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LoveNotHate
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16 Oct 2018, 11:40 pm

I find it interesting that reality has a speed limit.

Supposedly, nothing in reality can go faster than ....

299, 792, 458 m / s

Image


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aghogday
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17 Oct 2018, 1:26 pm

SMiLes; i Find It Interesting,
Stimulating, Fascinating Now
As Science continues to
Offer Evidence
Of/FoR REAL All
The Way from the
Participant Observer
Effect to Quantum
Entanglement and
Yes A Holographic
Simulation NoW aS
Created As Is NoW By
A Much More Intelligent
Being As Supreme Than US
iN An Intelligent Design
Far Beyond what
Math Equations
say
Exists As
i find it even
More Ironic/sAd That Humans
Continue to Subtract 'the Love'
Math That Is Always ART out of
60 Percent heART, smART and
by
God
Even Mother
Nature as eARTh;
So, CaLL PoEtry in
Free Verse
Coincidence
but It Is as Real
As the Synchronicities
We do or do not Experience
of the Hallucination that Neuroscience
Evidences Now That Is All Of Our Realities
We Co-Create
With the
Rest of the
Math of Nature
That once again is
At Least Irrational in
Math of Pi and PHI too As Numbers;
And all of the Reality We Co-Create
For Colors, Flavors, Emotions, Senses That Feel and Sense More
Like Joy Loves Company in Bliss or the Alternate Multi-Universe
Place of Numb and or Pain We Co-Create And Co-Exist in As Suffering
And Misery Loves
Company too...
A Best Math
is Love and
The Heaven
We Co-Create
And Hallucinate as
More Real Than Most Folks Co-Exist in now for Real as Real will
Be, Have Yet to Develop as an Art For Reality even more as F iN Fun.
It's True; tHere is a Math (Life) For Fun; but it is an Art Equation That is Not EnTirely 'Rational' ONE Co-Creates.


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17 Oct 2018, 1:39 pm

God and numerology don't mix.



aghogday
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17 Oct 2018, 2:09 pm

Smiles, if one REALLY gets ALL 'the' (A) Poetry of 'the Bible';
Alpha Through Omega Means All Now.
All Includes Numerology, now As Art;
All Includes All; It's as simple as that and Complex too.
It's also worth Noting too that the Poetry Story of Jesus
Is Totally Natural too; once one gets out of the Literal; by God So Ironically True as Metaphor More.
In other Words, God is 'the' A 'Pac Man' that/who Consumes all and is all, if one Believes 'the Bible'
And Has A Basic Ability to Discern Very Simple Poetry From Alpha to Omega All That is Now as All
Where First
And Last is Now
As God is Ageless
And Timeless NoW As Us too NoW As All.
Those Bible Writers Were A Bunch of Middle Eastern
Folks Then Who Discarded the Clothes of Culture and
Found Themselves Whole With Nature And so Happy With
Glee to No Longer Feel SO Alone; and Separated From the Rest of Nature (God)
That They Came to Worship all that is
As Holy
and
Sacred even more
Full of Meaning and Purpose
Using Greatest Gifts of Imagination
And Co-Creativity too; Even Creating Temples For Worshipping (God) as ALL;
Sadly, in What Became Clothes of Culture Separated From Nature Whole (God) Again.

Some Folks Get Deep And Whole Fuller Allone (God);
Some Folks Get Shallow And Separate Emptier Alone.

It's True; one Can/Will be alone or ALLONE;
Depending On How Big one Sees one (God).


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LoveNotHate
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18 Oct 2018, 12:30 am

JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, then all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.


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Last edited by LoveNotHate on 18 Oct 2018, 12:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

RetroGamer87
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18 Oct 2018, 12:36 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, than all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.

So math may have been an illusion all along?


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LoveNotHate
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18 Oct 2018, 12:38 am

RetroGamer87 wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, than all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.

So math may have been an illusion all along?

It's philosophical, so you have to decide that yourself.


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RetroGamer87
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18 Oct 2018, 12:40 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
RetroGamer87 wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, than all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.

So math may have been an illusion all along?

It's philosophical, so you have to decide that yourself.

Does that mean philosophy is only a matter of opinion?


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RetroGamer87
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18 Oct 2018, 12:41 am

LoveNotHate wrote:
I find it interesting that reality has a speed limit.

