zero-diet

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I agree. Trans fat is harmful and not needed, and occurs mostly in artificially hydrogenated fat mixtures, but only in trace amounts in beef and dairy. Unsaturated fat is good, and saturated fat is also needed in small amounts. However, fat deficency does not generally occur when eating a balanced diet, and the recommeded daily allowance for saturated fat is surprisingly easy to exceed. If you exercise a lot, your requirement for fat may be greater, but in general it is a good idea to watch your consumption of saturated fat and keep it within sight of the recommended daily allowance, and avoid trans fat altogether whenever possible.

i'm sorry but YOU are way off base. for one, national health organizations around the world suggest that 60% of your calorie intake should be carbs (i can link you to a few if you want). the atkins diet has many people worried. they haven't done long term studies, the longest being 12 months, but a few aspects of the diet raise some concerns. for one eating large quantities of meat regularly over a long period of time increases your chance of colon cancer threefold. fruits and vegetables have a lot of nutrients that are required for a healthy lifestyle, you don't eat enough of those in the atkins diet. there are other health concerns as well as some uncomfortable side effects to low carb diets, including constipation, headache, bad breath, muscle cramps, etc. that many (over 60% in some studies for the first two) people experience on this diet.

now i'm not saying that it doesn't work and that you won't lose weight, i'm just saying it's unhealthy.

here are a few links about it:
http://www.atkinsdietalert.org/advisory.html
http://www.atkinsexposed.org/

from the cbc, a good news channel here in canada
http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2004/09/ ... 40903.html

for the first two you can check their sources, they cite them either at the bottom of the page or in a reference section on the website.

anyways, i'm getting sick of you making unsubstantiated claims. please post something to back up what you say, this isn't the first time it's happened.

There are a lot of diets out there. Did it ever occur to you that losing weight is big business? Most of the people who say that Atkins is harmful are outright frauds.

Do you really think that its a good idea for the president of Weight Watchers to come out and say that Atkins is a safe and good diet? What do you think would happen to his business if he did that. He would be out of a job.

You are correct that many governments endorse high carb diets. But that is to get people to become obese so that they will need to spend money on other diets and diet foods. Why do you think that Americans are so fat? They have had the high carb lie drilled into their heads since grade school. So yes, I do believe their is an informal conspiracy in this regard.

If there are no long term studies regarding Atkins proving its safety, then there are also no long term studies proving its harmfulness. People on a low carb diet do eat certain high fiber vegetables, so its not all meat. Also, most people on the Atkins diet only stay on it a short while. So if you figure you need to lose 20 lbs, thats only a month. After that, you need a low carb maintenance diet which is more liberal with the carbs and more like the American Diabetes Association Diabetic Diet.

So are they also saying that the ADA diet is harmful and causes cancer? The thing about diabetics is that high carb diets can actually kill them.

Be careful with your "trusted news sources" because they will say anything you want them to for the right price. Did you know that the "Health Watch" segment on the news is fully paid for by outside interests? This is common knowledge and its a good source of revenue for broadcasters.

Yesterday, the big news was that eating eggs raises your cholesterol. Today, the news is that it lowers it. It all depends on who pays for the segment. When I was a baby, my mother was lied to by the experts who said that "A fat baby is a healthy baby" and now I am paying the price for that lie.

So I say again, if your want to lose weight safely and effectively, go low carb. Don't listen to the anti-Atkins BS that is out there.

Why brown? Sunflower seeds are brown, and they are good for low carb dieting, rich in fiber, etc.

Actually, there was a 24 month study comparing low-carb to Mediterranean and low-fat. Low carb resulted in the best changes to cholesterol and trigylcerides, and the best reduction in body weight. You can read about it here:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18635428

There is no one single diet that benefits all people. But most overweight people have metabolic syndrome (pre-diabetes) or type II diabetes. In such cases, the most effective way to reverse insulin tolerance is to dramatically reduce carbs for a period of time.

Personally, I think that occasional 1 to 2 week low carb diets should take place, followed by increased amounts of healthy carbs (but still relatively low carb compared to the 60% figure). Even on low carb, a person can eat unlimited amounts of some veggies (not potatos and corn, though), and moderate amounts of fruit.




Yes, but a person can take a fiber supplement which prevents constipation and probably brings the risk of colon cancer closer to normal. It isn't clear that meat itself is incredibly toxic - IMO, meat is calorie dense and it displaces fiber from the diet, and fiber is beneficial.

