A question concerning high functioning AS and stims.........

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Mage
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24 Apr 2008, 5:54 pm

The level of functioning. PDD-NOS generally have an easier time keeping jobs and making friends. I fail at the friend part but I've held many good jobs in my life, so they told me I am PDD-NOS. I understand this definition is exactly the opposite of how it's viewed in Europe, which is why I just say HFA.



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24 Apr 2008, 5:59 pm

I'm high functioning and I probably stim more than I do not. It doesn't really matter, I don't think.



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24 Apr 2008, 6:03 pm

x_amount_of_words wrote:
What is the difference between PDDNOS and AS?

PDDNOS is a diagnosis that takes people who are on the spectrum who dont quite fit the criteria of any of the specific ASD labels but are significantly impared enough to be worth diagnosing,people with it can range from severely impaired who dont quite meet classic autism to lesser impaired with too less traits to get an AS diagnosis.
am have had the NOS tag before for trigeminal neuralgia when they didnt believe a teen could get it [facial pain NOS if am remember correctly].

and stimming a lot does not make someone low functioning even though it's more common amongst obvious autistics [auties more so than aspies].
functioning is about looking after self,communication ability,quality of life as a result of their autism or as, personal care etc.


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24 Apr 2008, 7:10 pm

pat666rick wrote:
To be honest with you guys I'm scared sh*tless of the fact that I might have high functioning autism. I'd way prefer to have Aspergers since there is a way better chance of people with Aspergers leading normal lives. This could eventually be a possibility for me.

Aspergers is the "better" of the two to have, right?


WHO CARES what is better, with regard to chance? The question is do YOU have a good chance. Apparently, given what I have seen, people with AS might have lots of problems, and people with HFS might do fine.



Danielismyname
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24 Apr 2008, 8:30 pm

Mage,

PDD-NOS can range from mild (atypical Asperger's) to severe (atypical autism). "HFA" is severe (it's autism).

PDD-NOS is usually seen as mild as one doesn't need many points to fit the criteria (it's also reserved for less severe symptoms), and many people are diagnosed with atypical Asperger's (mild Asperger's); I assume most people with the PDD-NOS label have the latter.



Mage
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24 Apr 2008, 8:40 pm

Wiki would disagree with you.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-functioning_autism
"High-functioning autism (HFA) is an informal term applied to autistic individuals who are in some sense able.[1] A similar diagnosis would be Pervasive Developmental Disorder - Not Otherwise Specified (PDD-NOS) and refers to any person with autism that does not fall under the classic label.[citation needed]"

Until the world can reach a consensus on what these terms mean, I will continue to just say I am HFA. It seems like a much more descriptive term than Asperger's or PDD-NOS so people would be less likely to be confused.



Danielismyname
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24 Apr 2008, 8:54 pm

Nah.

"HFA" is a diagnosis of autistic disorder without an Axis-II diagnosis of mental retardation. I have some research papers that state such.

Take me, I meet the full criteria for autistic disorder, but I'm in the one-quarter that don't have an Axis-II diagnosis of MR (those with MR are said to have "LFA"); PDD-NOS is for people who don't meet the full criteria for autistic disorder for example.

Here's one (Dickerson Mayes, S. and Calhoun, S.L. (2001) Autism Vol 5 (1) 81-94.):

Quote:
High-functioning autism is already covered in the DSM-IV by an axis I diagnosis of autistic disorder without mental retardation coded on axis II.



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24 Apr 2008, 9:12 pm

Willard wrote:
krex wrote:
3="krex"
krex wrote:
but I am still working crap jobs and don't ever see myself being a CEO(insert adult job here), no matter how hard I worked at it.


This is precisely why AS should be classified as a SSI disability. I have worked very hard for 35 years, in fact often been fired because I was too busy working to socialize with the fat F*****rs who sat around on their asses all day laughing and goofing off. Fortunately, I always had my family to fall back on when I couldn't keep my financial head above water. Now, my parents are retired and living on a fixed income and my employment prospects are worse than ever. The career I spent 30 years in is technologically obsolete and I'm not trained or qualified for anything else. I seriously fear ending up in a homeless shelter, and eventually living under a bridge down by the river. It's great to hear that some Aspies are working for NASA, but that doesn't change the fact that some of us are rapidly losing any employability we ever had, with no 401K or pension to look forward to. That's what I get for being so obsessed with my career that I won high ratings and awards for years for employers who rewarded me with a few pennies more than minimum wage, and then a pink slip. Thanks Clear Channel, Thanks Cumulus, Thanks Citadel.
----end quote


