daughter won't stop lying!! !

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Is this part of the Aspergers? She continually does things she's not supposed to do, and hides it. When confronted she lies until she realizes she's caught. Like she'll be playing games or looking at other things on computer when she's supposed to be doing homework on computer. Like last night apparently I forgot to make sure her cell phone was in my bdrm. She stayed up till midnight watching videos. (Cute animal stuff, nothing bad, thank goodness.) I can't stand this habitual lying! So now she can only use main computer in our home for homework (which uses our tv screen, so it's harder to get away with doing other stuff). And I took away her phone. And I've decided she will not go to first school dance tomorrow night. I have passwords on almost every device. All are usually checked into my bedroom at night. Again I ask, is this the Aspergers?! She's 13 yrs old, btw. She complains she never gets to play games or watch tv. I feel like she often dislikes me and my rules. I can live with her not liking me, but it seems it makes it easier to disregard my rules and to lie to me.

Seriously, does your daughter ever get to have a life at all?
I'd lie too if I was her.

Well does she ever get to play games and/or watch t.v?...or to even use her phone for that matter. I mean only allowing her to do homework and banning her from any social activities likely isn't going to solve the issue. Sounds like she seriously feels like you don't let her do anything...perhaps she even feels left out, since the other kids at school probably do those activities you seem to heavily limit. Maybe a tiny bit more allowance for her to do activities she wants and have fun in return for doing her homework and turning it in, and doing well in class(not sure if she has learning disabilities or anything that would interfere with specific grades, in which case effort and good behavior should count for something). If you're having her do homework right after getting home from school that could be too much school work at once....perhaps if she was able to have some free-time before having to do homework that would work better. I mean unless I am misunderstanding she is basically allowed to come home, do homework, eat, shower, sleep and be grounded from social events indefinitely? that is sure to cause some rebellion no matter how you slice it.

Let her have freedom! She's 13, not 6...

No. Aspergers does not cause lying. Some people on the spectrum lie some don't. Many have trouble lying at all. I am one who has a lot of trouble lying.

As much as she may protest losing the dance it's a social event many kids on the spectrum would not want to go to. And some kids misbehave to have parents or teachers say they can't do things they don't want to or don't know how to manage. So before you take away the dance as punishment, think about how social your child is. If she isn't that social and you feel she may want to avoid some social demands, then don't let her use you to hate so she can get out of stuff. She needs to learn to handle things.

Some kids don't limit themselves well, I'd probably not ask her to stay off her phone like at night until she shows she can, I'd just take it away at night if she uses it too much. I'd give it back during the day. I think giving freedom she can handle is important and not waiting until she does everything right. Because as a child on the spectrum, her development will be uneven and it almost encourages lying if we as adults don't look at the child in front of us to judge where he or she is capable and should be free and where he or she is needing a lot of structure and supervision. I hope that makes sense. I think there are things you can do to reconnect and because kids on the spectrum don't relate easily to peers many times, they really need better relationships with adults to help them with that, IMO.

As has been said, Aspergers doesn't make someone lie.

But I wonder about you. Your post seems off to me in many, many ways. You claim to have a daughter with Aspergers, but you don't know anything about it (or you wouldn't have asked such a question) You have lived with this girl for 13 years, but you speculate about her reasons and thinking as if she was utterly alien and unknown to you.

How is that possible?

Are you neurotypical?
Is it possible that your interest in control and rigid rules are an expression of some atypical neurology of your own?

You seem to be more upset at the idea of your daughter breaking rules than the idea that she doesn't like you.

I find this incomprehensible.

Affection between parents and children is very important. Whenever I am in conflict with my children, I make sure they understand that my displeasure is limited solely to the issue at the focus of the conflict, and not at their persons. I make sure they know I love them and they often express love to me. We like each other and I consider the degree to which we can remain affectionate and still sustain disagreements a sign of parental success.

This sounds like a parent/child issue and not an autism issue. Many autistic people have an easier time being honest than lying. To be honest, teenagers are going to break the rules, even autistic ones. I understand you're frustrated, have you tried other techniques aside from just punishment? Perhaps rewarding her for good behavior? I lived in a household with a depressive father and whatever I did received a negative reaction, whether it was good or bad. After a while I just stopped caring since the results of my actions didn't matter, the treatment would be the same either way. If she's grasped that attitude, it's not going to be pleasant for you and not good for her in the long run. The only thing I can say is that if what you're doing isn't working you need to switch it up somehow and keep switching it until you get results. Also, does she have any other issues going on that may be influencing her behavior? A lot of teenagers will barricade themselves in the face of stress-- this includes acting out to keep that barrier intact. Also, the type of friends she has may be influencing the behavior, teenagers will follow their peers. Good luck.