Supposedly, nothing in reality can go faster than ....

299, 792, 458 m / s

Image


I heard someone suggest that the the speed of light is also the speed at which we pass through time. That if time is thought of as just a fourth dimension of space than each year is a light year long.

Time is like space in many respects but that doesn't explain time's arrow.


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PhilipCain
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18 Oct 2018, 8:54 am

Religion and mathematics are not very compatible concept, therefore it is better to attach.



aghogday
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18 Oct 2018, 10:54 am

JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?


Just a Suggestion; If you really want to come Closer to God; what has worked for many through the Ages in terms of Sitting Under A Tree; or Going for a Very Long 40 Day Walk into the Desert as somewhat of a 'Thornier' way of doing it; or Sitting in a Cave that is not my Preference either, as I find Sitting Still Meditation just boring no matter what Repetitive Mantra i say as i Move Closer to God as and in Nature through Innate Instinct in Intuition in Feeling and Sensing Life;

And Before I go on, don't get me Wrong; I made Straight A's all through School and Graduated with Three College Degrees Finishing 33 Year of Work, including 25 Years in the Red Tape of Technical Write in Federal Government Work too; so, i can and will do "Left Brain Think" in the way of an INTJ Personality too on a Flip of a Dime away from a Personality that is more like ENFP that i am currently Utilizing now in more of an Intuitive Poetic HeART Filled Philosophy that is much less Linear in think; and More like the Golden Spiral of PHI; yes, the Finger and Foot Print of God Dancing in Patterns as Metaphor and Literal Scientific Measured Reality through the Observable Universe from Smallest Sub-Atomic
Particles to Galaxies Like our Milky Way too; Yes, Observable Measures of Reality Using Math are Sublime
too now in Empirically Repeatable and Confirmed 'Math Measured Reality' with some 'Alphabet Soup' too.

The THINGS though; that many Folks (Sages) through the Ages that have taken them Closer to what they Metaphor God as in all the Names for this Much Bigger Picture Knowing, Feeling, and Sensing; With A Potential Unpacking of an Existential Intelligence in Epigenetic and Neuroplastic Ways of Re-Wiring our Realities that takes us so much Broader than Detail Thinking Now of Science and Math Equation Life is yes; these 'THINGS' are the Appropriate Environmental Stimuli that
Will Open us Up to a More Intuitive Larger Picture View of Reality, considering that yes; for all Practical Intents and
Purposes this Metaphor of God is the BIGGEST 'THING' AS ALL; everything we know, feel and sense we come to
'See' and Be Now Expanding our Human Potentials so much further than what Data Down-Load facts we
are fed in School to become Cogs in the Machine of whatever Culture we are a Part of now as just
Another Metaphor for that Series of Movies Named the 'Matrix' too. This Story has been told in many ways now
ever since Human Separated Human from Nature Naked with all the Metaphor of Cultural Clothes that continue to
be added, taking us so much further away from Naked Nature now as Evolutionarily Changed now in each and every
New Addition through so many layers of Additional Cultural Clothes Spoon-Fed to us from almost Birth now to Be.