I know exactly what you're talking about. I've worked as a graphics designer for print in the newspaper biz for 13 years now, and even though I've won awards, done all the crap jobs no one else wanted to do and took extra work upon myself for my lack of schmoozing skills, I haven't been promoted and now my work is being outsourced to a company overseas. I've been taking classes to get caught up online/web design work, but being as I'm 40 and have health problems, I can see myself being virtually unemployable within 3-4 years. I'm too tired & too broke to go back to college and learn something else. Newspapers are all I know, and thanks to the proliferation of the internet, they're going the way of the wind. I'll probably be living under a bridge by next year if things get any worse. You can thank the internet and our crap economy for the pink slips. This is only the beginning. I expect my pink slip any day now, once they get the new outsource workflow in place. It's not all doom and gloom, though - I hear they're hiring graphics designers in Mexico for something like 150 pesos an hour.

Oh, so I'm not off-topic, my IQ is 136 and I'm AS, not HFA (though there was some dispute in the beginning). Stim every now and then, usually tapping fingers, hand-flapping and clicking my rings together on my hands, or else constantly touching my eyes or forehead, or twirling my hair. But, I catch myself doing it and try to look like I was counting to myself or scratching my head (but that doesn't look good, either, I guess).


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24 Apr 2008, 9:38 pm

Living under a bridge is not a good idea considering the crumbling infrastructure in the US. People keep electing republicans because they don't ant to pay higher taxes (but don't seem to realize every penny spent on the war is one less to help our kids and build the economy or infrastructure...don't believe me. Ask the people who fell into the Mississippi when the MN bridge collapsed(I live in MN). I lived under a bridge for awhile...noisy :cry: . On the upside there are a lot of brand new empty houses that aren't selling that you can squat in :D .

We are watching the decline of the middle class, welcome to the dark ages...they were so fun, we have decided to revisit them. Back in the good old days they just burned people like me...now they will weed us out with eugenics...to save taxes for the next war, (feeling a little cynical as I can't seem to find a job today).

So if...Aspergers is NOT HFA...is it still considered autism because it doesn't seem to be covered by programs that are designed to help autistics....either I am or I'm not...not... I am(unless some ones tax money is going to be used to help me find a job with my "limitations". Off to scream now.....


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24 Apr 2008, 9:55 pm

krex wrote:
Living under a bridge is not a good idea considering the crumbling infrastructure in the US. People keep electing republicans because they don't ant to pay higher taxes (but don't seem to realize every penny spent on the war is one less to help our kids and build the economy or infrastructure...don't believe me. Ask the people who fell into the Mississippi when the MN bridge collapsed(I live in MN). I lived under a bridge for awhile...noisy :cry: . On the upside there are a lot of brand new empty houses that aren't selling that you can squat in :D .


yeah... I know about those bridges. The roads & bridges where I live are falling apart and I take a deep breath every time I have to drive across one of them. I agree - the war needs to end, and soon.

Quote:
We are watching the decline of the middle class, welcome to the dark ages...they were so fun, we have decided to revisit them. Back in the good old days they just burned people like me...now they will weed us out with eugenics...to save taxes for the next war, (feeling a little cynical as I can't seem to find a job today).


Don't worry, I'm right with you in the Cynicism Department. Have you heard that Congress is considering a bill to ban companies from testing people for genetic markers indicating possible disease & disability? I didn't even know they were doing that sort of thing to start with... and I thought having to pass a credit check for a job was an invasion of privacy. If the bill doesn't pass, I wonder if that means we can't et a job if we have a 45% or greater probability of having a heart attack? It's the health insurance companies doing all of this, as well as corporations trying to squeeze out every last penny they can.

Quote:
So if...Aspergers is NOT HFA...is it still considered autism because it doesn't seem to be covered by programs that are designed to help autistics....either I am or I'm not...not... I am(unless some ones tax money is going to be used to help me find a job with my "limitations". Off to scream now.....


AS is supposed to be the one of the mildest forms of autism, or soI've heard. People wth AS still have problems ( a lot of them ), but they can and do function in society. (At least well enough to get by). I've heard it's pretty hard to get Social Security with AS unless one is really having a hard time functioning. Even if they can prove it, it will take several years to get your first SS check. I thought about applying for it on my son's behalf (he's a bit lower functioning than I am and he's having a very hard time dealing with the idea of looking for a job), but the stack of paperwork I'd have to fill out is daunting. I'm probably going to wait and see how he does once he goes to college and graduates from there.


