Making it Better: The future of WP

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BenderRodriguez
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23 Aug 2020, 12:05 pm

alex wrote:

the idea is an optional supporter thing so it wouldn't be required. i think you can get a special badge next to your name saying supporter.

This is a great idea, especially since it's allowing those with limited resources to still use the site. I'm paying a subscription for several sites, so I'm not opposed to the idea.

But there is a problem with it too: it's been a pretty long while now since the site had to function without an active admin while having an array of technical problems: the phpbb is antiquated and buggy and one of the biggest glitches has been getting CAPTCHA with almost any post longer than a few lines or containing longer quotes. Even completing the CAPTCHA correctly leads to the post disappearing and not everybody knows how to recover it, so people get frustrated and stop posting. Notifications have also been a recurring issue: to my amusement, I've just received one now to a post that has been made a week ago.

Or maybe it would be possible to get rid of CAPTCHA for users who pay subscription since they're not going to be spammers?

BTW, did you have time to look into the membership list issue? It shows that now only mods can see it, but they actually stated they cannot see it either

If you add the insufficient number of active mods and seeming lack of cohesion and consensus in the team - the report log not being opened or addressed for months, unanswered and unaddressed public or private reports and lack of transparency, particularly with controversial decisions and harassment, but generally with the process of making decisions and what protocols they have for warnings, banning etc, things have been getting pretty bad here lately independently (if still related) to the whole political circus.

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alex
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23 Aug 2020, 12:06 pm

Please share your ideas. .

alex wrote:

Feyokien wrote:

alex wrote:

the idea is an optional supporter thing so it wouldn't be required. i think you can get a special badge next to your name saying supporter.

alex wrote:

well i had a page you could donate on paypal for the old site but i'd have to tweak it and set it up. I'd also want to know what people thought the main default options as far as $$ per month or per year should be.

Unfortunately I make most of my money from speaking and acting now and that hasn't happened because of this virus but then also most people aren't making much now so I don't know if people would feel like becoming supporters.

Also, maybe there's something of value that could make it more like a freemium model (it's free unless you want the extra content like a podcast or something else but that would be a whole lot of more work for me and i'm sort of already busy with a lot).

Bump

My paypal is just my email [email protected] if people want to help out before I set up a recurring monthly supporter thing.

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Feyokien
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23 Aug 2020, 12:06 pm

Yes we should start over. It was an extremely racially insensitive remark, to compare the n-word (its historical context) to being called a white supremacist, but Sly may not have understood that. We all come from different backgrounds. We should both strive to make this a better community and to educate people if you see problematic behavior. If that doesn't solve the issue than bring it to the attention of the mods. Foremost we are all Neurodiverse (except for the NTs ), we all have more in common with each other than a lot of other people. We all have struggles. Last night was an unfortunate series of events that I feel responsible for precipitating by dredging up old posts. I am sorry . Emotions were high, things happened fast, and neither side understood where each other was coming from.

Last edited by Feyokien on 23 Aug 2020, 12:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

BenderRodriguez
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23 Aug 2020, 12:06 pm

I've been here for more than 8 years: in the last two, the site has been slowly but surely leaking users and people have been complaining and migrated to sites where they don't have these issues. And users here who never got any warnings or bans and generally helped in significant ways with keeping the site active and friendly have expressed their frustrations and reasons for leaving on other sites: this not only contributes to the bad reputation WP gained in the last few years but also reflects the fact that when they expressed their concerns here, they went unanswered or were dismissed, some even publically insulted.

I'm already using several forums and subreddits and another autism forum, but I would like to still be able to use this one and if at least the worst issues here are addressed, I would be glad to pay to compensate for using an adblocker. But if that doesn't happen and the hostility between members and mods continues, you'll still lose a chunk of the already anaemic active membership and very few people will be willing to pay, which will probably lead to demise.

There have been a few tech wizzes here who offered support with the tech side of things, you don't have to do all the work by yourself and they would help for free. There are also people with moderation experience who can help with putting in place more coherent and transparent protocols and training new mods for better efficiency and less covert or overt hostility towards users. And if these things are done, not only it will be easier to get a larger number of paid subscriptions, but I would be happy to make a one time larger donation and start a campaign for others who have the means and willingness, for whatever costs you think can not be covered by volunteers.