Headache and cramps could be a transitory change as the body's metabolism shifts gear. It could also be related to low potassium levels, which could be a real issue, I agree. Most common in people that are following the low carb diet to a high degree for an extended period - could be a problem, but can also be dealt with using a potassium supplement or easing up a bit on the diet and eating some extra fruit.

Bad breath - that is more of a social issue. With any weight loss diet, if people are depriving themselves of calories to the point that they actually burn stored body fat, they will have bad breath from the ketones that are liberated. Not necessarily bad - the ketogenic diet is used to treat some types of epilepsy, and it helps me with panic attacks. I use breath mints when I decide to go ketogenic.

all i see here are conspiracy theories and speculation, no sound arguments.


The american government isn't the only one who supports high carb diets. Canada endorses it, and i don't see why the canadian government would want people to become obese, we've got free healthcare, the sicker people are, the more it costs the government. i don't think the high carb diet is responsible for the obesity problem in the US, i think the fact that so many people eat way too much of everything and don't do anything physical is the cause of that problem. i know many more healthy people who follow the canada food guide than healthy people on low carb diets, but that's just in my social circle. i also don't know any successful athletes who follow a low carb diet, because it doesn't provide the necessary energy for sports.

it still doesn't allow for the recommended amount of fruits and vegetables


not all disease treatments are healthy. chemotherapy isn't healthy but it's better than dying from cancer. diabetics may die from high carb diets, so they have to avoid carbs, does that automatically mean that low carb diets are healthy? no, it doesn't. it simply means that low carb diets are the best alternative to a normal diet for a diabetic.


that may be true for news public news programs, but the cbc is a government funded corporation. they receive just over a billion dollars in funding from the government. just because you have biased news channels in the US, it doesn't mean everywhere is like that. know what you're talking about before you shoot your mouth off.


with new scientific discoveries comes new advice, it's not just someone buying out the news. and i don't think you're still paying for the advice given to your mother when you were a baby. what damage was done that can't be undone now?


first of all, i didn't say the atkins diet wasn't effective at losing weight, i said i don't think it's healthy. second, you haven't brought up ANY sources that might suggest that "anti-atkins BS" is wrong. all you're doing is trying to persuade people by being loud and obnoxious, and attempting to diminish the other sides' points by calling it BS, without bringing up anything to support your claims. you have yet to provide me with anything to even suggest that i'm wrong, so until you do, back off, you're just making noise.


thank you for posting something to back up your arguments. my only criticism of that study is that they only studied the Mediterranean diet, low fat diet, and low carb diet. i don't advocate a low fat diet, because i don't think it provides enough fat, i don't know much about the mediterranean diet so i can't comment on it, but they didn't study a simple calorie reduction diet, where you simply reduce calories but keep the same recommended intake of fats, proteins, and carbs (% wise).


it's estimated that metabolic syndrome affects around 25% of the american population. considering much more than 25% of the american population is overweight or obese (some estimates put it over 60%) this wouldn't apply to all overweight people. i think most overweight people just eat too much and aren't active enough.


it was muscle cramps, not abdominal cramps. muscle cramps are generally caused by a lack of electrolytes, which you should be getting in a balanced diet. electrolyte supplements are needed in situations where an individual sweats a lot (extreme heat and/or physical exercise), because diet can't provide enough of them if you sweat 6L of water (yes, i have sweat that much) but in day to day activities, one should not require supplements, in my opinion.


i don't know what the cause of the bad breath was, whether it was because of the production and exhalation of ketones or another reason, it was just a complaint that people had. i agree that it may not be an indication of bad health, just an annoyance.

Only a quick update, I am still alive and keeping it up. Today evening was a major milestone for me. I realize that I see the environment and my habits rather differently and hope that even when I return to food, I will by able to use some realizations from these re-examined habits. Until now, I don't feel bad, it feels good to be in control. I try to be more active to prevent muscle being consumed, and bought several flavors of tea today since I can't always drink Austrian fruit tea or water.

be careful if you're doing exercise, you should take it VERY easily, you don't want to faint. i've had a few situations where i went too intensely with too little food and it wasn't pretty. it never looks good when you're clinging on to the garbage bin for dear life in the middle of the weight room.

Info on the man Atkins himself:

http://www.nndb.com/people/153/000025078/

What conclusions do you reach?

