Unwritten Social Rules of Dating

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Learning2Survive
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20 Mar 2009, 12:54 pm

if i pay for the date that is not good for my gf's self esteem - make her feel like she cannot take care, earn money, and provide for herself. what do you think?

maybe let her pay for coffee, but pick up the cab fare?


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solinoure
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20 Mar 2009, 1:03 pm

Learning2Survive wrote:
if i pay for the date that is not good for my gf's self esteem -


meh - it could be good for her.

My sister used to date guys who would mooch off her, she seemed depressed all the time - now she dates a guy that pays for everything and treats her like a lady, she seems much happier...



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20 Mar 2009, 1:21 pm

Solinoure, I am well aware of the meaning of the word, and the implications of when it is abused. Manipulation is the process of affecting the behavior of another to achieve your own desired outcome, which can come at the expense of the wants and needs of the person being manipulated - not interested. Adaptation is the process of developing one's own self and becoming that best self, not a shabby replica of what is gleaned from the behavior of others.

The floor is yours; as said before, there are simply too large of differences in belief and approach to further this conversation.


M.


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Fnord
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20 Mar 2009, 1:22 pm

solinoure wrote:
... now she dates a guy that pays for everything and treats her like a lady, she seems much happier...

Who wouldn't be happy with not having to pay for anything? The "being treated like a lady" part is secondary to the "guy that pays for everything" part.

Let him stop paying and she'll drop him in a heartbeat, no matter how well he treats her.


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CerebralDreamer
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20 Mar 2009, 1:40 pm

Fnord wrote:
solinoure wrote:
... now she dates a guy that pays for everything and treats her like a lady, she seems much happier...

Who wouldn't be happy with not having to pay for anything? The "being treated like a lady" part is secondary to the "guy that pays for everything" part.

Let him stop paying and she'll drop him in a heartbeat, no matter how well he treats her.

Some women are like that, but not all of them. Unfortunately, those girls that just want a free dinner are the ones that are most likely to say yes. Not a fun situation anyway you look at it.



solinoure
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20 Mar 2009, 1:47 pm

Fnord wrote:
solinoure wrote:
... now she dates a guy that pays for everything and treats her like a lady, she seems much happier...

Who wouldn't be happy with not having to pay for anything? The "being treated like a lady" part is secondary to the "guy that pays for everything" part.

Let him stop paying and she'll drop him in a heartbeat, no matter how well he treats her.


Duuuuuude! I'm just saying that having things payed for for you, is not garantied self-esteem erosion. I personally like it when the girl offers to pay part of the time. That tells me that it is not about what I am paying, but me, and we, that she is here for.

Fnord wrote:
Let him stop paying and she'll drop him in a heartbeat, no matter how well he treats her.


No need to imply that my sister is a gold digging slut. Thank you. My whole family is happy that she has changed the caliber of men she had been dating. There had been plenty of men with money chasing her around that she wouldn't give the time of day to.

Besides, a girl doesn't need a reason to drop a man in a heartbeat - and she doesn't have to do it in a mere heartbeat either. Not in my experience.



Learning2Survive
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20 Mar 2009, 1:58 pm

*advice from a fellow WP member* - just arrived -

You and gf:

order together and split the bill - that's a bonding experience right there!


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CerebralDreamer
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20 Mar 2009, 9:22 pm

Learning2Survive wrote:
*advice from a fellow WP member* - just arrived -

You and gf:

order together and split the bill - that's a bonding experience right there!

Men put themselves into the position of buying dinner so they didn't have to dine with a girl's parents as they did before the automobile came along.

Now it's just an old custom that has yet to break. Thank your grandparents for that one.



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20 Mar 2009, 9:36 pm

CerebralDreamer wrote:
Fnord wrote:
solinoure wrote:
... now she dates a guy that pays for everything and treats her like a lady, she seems much happier...

Who wouldn't be happy with not having to pay for anything? The "being treated like a lady" part is secondary to the "guy that pays for everything" part.

Let him stop paying and she'll drop him in a heartbeat, no matter how well he treats her.

Some women are like that, but not all of them. Unfortunately, those girls that just want a free dinner are the ones that are most likely to say yes. Not a fun situation anyway you look at it.

Point and counterpoint. Well said.


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riley
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24 Mar 2009, 6:02 pm

Fnord wrote:
solinoure wrote:
... now she dates a guy that pays for everything and treats her like a lady, she seems much happier...

Who wouldn't be happy with not having to pay for anything? The "being treated like a lady" part is secondary to the "guy that pays for everything" part.

Let him stop paying and she'll drop him in a heartbeat, no matter how well he treats her.

Actually I resent when guys insist on paying after I have said no.. and I usually say no only after I have detected a predatory attitude.

If I say I'll pay for my own coffee/lunch it should be respected and not argued. ALOT if men insist on paying purely to obligate the woman into owing them something (marking territory) whether it be sex or a 2nd chance and the next tactic they'll use is being "offended" at such ungratefulness and they'll turn it into a battle of wills and try guilt the woman into obligation. It becomes a emasculation issue and it's a very passive aggressive ploy.

That is not trying to treat a woman like a lady.. thats trying to turn her into a whore.



CerebralDreamer
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24 Mar 2009, 6:52 pm

riley wrote:
Actually I resent when guys insist on paying after I have said no.. and I usually say no only after I have detected a predatory attitude.

If I say I'll pay for my own coffee/lunch it should be respected and not argued. ALOT if men insist on paying purely to obligate the woman into owing them something (marking territory) whether it be sex or a 2nd chance and the next tactic they'll use is being "offended" at such ungratefulness and they'll turn it into a battle of wills and try guilt the woman into obligation. It becomes a emasculation issue and it's a very passive aggressive ploy.

That is not trying to treat a woman like a lady.. thats trying to turn her into a whore.

Very understandable. Me, I'll offer to pay, but won't insist. I offer more as a courtesy than anything. If the woman wants to pay for some or all, that's always fine with me. ; )



riley
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24 Mar 2009, 7:55 pm

yeah curtesy and basic good manners is fine- but if he makes a big deal over it like he's slaying a dragon he'll get shot down. the difference is a curtesy out of respect for me vs a self serving gesture thats part of an overall game plan to get in my pants.