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krex
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24 Apr 2008, 10:46 pm

Funny thing about that "function level"...mine can be all over the place and I have managed to find ways to adjust my life to work around that(working over nights wherre they desperately need workers helps a lot) but even those jobs are getting harder to find and the physical labor I used to be able to do...well, I'm 44 now and stuff is starting to fall apart)

I functioned pretty well in college considering,(or because of) the alcohol. It helped with the depression to not have to be alone all the time. I also learned to sign up for weekend and night classes. There are "work arounds" that can help,but...I also had several "breakdowns" that would have left me homeless if it hadn't been for my parents helping me out. It was much, much worse when I graduated and had to try and pretend to be an adult. I felt like I was about 15 and those were the jobs I applied for...with a BA in Psych.

Sorry to get off course but I just think it is not as clear cut as the "experts" would like to make it out to be. I am much more able to shower, shop, look for a job when I don't have to many stressors in my life...when I do I shut down and my brain just does not work the way I want it to...until they can see into my brain....they can not tell the difference between AS shut down,depression or laziness....so they will always chose the latter(it's cheaper).

I don't want to live on SSI/SSD...I want a job that uses my strengths, doesn't stress me out so much that it is all I can do, and takes me senory and social issues in to account. We are a watsed resource and I think it is messed up.


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24 Apr 2008, 11:42 pm

krex wrote:
So if...Aspergers is NOT HFA...is it still considered autism because it doesn't seem to be covered by programs that are designed to help autistics....either I am or I'm not...not... I am(unless some ones tax money is going to be used to help me find a job with my "limitations". Off to scream now.....


Asperger's is an autism spectrum disorder, and its social difficulties are as severe as "LFA" and "HFA", but they usually manifest differently [in a way that allows one to show interest in social interaction]; its repetitive behaviors are as severe as LFA/HFA too, but they too manifest differently in most cases (a way that involves a better chance at fitting in to society).

One can apply for and receive social services (disability pension for example) with either autism or Asperger's here in Oz if you're deemed too "severe" to work or study.



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24 Apr 2008, 11:50 pm

Danielismyname wrote:
Asperger's is an autism spectrum disorder, and its social difficulties are as severe as "LFA" and "HFA", but they usually manifest differently [in a way that allows one to show interest in social interaction]; its repetitive behaviors are as severe as LFA/HFA too, but they too manifest differently in most cases (a way that involves a better chance at fitting in to society).


How could you possibly say that the social difficulties of AS are as severe as those of "LFA" when tons of people with AS have friends, family, spouses, etc. whereas there are tons of people with LFA who are completely non-verbal?



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24 Apr 2008, 11:57 pm

It says such in the DSM-IV-TR. A ton of people with autistic disorder have friends and partners too, it doesn't detract from its global severity as most don't.

Here you go:

Quote:
Although the social deficit in Asperger's Disorder is severe and is defined in the same way as in Autistic Disorder, the lack of social reciprocity is more typically manifested by an eccentric and one-sided social approach to others (e.g.,pursuing a conversational topic regardless of others' reactions) rather than social and emotional indifference.



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25 Apr 2008, 3:40 am

I worked with a LFA autistic and he had family and I considered myself a person who liked and cared about him..I would have continued my relationship as a carer if I had been allowed to do so. He may not have cared about "me" but I was the thing that fed and cared for him and he would smile in repsonse to my rubbing his shoulders or scalp.

I am saying this because I keep seeing an "us and them" mentality here, being able to communicate in words or not is not what makes some one a sentient being. I personaly don't have friends or family in my life, just a BF. I think at times he was better at letting people in then I am.


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25 Apr 2008, 9:05 am

I've got a pile of research papers regarding the fact that after a given period of development (some say 4-5 years post-diagnosis, some say adulthood, etc.) AS and HFA (with language) are indistinguishable. Another stack that discusses differences between the two in adulthood, and they are so small as to be negligible. I think a lot of it is the type of care and treatment.
I know that if my early language development was not known, I'd probably be looked at as HFA. My behavior is more in tune with that, though I do have the professorial speech.

Seriously. Who cares? It's all HFA. It may not all be HF "Autistic Disorder," but it's all HF "Autistic Spectrum Disorder." In the end, looking at an adult on the spectrum with language, you'd have no idea.