There is a Japanese Word and Practice (I am not Japanese, by the way; as my Avatar Photo likely portrays but hey; i
have access to Google and can look up Formal Words for Natural Practices of 'Forest Bathing' that is old as the
Evolution of us now still to be all Natural as not just Tree Huggers but Tree Climbers too); yes, this Practice
is called "Shinrin-yoku" and by God of Nature it's really not any different than what the Story of Buddha
Portrays as just relaxing sitting under a Tree in Natural Nature Meditation Free to Be. But it is just a little
Different in the Sense and Feel that it is a Free Style Meditation of Slow Walking through A Green Nature
Forest Just Absorbing all the Feelings and Senses from Head to toe; And this my FriEnd opens up the
Intuitive Parts of Our Nature as you may relate to, too, if you have ever done a Relaxing Hike in
A Forest away from all the "Left Brain" think ways of continuously Measuring the Past
and Predicting the Future in an Illusion of Human Created Clock Time like Math that can
and will take us away from the Innate, Instinctual, Intuitive way of Seeing life in what i Love to Term
ISA's in 'Right Brain' Feel and Sense of Taking in Reality in Innate, Instinctual, and Intuitive Ways of Feeling
And Sensing Reality versus the Sitting Still Taking Notes Version of School and Work Life for many that is mostly
Crystalized Intelligence in KSA's of Knowledge, Skills, and Abilities versus what our Ancestors Did much more of in
'Right Brain' "Left-Hand Paths" of ISA's; So, Truly in this way most of us are already operating our Realities now in the
Metaphor of the "Matrix Movies" as we are more connected to a Spoon-Fed Crystalized Intelligence of the Cultural
Clothes we are Required to put on in more Complex Layers as we continue to move away from our Evolutionary
Ancestral Nature in NDD, Nature Deficit ways of being; Yes, I realize this is rather Dense in Information that
you may not have been exposed to Before; And the Best News of All is Getting Close to the Nature of God
that is both Literally and Metaphorically Nature in all we Know, Feel, and Sense about Living Life and
Being Life per the Intelligences of Existential Intelligence that does move out into the Exploration of
the Mysteries of Life that are not parts of Life that can be Measured by the rather Antiquated Few
Step Method of the Modern Scientific Method to Measure the Parts of Reality in Detail thinking
of Replication and Mutual Confirmation that we Will Consensually Agree is the Reality we share
now is that
By
God as Nature Yes
Getting Close to the
Nature of God can and will
Be Done Best by Shedding
all of what I Just Said and
Simply Taking a Walk in
Nature Finding Peace
And Harmony
Appreciating
this Gift of Life more
Understanding Better
that the Arms of Nature including us is the Living God Now;

Not to get too Religious, in Organized ways; but the Censored-Out Part of A Story Book of A Jesus In A Bible folks read
other wise existing in a Gospel of A Story Attributed to a Man Named Thomas as a Gospel by a Man Named Jesus puts it into very simple terms like this:

37) His disciples said, "When will You become revealed to us and
when shall we see You?"
Jesus said, "When you disrobe without being ashamed and take
up your garments and place them under your feet like little
children and tread on them, then [will you see] the Son of the
Living One, and you will not be afraid"

These are Incredibly Simple Words of Advice but Incredibly wise for
The Veils of Ignorance that take us away from the Nature of God as Nature
are all the layers of Cultural Clothes that are Spoon-Fed to us from Birth that do clothe
Us away from a Naked Beach of Bliss; True, I do Forest Bathing on a Daily Basis as my Back
Yard is Literally a Forest; but what I Love Best is a Beautiful Beach I was born Close too named
Navarre Beach still undeveloped enough in National Seashore way to leave all the Condos Behind
And even Human Footprints too; for if one travels far enough like this Back into the Nature of Ancestral
Roots of us before
All the Cultural Clothes
Became Tools we used and
sadly extensions of Nature as
us that also become the Mechanized
Cognition of Cogs in the Machine of A 'Matrix' Complex Culture now;
So many of us come to Be Lost from the Inheritance of Naked Nature of and in us best;

Yes, Chances are if one does not find God on a Naked Beach away from all Human Cultural Clothes;
they may be too far gone to come Back to A Nature of God Naked and Free again in/as us; But I personally have
Hope with enough Beach Walks Humans Will Return as a Living Beach too; in other words, Free God in Us Love Incarnate;

Notice, I didn't really say anything about Organized Religion; as that is mostly about Politics and Controlling Group Think.

'God' is not nearly
as Free in us when
We are Domesticated
Away from Wild and Loving Free Incarnate Love Living Within
like that Verse 37 of that so-called Gnostic Gospel of Thomas.

Just my opinion; but this is the Best of God Nature Now for me
Without any Math or other Human Tools at all; not even a Word.

But hey; without Words/Numbers; how in the World is one going to express the deeper smaller parts of reality (God)
too that may at essence be so simple and free to others; so far trapped away in the Cultural World of Complex Words
and yes Numbers too; and by the way Numbers are Nature too and so are letters in Ancestral Ways of Making Pictures
of Nature and transforming them into Numbers and Letters and Jesus F in Christ even 6 Million Word Modern Age Bibles
by one
Human
who is a
Big Enough Beach
to do that in 5 Years too.

