Explaining the dangerous government overreach to aspie kids

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Aspie1
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11 Apr 2021, 9:41 am

SabbraCadabra wrote:
Unfortunately, people who protest masks and social distancing, who continue to spread the virus, are the reason the government has to step in and make mandates and enforce lockdowns.

The virus isn't going to stop spreading until people stop spreading it.
Oh boy! That disgusting, conniving Gretchen Whitmer has you wrapped around her finger. She stops you from having parties with healthy, low-risk people, but supports looters who were trashing Detroit last summer without masks or social distancing.

SabbraCadabra wrote:
These people are inhibiting your freedom.
No! It's the government overreach. Those people are merely being human: spending time together, breaking bread and sharing ideas. It doesn't get more human than that, and yet the government takes it away from us. That's why I want to teach my hypothetical kids about it. If anything, those people gave me back my freedom. Even if they're far from perfect, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

SabbraCadabra wrote:
I can see that you're really struggling with these issues. Have you considered talking with a therapist?
I saw multiple the-rapists when I was a teen. One always mocked me, trolled me, sided with the people who emotionally abused me, and pretended not to know what I was talking about if I brought up something she didn't like. Another antagonized me while testing me for ADD, in order to create a bad result (and get money for it, I presume). Because of them, I started on a lifelong alcohol habit at age 12. It's a filthy, rotten profession that never should have been allowed to exist.


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11 Apr 2021, 9:51 am

Redd_Kross wrote:
Aspie1 wrote:
Even if my kids are too young to vote, I'd want them to know who hates them


You tell your children they are hated?

Sweet suffering Jesus... that's heartbreaking and disturbing. I get the sense that this has little to nothing to do with your children's mental health and a lot more to do with wanting everyone....even young chidren, to pay attention to you.

You may go even lick the bus stop as a political statement and enjoy your freedom. But do not harm your children like that. Love them more than you love yourself.



hurtloam
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11 Apr 2021, 9:59 am

Aspie1 was let down by authority figures as a child. When he needed the adults to protect him, they didn't. It's little wonder he has this view.

My Mum is the same.

I don't agree. I don't think all authority figures are untrustworthy, but I do understand where he's coming from.

I'm not sure that this lack of trust can ever be regained.



funeralxempire
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11 Apr 2021, 1:15 pm

Aspie1 wrote:
I saw multiple the-rapists when I was a teen. One always mocked me, trolled me, sided with the people who emotionally abused me, and pretended not to know what I was talking about if I brought up something she didn't like. Another antagonized me while testing me for ADD, in order to create a bad result (and get money for it, I presume). Because of them, I started on a lifelong alcohol habit at age 12. It's a filthy, rotten profession that never should have been allowed to exist.


I'm sorry that you had such terrible formative experiences; I'm not sure they justify throwing the baby out with the bath water though.


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DW_a_mom
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11 Apr 2021, 4:52 pm

Well, all, as much as I can enjoy a full blown debate, there are good reasons I don’t normally wander beyond the parenting board. I simply do not have time for a full blown debate. My responses to Aspie1 were with the intention of of expressing disagreement while showing some mutual acceptance, focusing on the parenting stances, and not having to get too far deep into our different perspectives. We are very different people, and beyond what that means to being a parent I don’t see anything to be gained for either of us by trying to talk beyond the parenting angles. We’ve both been on this forum too long to believe either of us can influence the other on lifestyle or politics, but engaging with him has, believe it or not, help me on occasion understand a few things as a parent, which is why he has my acceptance as a unique individual. So here’s hoping I can successfully leave this discussion and not respond as you all take this to the next level.


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Last edited by DW_a_mom on 11 Apr 2021, 7:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Aspie1
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11 Apr 2021, 5:12 pm

hurtloam wrote:
Aspie1 was let down by authority figures as a child. When he needed the adults to protect him, they didn't. It's little wonder he has this view.

My Mum is the same.

I don't agree. I don't think all authority figures are untrustworthy, but I do understand where he's coming from.

I'm not sure that this lack of trust can ever be regained.
Thanks for backing me up. Not only did the authority figures fail to protect me, they banded together against me. My parents, extended family, teachers, doctors, shrinks, everyone! To add insult to the injury, it was all presented in the guise of being "for my own good", which I knew was a lie. This explains why I always hit a brick wall when trying to get help: they were all proverbially in bed with each other. For instance, when I told my therapist about my family emotionally abusing me for bad grades, hoping she'd teach me verbal self-defense tactics, she just mocked me. :evil: Or when I told a pediatrician that I had "childhood-onset Alzheimer's Disease, mild form" (I struggled with forgetfulness due to constant severe stress), she told my parents and I got scolded.