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alex
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23 Aug 2020, 12:10 pm

That’s a great idea

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Oh_no_its_Ferris
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23 Aug 2020, 12:12 pm

Feyokien wrote:

Yes we should start over. blah blah

Yes we should start again but just let me have my say first , priceless Fey :lol:

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League_Girl
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23 Aug 2020, 12:15 pm

Drake wrote:

So I've only just found this thread. I don't know if anything productive has been accomplished in it, but I'd like to bring something up.

Tldr version:

If you get banned, you have to go through the mod that banned you and if they don't want to, well tough luck. That should change. I think you should be able to get a second look at the issue from other mods, but if you can't, at the very least the mod in question should have to properly engage, and if they can't be bothered, then at the very least then other mods should be able to take over.

Does this mean mods are above reproach? And that they can't reverse something even if it's blatantly obvious it should be if the punisher doesn't want to?

Longer version:

A while back, I got banned for being "racist" when I wasn't by Skilpadde, and after the ban expired I went into the mod thread to seek answers. I didn't even know what I could have got banned for. There was no prior warning of anything either.

Ferris and Walrus both expected me to know who banned me and why, I knew neither.

She didn't show up in the mod thread and they eventually found out it was Skilpadde and told me to pm her, but I couldn't as she'd disabled the option to pm her.

So they got in touch with her for me, and she came to the thread, irritated, and posted basically what amounted to I banned you for being racist cuz you were, duh. And that was that.

So I continued seeking an explanation, and was getting brushed off by envirozentinal, until Smudge showed up in the thread concerned about the way I was being treated so the attitude changed and I got a pm for the explanation, but it wasn't really an explanation, though it was established what post triggered the ban. We did kind of make up with each other, but all in all it's just sloppy and shabby treatment, and it doesn't need to be if mods aren't above reproach from other mods.

At least the other three mods were willing to put in a not insignificant amount of time and effort, and I did learn a few things about how things work here. But I'm sure no one could have explained it because the ban was wrong.

I'm sorry you were treated that way and you should have been provided an explanation and it sounds like assumptions were made.

Even if what you wrote was in fact racist, you still should have been informed about it. I know how upsetting it is to just get banned without an explanation and you are left wondering what you did wrong and you feel bullied and victimized.

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Drake
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23 Aug 2020, 12:15 pm

alex wrote:

I don't think all the trump voters the first time around would be considered white supremacists but certainly if they vote for him in the 2020 election now that he's made it clear that he believes in those ideals.

They've told you a lie, alex. A very pervasive lie. If that is what you are basing Trump being a white supremacist on. See claim 3:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-53858940

I've personally seen the words out of Trump's mouth, waaay back when this hit the news and it got debunked, but somehow, it lives on even now.

League_Girl
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23 Aug 2020, 12:18 pm

alex wrote:

blooiejagwa wrote:

alex wrote:

League_Girl wrote:

alex wrote:

Feyokien wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

Feyokien wrote:

https://wrongplanet.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=388536

Is this the thread that has everyone so riled up?

There's likely more than one, this has been a point of contention for years, even in the era BT. :lol:

BT = Before Trump I assume?

Has Sly ever actually supported white nationalist groups verbally? Are his responses meant as a critique to how some people perceive 'the Left' to be pure.

Sly I think this would be a good time to explain your point of view carefully and calmly as you can.

He used the N word in this thread.

Where did he say that?

I am not reading 116 pages to find it.

he equated people calling him a white supremacist with people calling black people the n word, but he wrote it out

In context that doesn't sound racist.. He's posing one insult alongside what he believes is the equivalent to show how offended he feels

We live in a country that enslaved Black people very recently and legally enforced racism even more recently. There were formerly enslaved people still alive when my parents were not only alive but were adults.

Consequently it’s going to be common for a lot of us to be racist when we were raised in a country that supported and encouraged racism and still does. We need to be vigilant and anti racist with each other (but especially with ourselves)

The idea that saying the n word is ok in any context is just not right.

You aren’t even supposed to sing it along when a black person uses it in a song.

Calling out others as racist is not an insult. I’d want to be called out as racist if I said something racist so I could make sure to never do that thing again.