Please don't be turned off by the bluntness of responses. I think you are right if she does not like you, if she does not agree with or understand your rules, it makes it easier to disregard them. A typical child is more likely to respon to rewards and punishments, IMO than a child on the spectrum who may be unwilling to go along unless she respects you. So her not liking your rules, or you, are a very big deal and I think you need to help her work with you rather than punish or nothing will change. Please understand we want to help though, not to criticize you.

There are multiple factors that may be coming into play:

1. The fact that she is a 13 year old girl and at that age mothers and daughters butt heads constantly (I have a 14 year old daughter).
2. The fact that having ASD means that she is, no doubt, developmentally behind in knowing how to manage her own time and stay on task. She will need support, not threats, to manage the workload until she has matured enough to handle it. I used to break it up into 15 minutes parts for my son, and used all sorts of creative ideas to keep him on task with a middle school workload well beyond his developmental abilities for staying focused and on task (he was more than able to handle the content, it was the volume that was the issue).
3. The fact that ASD children NEED more down time than NT children, in order to decompress and organize themselves after what is, for them, an extremely stressful day. Imagine having to live your day with someone dragging their nails across the chalkboard the entire time; that is what being around people and everyday noise is like for many ASD children.
4. The fact that some ASD children at that age seem to reach the conclusion that the rest of us are all hypocrites about lying and basically decide to join the party. My son reached the conclusion we were all hypocrites, but his internal code kept him honest (and very self-righteous, I might add; sigh). Others may make a different decision. Why would someone reach that conclusion? Because in a black and white world, and black and white is how those with ASD usually see things, social graces DO seem like lies, no matter how often we explain it all, and it will be a few more years before your daughter can truly understand the difference.
5. She may feel doomed to failure with so many expectations, and once that feeling sets in, individuals stop trying to comply and resort to whatever seems like the most convenient way to get out of the spot (lying tends to fit that bill). Be careful that when you think she is capable of something, she truly is capable of it; ASD can be deceiving, because these are often smart kids. But that does not mean they are actually capable of what, to us, is simple task B. The developmental gaps and impairments can manifest in the oddest of ways.
6. It is also possible that she is being literally truthful to questions you are asking, while you are focusing on the intent of your question. My example is that when my son wasn't washing his hands, I had to learn to ask, "have you washed your hands in the last 5 minutes?" After all, in theory, the question, "did you wash your hands?" can be truthfully answered "yes" if a person has ever washed them. You can never assume that an ASD child knows what you mean beyond the literal words you chose. They may, and may play it ... or they may not. Avoid the problem by being complete, literal and precise.

Battling with your daughter and asserting your authority is, to put it simply, only going to make things worse. You need to re-establish trust with her that not only are you truthful to her (be careful to speak literally and precisely), but that you also understand her needs and limitations, and are not asking things from her that she is not capable of accomplishing.

She is at very difficult age, no doubt, and the mother/daughter dynamic is going to complicate it (thankfully my ASD child is my son, not my daughter!), but sticking to the parenting protocols we recommend on this board is going to get the best result, long run, so read around and make sure you understand where she is coming from as you try to deal with these issues.

Good luck.

Scratch my earlier post, I'm going with DW_a_mom on this one. She obviously has experience, her post was thorough and made a lot of sense...and I'm a sucker for the style of her avatar.

I wish I was half as wise, compassionate and thoughtfully expressive as DW_a_mom!

Sorry, MomOfASDtr, if my post above was jerkish--I was thinking through my reactions as I wrote and it may have come out in a harsh and judgmental way. Were I to do it over again, I would try to write something more like the wisdom DW offered.

We are lucky she's here!

She sounds like a pretty normal teenager, to be honest. For starters, (and don't take this the wrong way), how much do you actually know about Asperger's? Have you been to a psychologist? Have you been to more than one? Have you discussed the diagnosis, and what it all entails? Have you read any Asperger's and autism-related literature? If your child has been formally diagnosed, then reading the literature is your responsibility as a parent.

I know you don't want to hear this, but without any further context I can only conclude that you're a bit of a control freak. If you want your daughter to be happy and successful in life, you've got to let her make her own mistakes. Nobody ever learned to ride a bike without scraping their knee a few times.

I seemed to have read the OP differently because what I saw is, the daughter has homework to do so instead of doing it, she plays games, they could be video games or puzzles or board games, and she also goes online and looks stuff up, this is normal parenting stuff, all parents want their kids to do their homework first before they do anything else.

Also I haven't met a parent that didn't give their kid a bed time, if the girl has school the following day, she should be up with her phone so she was supposed to be in bed so the mother keeps it locked so she can't use it when she is supposed to be sleeping.

What I read was it sounds like she has a rebellious teen who doesn't like boundaries and doing her school work so the mother has to limit everything and it doesn't mean she never lets her do them, she can do them when she doesn't have homework or other things to do or when she should be in bed, this all sounds normal to me.