I'm a rotteneer, BTW.

http://www.dailyrotten.com

"... it feels good to be in control. I try to be more active to prevent muscle being consumed, and bought several flavors of tea today since I can't always drink Austrian fruit tea or water." --LostInEmulation

I still think the fast is a bad idea. If you fast until you aren't hungry anymore, you could be on the way to a borderline anorexic condition, especially if this feeling of control becomes addictive. Tea doesn't provide the electrolytes you need like potassium and magnesium. I infer this is what killed Terri Schaivo. Her iced tea diet messed with her potassium levels, which stopped her heart long enough to kill most of her brain. That's when the real tragedy happened. In addition her eating disorder must have substantially interfered with her life years before that. She was already gone long ago when they pulled her feeding tube in 2005. You'll probably be OK if you're only doing this for a week, but don't take it further than that because this is how you can end up.

http://www.nndb.com/people/435/000026357/

Here is my conclusion. This is an example of the widespread BS that is circulating regarding Dr Atkins (and implying problems with his diet). From the above site:



That is a clear example of spinning a lie out of the truth. It was originally spun by a pro-vegetarian group and illegally released to the public. Here is what really happened:



When something like a trauma happens to a person, the first thing we do is start an IV and start pumping in fluid to prevent shock. That is going to raise the body weight of a person - especially if their organs have already started to shut down because of the trauma. The 2002 heart attack was from a viral infection and in no way caused by the diet. They also said he suffered from hypertension, but again, fluid overload will also cause this.

So as far as the atkins diet goes, you have to ask yourself, which is worse, being morbidly obese for life, or having bad breath for a month? Is there any other diet out there that can claim that you can lose weight faster than by fasting? Which is more risky - fasting or low carb?

Another thing is muscle loss. Fasting causes a lot of muscle loss. Muscle weighs more than fat. Its the first thing to go in a fast. When the person who started this thread completes their fast at the end of two weeks and then starts eating again, their net loss will be next to nothing. Someone on a low carb diet typically eats a lot of protein which curbs muscle loss, yet their fat loss will be about 10 lbs. on average.

A common statement by people starting the Atkins diet: "I weigh the same but my clothes keep falling off." Because they lose fat around their waist and keep muscle.

So that's about all I'm going to say about this subject. My medical colleges are laughing at me, not because they disagree with my comments, but because I'm spending all this time arguing with a taco about dieting.

losing weight fast isn't always good. it's usually suggested you lose no more than 2lbs per week, although for very overweight and obese people this figure could change.


haha touche

Everybody has their own ideas about food and diets. I think not eating a week doesn't make you lose weight efficiently and I think it's not healthy. I think it's a bad idea. With dieting a lot you are in danger of what we call the jojo effect (weight loss, but later you gain more weight). Just have/create a healthy food pattern and make sure you get enough exercise. And sometimes you can treat yourself on something nice which is not healthy.
Not everything that is good for you taste bad and you can use herbs and spices you like to adjust things to your taste. If you don't like the structure of something, try cooking it in a different way. And check out what food gives you an allergic reaction, so you can avoid it.

Personally I am vegan and yes... ... I make sure I get the right vitamins, etc. I feel good and I am healthy. I really like to cook and a vegan diet has lots of variety. I also try to eat organic and 'local' food, but with food it is always compromising for al sorts of reasons.

"A common statement by people starting the Atkins diet: "I weigh the same but my clothes keep falling off." Because they lose fat around their waist and keep muscle."

I've had this experience. Also, people tell me I look like I've lost weight, but I really haven't. I did it without any special diets other than avoiding excessive consumption of sugar and avoiding junk food (buy the sandwich instead of the candy bar, etc).

Even so, I start to feel bad if I go too long without exercise. I had a break in my routine recently because I became obsessed with something automotive-related, and I didn't run or lift weights for over a week. I started feeling bloated and I got a headache. I started walking last night and after about 2 miles I started feeling better again. In my experience exercise is so important no matter what you're eating. You can't remain healthy by restricting what you eat and neglecting exercise.

Eat veggies and fruit to your hearts content (except potatoes). The only limit on fruits and veggies is that you should get at least 4 servings in each day. The fiber that you cannot digest will keep you full.

Start each meal with high quality protein (fowl, eggs, lean red meat, protein powder, cheese) and get at least 24g of fiber a day. A person that exercises needs twice the protein that an individual that is not requires.

For carbs. Have 2 - 3 servings a day, but not for breakfast or after 8pm.

Work out 30 min a day 3 days a week followed by a high carb recovery shake or meal.

Eat every two to three hours every day until you are no longer hungry, not until full (though that is ok every now and again).

If you follow this lifestyle you will lose weight in a healthy manner without sacrificing quality of life or health.

Starvation diets mess with your metabolism.

