Conservatives of Wrong Planet

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Q.E.D.

That's why I never bother arguing with creationists about evolution, or leftists about politics and economics.

Maybe you shouldn't treat every liberal as one cohesive group. You don't want me doing that to you do you?

People still do that except that the mods don't even post/read those sections and have a poor understanding of the board dynamic. They get post reported and show up, I don't think any are active participants.

I think in an election year in what will probably be the most divisive campaign of all time, you're going to need to pay more attention. Things tend to quite down after the elections but it's so crazy we just start talking about the next election now.

If I'm not mistaken, this is exactly what you just did before it got removed by moderation.
Would you like to add something to the topic that isn't a personal attack? Like, what are your thoughts on the OP?

@Jacoby undoubtedly one of the most divisive election years in recent history. If a mod were assigned to PPR I'd hope they are not into politics.

That's starting from the assumption that the conservative poster is wrong and in need of correcting, a stance that causes a lot of resentment right from the start. Why is it that the conservative poster needs to consider the point of view of others, but others do not need to consider the conservative point of view, instead of merely condemning it?

I agree, there are many unpleasant views associated with US conservatism, particularly the religious variety, but I don't think the approach many on the board take to people with those views is terribly constructive, and driving those people away creates an ideological bubble that just leads to monolithic thinking, as well as excluding potential members in need of support.



Again, you're speaking as if the offense were a one way street, when the reality to many is that a foreign culture is imposing it's beliefs on them by force. Even if you think you're right, I think most would agree that persuasion is superior to coercion.

Also, many times those attacks are not confined to what is being said, I can't tell you how many reports I've filed on personal attacks on Angela alone (though I imagine you can see them if you want to).



That's fine, I don't think anyone is saying otherwise, what I and others have a problem with is the constant "conservatives are stupid/bigoted/racist/backwards" attacks that are broad and vicious, and serve no purpose other than to offend and upset. It would be like me following you around attacking everything about you without ever attacking you personally, a form of trolling.



Last I checked, the mods are not supposed to referee debates and qualify who's sources are legit or not, and withhold protection from those who they decide are not good debaters. None of my arguments here have anything to do with the quality of conservative arguments on this site, they're entirely about the way conservative posters are treated.



Except when they're talking about religious people and conservatives, which they do constantly, and which most definitely foments a negative environment here. That's kind of my entire point, and as much as I've tried to avoid pointing any fingers regarding bias, you're making it a bit harder for me not to with some of these statements.



You think there's really that much of a difference? Do you think you'd be friendly to someone who constantly smears your beliefs and talks about you as if you're the scum of the earth, often in broad and inaccurate terms? If so, then you're a better man than I.

In my youth years I was liberal. As I got older I moved to Republican and Conservative.

I also count being a Christian along with the above as part of what makes me , me.

Threads in PPR are fine with me as long as I follow my Counselors reminder. Go there without motive to change a anyone.

In another thread I couldn't figure out why some members started posting on food and vacations. I thought it was to switch subjects or a type of filubustering. Some answered by saying it was small talk after a lecture.

I'm a newbie starting in December of 2015 while waiting for diagnostic process to start.

I think you touch on an important point here, the constant attempts to place certain beliefs in the category of not simply wrong, but so wrong as to be beyond the pale and unworthy of discussion. It's a form of othering, and only further contributes to divisiveness.

Oh, I've been very guilty myself, I've just grown tired over the years, and am looking for a way to break the cycles. I'm choosing to focus on these personal attacks on ideas/groups (conservatives are stupid) as opposed to reasoned attacks on ideas (conservatives are wrong, here's why...), because they piss me off and make me want to cause mental pain to the people who make them, and I can only imagine that impulse is even stronger in member who are actually conservative. It just makes everyone angry, and certainly does nothing to persuade anyone of anything save the vitriol of the poster making the attack.