I think part of it is her being a teen because at that age, kids want to be more independent and make their own decisions so they think their parents rules are stupid or may find their parents to be control freaks.

I know this is hard for most parents but sometimes we have to pick our own battles so if that means letting our kid fail, then so be it. Let them learn from the natural consequence. She didn't do her homework, she gets a bad grade for not turning it in on time, she keeps not doing her homework, she ends up falling behind and being held back. This is hard for a parent to let happen with their child and no parent wants to see their kid fail and they feel it makes them bad parents if they don't make them do their homework or if they let them do whatever they want but actually it's about choosing your own battles and use natural consequences and it's their problem not yours. This is something I have read online on Empowering Parents.

Raising a teen is tough. I am so not looking forward to it but I have a long way before I get there and hopefully I would have raised my kids to be responsible and to take their education seriously that I wouldn't have to act controlling and I can trust them with their own decisions and I wouldn't have to make them do their homework or going to bed because they can still get up for school.

And no lying is not part of Asperger's. In fact I have read aspies are loyal they wouldn't lie and they are very honest but I know this isn't true for every aspie because every one of us is different.

I wouldn't scratch your post; it made sense. Parents need a menu of ideas and points to find what will work best for them and their unique child. Sometimes they understand things best the way one person wrote it; sometimes a different poster and a completely different approach hits home. But I appreciate the compliment.

I always thought it was an aspie thing to not lie, to hate lying, or at least just be terrible at it because of things that all liars have to be "good at", like eye contact and a very good short-term memory.

I went to a religious school as a kid, where I was once strapped in front of the class for lying, although I didn't understand what I had "lied" about, or even what lying was, I was only in 1st Grade maybe. All I remember is my teacher screaming bloody murder at me and the sounds of the strap and stinging pain, and crying. Barbaric. I guess I'm going to hell now according to that teacher, among many, many other reasons.

As a teenager my Mom usually wouldn't ground me because I never really went anywhere anyway. I might get to go on a Saturday shopping trip if I was lucky, but I never learned how to drive and we lived too far from everything. Usually I would have allowance money or TV taken away. My brother on the other hand seemed to get grounded all the time, and sometimes he'd even bribe me so he could go out with his friends.

I have As but my four kids are NT although my younger son may have AS like me he's not interested in finding out. That sounds like just part of being a kid to me. Also, that doesn't sound like she's done anything too terribly bad except defy you, and she defied silly rules about tv, phone and computer she didn't sneak out and go get a tattoo or anything. Big difference.

I know it can be hard when you feel like they should be obeying you over the little things and they just won't, but I found out that it's probably better to pick your battles and let the little stuff go. Loosen up on her with the tv and computer and games and phone. Unless she has some serious issues that tv and games and computers and phones cause then in my opinion you are being too strict. That will make her defy you more. If she's like me and feels that a rule needs to make sense before she follows it, then she's not going to follow those rules because they aren't hurting anything to her. Not letting her go to the first dance because she was on a phone playing games late is way over the line of strict.

You are aware of the social problems that AS can cause, right? You want her to have a social life, right? If so then don't cut off her chances because your feelings are hurt that you don't feel she respects your authority enough. She's not being bad at all.

I'd sit her down and talk to her and tell her exactly how it made me feel when she lied to me. Tell her that you dont feel you can trust her when she lies about little things so that makes you want to limit the big things she does. That is a battle that will never be won on either side, so you should probably compromise with her and agree to start fresh on both sides. Give her realistic limits that are similar to what other kids her age have. Ask around here or parents of her friends if you want some ideas. Then tell her that if she minds you about those limits that you will trust her more and start letting her do more things.

No teenager ever died or was hurt by watching cute animal videos or staying up past bedtime playing video games on the phone. Honestly she probably feels like when she has a chance to sneak and do something that she better becausee there is no telling when she might be able to again.

I went to school with a girl whose mother was overly strict like that. Anytime Shelly would disobey her mother would come down harder. That made Shelly disobey more and more. It became a battle to best her mother and piss off her mother rather than to do a particular thing. It was a fight for control and you cannot win that. You may can put them in military school for a bit but they grow up and hate you for a while. Shelly started hanging out with the stoners and got in a whole lot of trouble for a long time just because she wanted to show her mom that she wasn't going to control everything. Yeah she made bad decisions and it wasn't all her mother's fault but all the girl wanted was to have some privacy on the phone and to not be grounded if she didn't do a chore and to be allowed to have friends over instead of constantly being in trouble. Little lies are going to happen. Kids are learning how to do that, and they practice on you. No you don't want them to and yeah you want to keep an eye out for them but you should let them get away with some things sometimes. Tell them that you let them get away with it too if that makes you feel better but you don't want her to remember this part of her life like she's in prison or something.

What bad thing can games and tv and the phone and computer do to her anyway?