That's terrible, you MUST EAT. Your metabolism refers to how your body changes calories into energy (heat, movement of muscles). For the metabolism to work perfectly you have to have at least 1200 calories a day, if you deprive it of this your body believes it is going into starvation mode, slows down the intake and starts to hold onto more fat, sending messages to be less active. Not to mention that once you get out of the stage your body clings onto all the food you eat.

The only way to actually get fit (being fit is more important than being thin, fat just makes it harder on your organs by constraining them) is better diet, more exercise.

Better diet comes first, as if you exercise without the proper nutrition you will experience burnout and quit. Protein is greek for first of primary importance, at every meal you should have protein, however that does give an excuse to have hamburgers or bratwurst (Mmmmm German bratwurst) but meats that are high in protein and carry good fatty acids. The name "fatty acid" does not mean that it will make you fat, it is essential to our living and if we deny it we are unhealthy and ironically overweight.

Next importance is your fresh produce. If your trying to lose weight than try looking into some diabetic recipes out there. Since diabetics require low glycemic levels these diets are low in sugar, and excellent for your health. Do not get me wrong, sugar is important to our bodies but in today's quantities they are unnaturally refined and in excess.

Now you need to take into account the grains, grains are normally high in carbohydrates and calories, but still - yet again - essential to a good diet. The easiest way to think of your grains can be looked at from the concept of Optimal Diets. Optimal Diet refers to what humans have eating over time and recently when farming was implemented unnatural amounts of grains became available. Since our bodies haven't adapted to them well enough yet they are still not of there full potential to us. So we still need to go with what are ancestors ate many years ago like fish, berries, lean meats etc.

Most of important of all BY FAR is your hydration. You NEED water. If you want to lose weight you have have have have have to have water. HAVE TO. I can't express it's importance enough, without enough water all your efforts will be greatly reduced. You need about 2 liters of water a day for a normal person, if you are overweight generally three. These should be spread throughout the day, as high levels of water in small amounts can be bad for your brain. My advice is to take to glasses of water in the morning right when you wake up (or one but you need to drink since you will be dehydrated from sleeping) and every time which you go to the bathroom after that go back and drink another glass. This will help to discard of the water weight that the kidney is holding onto since it believes it's in drought.

Candy and fast foods. You knew it was coming eventually, if you want to get fit you have to avoid these foods as much as possible. I'm not saying NEVER have them, but seriously cut back, all of us eat so much more than we actually realize that is bad for us.

Once your diet is down you have to tackle the exercise option. Find one that you like and commit to it, walking, jogging, running, pilattes, weights, circuits these are all popular "weight loss" options. However if you aren't interested in these activities leave them. If one activity causes you to lose more weight but you don't like it and hate to participate how does that compare to going out all out at another activity. My sport is cycling (road racing) this is an excellent option if you can ride a bike as you can burn large amounts of calories if you truly do love the sport and push yourself real hard.


If you want to get thin you have to stop thinking about "what's bad for me what should I avoid" you have to start thinking "what's good for my metabolism, what activities should I try out". I know this because when I first started weighing 215 pounds, than I put my heart and soul into improving at the sport and three months later I now weigh 160. Don't look for "get thin" sites, look for "get fit" sites.


Last two notes, one if any of my information above is wrong to anyone reading this I express my sorry as I have only based these off of books with cycler's nutrition in it, where as I'm sure a muscle mass body builder has a much different opinion on diet. Second I want to remind you that when exercising you need water, to stretch before, after, and enjoy and love what you are doing.



I hope this helps you on your mission to get *~FIT~* not thin. You are beautiful no matter what others say about your body, and you have amazing dedication if you can starve yourself, but their are others out there that care for your health, and want to see you happy, healthy, and not thin, and starving like third world country inhabitants (Shanti, shanti, shanti, to them all).

I do not want to think of my food as a bunch of chemicals. It's horrible, IMHO! Also I kinda have issues with most of the healthy food. The taste is disgusting, or it makes my face itch or both!

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Please please stop this, your not in control if your hurting your body to chase a media image like "being thin". I work at a troubled youth camp and have seen people with eating disorders, and I don't want anyone feeling the need to hurt themselves to fit in.


You have to make a choice. Right now your addicted to sugar, it impairs your senses, healthy food isn't disgusting, processed foods are gross

I can't post links yet so go to youtube and paste this on the end watch?v=JyX1sfANjR4

It's your choice, but if you deny the truth you will be more unhappy with your health than if you compromised and really looked hard to find healthy food you like.