That's called 'weak manning', it's like straw manning but with an actual person instead of an imaginary position, and generally considered a bit of a debate dark art.



Couldn't have said it better.

As I pointed out in my other reply to you, you did kind of come in here and start victim blaming, and I think that emboldened some of the very people my OP was written about to come in and do the same, starting a whole new cycle. Kind of proves my point.

Why don't you go back and read what I wrote.

If one of my posts was removed I was not informed of it. So I have know I idea what you're referring to.

Dox asked me to respond to this. I Have lot of time for dox, especially as he is one that think outsides the box on a number of issue. We share some simular ideas and disagree on others.

I have mixed feelings however.

I agree with cracking down on outright ad-hominem.

The principle of attack the idea not the person is apt.

I'm socially libertarian so naturally going to be against social conservatism. I'm a secular atheist so naturally I'm going to be critical of religious doctrine. There is nothing inherently wrong with that. Some people might no like that, but why should we make a special case to prevent offense?

I think Dox is genuine in his intentions, however if this is done wrong it could turn in to point scoring exercise among interested parties.

Probably the least interesting discussions on PPR are the party politcal ones. Total snooze fest. Some people support parties like they do sports teams. It is monkey see monkey do, with regard to the political sniping. This is the culture in US, and increasing elsewhere. Policies are secondary.

There are so many quality discussions that don't fit into that category. I'm really proud of the rigorous and enthusiastic discussions we have on PPR, lets not spoil that.

I've never been particularly fussed about the ad hominem attacks, it's just what many people do when their worldview is threatened. It's the easiest thing just to not take them seriously anymore.

I'm much more concerned about overzealous moderation than underzealous moderation. A common thing is to shut down a thread when the personal attacks get out of control, that's not a good thing especially if it's the opponents of the OP who are doing it. You've just shut down the discussion because of squealing protesters, which is often what the rule breakers want.



As for racism, sexism, homo/transphobia etc. This notion of protected groups has more of less ended any discussion of certain things. I was amused this thread almost descended into transwars again. Discussion about female psychology - not allowed, discussion of female voting patterns and their effect on society - thread closed. Stating the most obvious, logical interpretation of gender dysphoria you can make will get you a board warning.

I rarely post on PPR precisely because I have a strict rule about not moderating discussions I'm participating in. Additionally, people who are prone to arguing and bickering tend not to be the ones considered for moderatorship; therefore, most active PPR members don't fit the bill.

As for the rest of this thread, I've seen an equal amount of vitriol spewing forth from both side. I don't see much of a difference between, "Conservatives are dumb," and, "Lefties are responsible for ruining society!" If I acted on the surfeit of reported posts that have cropped-up in PPR over the last several months then PPR would be a ghost town complete with tumbleweeds. The increase in venom is directly related to this dumb election, and my main goal for this season is to get through it without losing my $%#@ mind while trying to keep the scrofulous PPR from collapsing into a midden heap.

As always, I'll be taking Dox's articulate and (as always) reasonable concerns under advisement.

Double post.

I think the etire problem is offense taking. Used to be when somebody stated a different belief you might debate or retort but then let it drop. It was simply the other person's belief now it's seen as a personal attack and call to arms. if someone is against universal income then somebody else sees it as "They want me to starve and it's eugenics we must fight this!" If someone isn't against autism speaks it's "They want to wipe us out and go back in time and kill me in the womb we must fight this!" If someone is anti gun control it's "They want us all to die we must fight this!" And if God forbid someone is for self sufficiency or personal responsibility it's "You ableist scrum you want me to starve on he streets we must fightthis!"

Folks need to stop taking everything so damn personal.

I think you're right.

Reporting someone to the moderators for insulting a person is fully justified.

Reporting someone to the moderators for only denouncing a belief is not even justifiable.

I think that people should learn to not identify so strongly with their beliefs that they become offended by the opinions of people who hold different beliefs, especially if those opinions are fact-based and not mere fantasies.