We are Stronger when we Hold Hands Together Loving Wild
As Long as We Remain Free to the Nature of What Frees us Within;

No,
Now the
Word God Now
is not necessary Now
in the Nature of Within
Inside, Outside, Above So
Below, Spiraling All Around too
As Just Another Spiral Now of a
Pyramid
Tree too
As A Ratio of
1.6180134...etcetera..:)


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Mythos
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21 Oct 2018, 12:50 pm

Prometheus18 wrote:
Mythos wrote:
Not explicitly. Learning mathematical proofs is merely a method to determine the aspects of the universe as set by us. In other words, mathematics was and is our tool to extract truth from the seeming chaotic nature of the universe. It will allow us to gravitate towards the truth of the reality of everything around us but that's more or less the extent of it.
This is incredibly naïve; the language in which mathematical proofs are constructed is set by us, but this hardly implies that we determine the nature of the universe itself in constructing such proofs.
What do you mean? That's the purpose of mathematics; to determine the world around us using logic that we have built and tested.

To clarify my original point, what I mean to say is that mathematics is a measuring stick for the universe. We use it to scale, interpret, calculate, construct and perceive. Mathematics as a function will likely get us no closer to "God" than a ruler.

Though bringing up quantum mechanics is an interesting subject. Quantum entanglement, which has been successfully used for quantum teleportation (to teleport information/qubits, not matter) is still an interesting subject. I think we know more about it than you seem to think, but you are right in the sense that it is still a juvenile subject (only about eighty years old, if I remember correctly). Einstein didn't believe it, so it's a system so complex that one of the greatest scientific minds possibly ever couldn't even get his head around it.



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21 Oct 2018, 1:00 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, then all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.
Existing relative to what precisely? I don't think anybody has ever contended that reality is not just a function of our own consciousness. We are limited by what we perceive (which is likely why mathematics exists in the first place; to deal with abstract concepts).

We can't see the electromagnetic spectrum besides light. We can only witness three dimensions. We can't see the connecting string or thread in quantum entanglement. There's a lot we don't know but from our reality, in other words from our perception, mathematics seems to work just fine. We could debate what the world looks like from another perspective but that would be impossible because we can't yet be anybody but us.



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21 Oct 2018, 2:07 pm

LoveNotHate wrote:
JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, then all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.


WOW!

I am gonna tell that to my landlord!

That back rent you keep bugging me about...well...its all in your mind because math and numbers are just an illusion!

I am sure that he'll go for it. :lol:



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21 Oct 2018, 2:18 pm

naturalplastic wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, then all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.


WOW!

I am gonna tell that to my landlord!

That back rent you keep bugging me about...well...its all in your mind because math and numbers are just an illusion!

I am sure that he'll go for it. :lol:

I didn't want to bias this discussion, but yes, I am anti-realist, my opinion is that math is a mental construct that only exists in abstract thought.

$1 + $1 = $1 bill and $1 bill, not 2 dollars.

2 dollars is an abstract mental thought not in reality.

In reality you have two different bills with a $1 mark on them. You don't physically have 2 dollars.

Your landlord knows this, and is talking about rent abstractly.


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21 Oct 2018, 2:34 pm

Mythos wrote:
LoveNotHate wrote:
JonPhx wrote:
I always dreamed of learning to do proofs of higher level Mathematical concepts. I wonder if knowing how to do these proofs would bring me closer to God. Some people say that mathmatical proofs are simply a formalized deductive rationalization of intuitively obvious truths.

My favorite branch of mathematics is also the branch that I understand at least. When I read books about Topology, I feel like I am exploring God’s creative powers. I feel like God could’ve made the universe in a much different way than he did if he wanted to.

Am I crazy? Am I chasing a red herring? Or, am I on to something meaningful?

The first step is deciding whether math exists in reality or not.

Math realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... al_realism

Math anti-realism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosoph ... ti-realism

If math doesn't exist in reality, then all your math revelations are just thoughts in your mind.
Existing relative to what precisely? I don't think anybody has ever contended that reality is not just a function of our own consciousness. We are limited by what we perceive (which is likely why mathematics exists in the first place; to deal with abstract concepts).

We can't see the electromagnetic spectrum besides light. We can only witness three dimensions. We can't see the connecting string or thread in quantum entanglement. There's a lot we don't know but from our reality, in other words from our perception, mathematics seems to work just fine. We could debate what the world looks like from another perspective but that would be impossible because we can't yet be anybody but us.

There are some videos on this ...

Is Math a Feature of the Universe or a Feature of Human Creation?


Is math discovered or invented?


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