People are looking at it the wrong way. It’s not even a left right issue.

Lot of people use it as a quotation, is that okay?

I am also curious about your answer to Sly's question about if Historians are racist because they have used that word regarding black history.

Sly made a mistake here and thought it was okay to write the word because he wasn't calling anyone it and thought it was only bad to call someone it.

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smudge
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23 Aug 2020, 12:20 pm

I don't like how the vulnerable or lesser well-known posters get excluded from being treated fairly, or are jumped upon here.

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I've left WP.

Last edited by smudge on 23 Aug 2020, 12:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Oh_no_its_Ferris
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23 Aug 2020, 12:22 pm

Drake wrote:

Ferris and Walrus both expected me to know who banned me and why, I knew neither.

I don't remember that incident dude , PM me if you want to jog my memory.

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Drake
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23 Aug 2020, 12:25 pm

League_Girl wrote:

Drake wrote:

So, I'm not the only one it's happened to.

I think this is a good time to add that while sure, I want to remove the stain from my name, this is less about my own personal experience, and more about the flaw in the system which allowed this to happen to us. It happened because it can, and it can keep happening. That's the main problem. And it would seem even more important to correct it if we're about to get some new mods.

Feyokien
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23 Aug 2020, 12:26 pm

Oh_no_its_Ferris wrote:

Feyokien wrote:

Yes we should start over. blah blah

Yes we should start again but just let me have my say first , priceless Fey :lol:

I was explaining why we should start over.

I'm sorry. I over-explain things. I don't get to talk much from being dominated most of my life. I've been trying to build up my confidence. I've made it worse.

I'm having a meltdown, I'm sorry, good day everyone.

AuroraBorealisGazer
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23 Aug 2020, 12:29 pm

alex wrote:

blooiejagwa wrote:

alex wrote:

League_Girl wrote:

alex wrote:

Feyokien wrote:

funeralxempire wrote:

Feyokien wrote:

https://wrongplanet.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=388536

Is this the thread that has everyone so riled up?

There's likely more than one, this has been a point of contention for years, even in the era BT. :lol:

He used the N word in this thread.

Where did he say that?

I am not reading 116 pages to find it.

he equated people calling him a white supremacist with people calling black people the n word, but he wrote it out

In context that doesn't sound racist.. He's posing one insult alongside what he believes is the equivalent to show how offended he feels

Alex, it's important to remember that there are many members here from different countries that aren't aware of what goes on in the US to the extent that you are. You are also a popular person living in a very progressive city, where I surmise you're exposed to many social activists/aware/woke people who know all of the rules.

I've become quite liberal in my political views, but I haven't been exposed to the same things you have and I'm still learning what things are and aren't PC. As autists we've probably all had our words pounced on because we don't know all of the social rules. This becomes very distressing when you have good intentions but can't ever seem to say things correctly.

I would hope on a site for NDs that we could be given the benefit of the doubt (that we may not know everything you know). I think instead of pointing fingers and declaring someone a racist, it would be helpful if we took the time to discuss with the person why what they said was offensive.

Drake
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23 Aug 2020, 12:30 pm

Oh_no_its_Ferris wrote:

Drake wrote:

Ferris and Walrus both expected me to know who banned me and why, I knew neither.

I don't remember that incident dude , PM me if you want to jog my memory.

Do you still have moderator access? If I remember right, the posts in the moderator attention forum are archived, not destroyed, and you guys can see them.

The date of the pms from environzentinel is 12th July 2019. So the posts in that thread about it will end on that date.

Oh_no_its_Ferris
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23 Aug 2020, 12:32 pm

Feyokien wrote:

Oh_no_its_Ferris wrote:

Feyokien wrote:

Yes we should start over. blah blah

Yes we should start again but just let me have my say first , priceless Fey :lol:

I was explaining why we should start over.

I'm sorry you having a meltdown , my intention here is to not cause meltdowns but prevent them so that is not good, I'm sorry if you feel dominated , everyone here should have the freedom to have equal say ( within the rules ).
I am generally a sarcastic person but I did not mean offense , just like pointing out hypocrisy ( it's my curse ) , PM when you want, if you want to chat.

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