anymore (I guess she rates things by how excited she gets), and refused to talk about it, or work through it.

That being said, I see her at work everyday (we work together), and she has come off a lot of her BS since we broke up, but not all of it.



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29 Apr 2008, 10:07 am

I will admit to being somewhat of a narcissist. The thing is, I have met A LOT of people with narcissistic behaviours-Many of them have been (young)women. I am NOT convinced that narcissism is more common in one sex than another but I Am convinced that when it comes to mild narcissism, women are allowed to get away with it more than men. Curiously, Many of the narcissists that Ive met are Bipolar. I have read that narcissism and manipulative behaviour are not uncommon in bipolar people. The last 2 gfs I had were TOTAL narcissists, the 2nd one being a total f*****g little (spoiled)"princess". I believe that parents who dont teach their children to take responsibility for their actions and to be self-critical will result in the kids growing up into narcissisitc adults with a sense of entitlement. Asperger Syndrome is frequently mistaken for NPD but I honestly believe that NPD is more likely to go hand in hand with bipolar.



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29 Apr 2008, 10:21 am

aguales wrote:
I have this "alpha aspie" theory where there are undiagnosed aspies that have some kind of obtuse hold on power and status (whether real or fantasy) and use that as pre-emptive camaflouge to overcompensate or hide their aspie nature. Similar to the logic of homophobes really being repressed homesexuals themselves, "alpha aspies" have a phobia of having their "handicapped nature" found out and go on a power trip, railroading all those who are explicit examples of what s/he secretly is.

Of course, concocting speculative theories like these might be just a consequence of part of my narcisstic personality disorder still popping up at times.



This is very possible. My mother is an extreme narcissist and my father an undiagnosed Aspie with narcissistic traits. Being their child and an Aspie myself was the childhood from hell - I think my brain is like a worn out rubberband. Then they find "a way" to function socially and then there is no stopping. Narcisssts are completely misguided and think that other people do the same things they do.


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