So when the lockdowns started, I was determined to fight against them tooth and nail. And unlike with stupid rules my parents made when I was a child, I succeeded smashingly. Because I've been sneaking around since I was 7, it wasn't difficult at all.


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SabbraCadabra
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11 Apr 2021, 9:18 pm

Aspie1 wrote:
Oh boy! That disgusting, conniving Gretchen Whitmer has you wrapped around her finger.

Actually, I wish she would've done more, and I wish she would've done it sooner. When the outbreak hit, we couldn't go shopping for weeks, because at least 90% of shoppers were anti-mask (I counted them). People where I live can't even follow simple road safety laws; no one can just say "please" and expect them to wear a piece of cloth over their mouth and nose. It's bad here, and the numbers reflect it.

I wish I would've taken the mask thing more seriously back in Jan/Feb, but I ignorantly believed that we still had a pandemic task force that would prevent these kinds of things from crossing the borders. Maybe if I had been more careful, I wouldn't have caught COVID in early March, and maybe I wouldn't still be suffering from Long Haul symptoms today. I'm so sick, I can't even go back to work, even if they did decide to start enforcing COVID safety guidelines.

Aspie1 wrote:
She stops you from having parties with healthy, low-risk people ...

Please explain to me who these "healthy, low-risk people" are, and how they are magically immune from contracting the disease and/or spreading the virus.

Are they the same "healthy, low-risk people" who are members of the Long Hauler support groups I'm in? The ones who feel like they're 70 years old instead of 20? The ones who wish they could go hiking, climbing, swimming, lifting, and rowing again? The ones who used to run marathons, and now can't even jog briskly for 5 minutes? The ones who had to quit their sports teams and their jobs? Is that who you mean?

Aspie1 wrote:
She ... supports looters who were trashing Detroit last summer without masks or social distancing.

I'm sorry, but what?
There was no "looting" or "trashing" in Detroit. There were a few peaceful protests, and a good majority of them wore masks.
Are you sure it was Detroit?
Are you sure you're not thinking of Grand Rapids? Where some white supremacists from out of town (actually, IIRC, from Indiana) came to break up the peaceful protests and started a riot?

Aspie1 wrote:
Those people are merely being human: spending time together, breaking bread and sharing ideas.

The human race has always focused on survival. Intentionally spreading a dangerous and sometimes deadly virus is only benefiting the survival of the virus, not the human race.

We have the technology to allow people to socialize without exposing themselves and others to pathogens.

We're all in the same boat, here. When the captain asks you to "stop rocking the boat", he's not trying to oppress you; he's trying to keep his ship from capsizing.

Aspie1 wrote:
I saw multiple the-rapists when I was a teen. One always mocked me, trolled me, sided with the people who emotionally abused me, and pretended not to know what I was talking about if I brought up something she didn't like.

I'm sorry this happened to you, but there's no reason to take it out on the entire country. I'm sure there's someone who will listen to you and take you seriously.


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12 Apr 2021, 1:22 am

SabbraCadabra wrote:
I wish I would've taken the mask thing more seriously back in Jan/Feb, but I ignorantly believed that we still had a pandemic task force that would prevent these kinds of things from crossing the borders. Maybe if I had been more careful, I wouldn't have caught COVID in early March, and maybe I wouldn't still be suffering from Long Haul symptoms today. I'm so sick, I can't even go back to work, even if they did decide to start enforcing COVID-19 safety guidelines.


I am so sorry to hear you are part of the unfortunate long-haulers group. One thing I do not think you should do is beat up yourself over any of your choices in those early months. NONE of us understood this virus, and masks were in short supply. In fact, we told not to wear them because medical workers needed them. I do think our government failed us back then by not doing enough to handle the supply problems and to get the science out to the public as it was evolving. This pandemic, and government responses, will be studied for generations with, hopefully, lessons learned applied effectively to the next pandemic (if people then are lucky enough to have leaders willing to apply the lessons, of course).

I hope that answers for the long haulers will come sooner rather than later so you can feel healthy again. This pandemic is an awful and unpredictable disease. There truly is no way to know how it will hit any one person. Some people win the health lottery, some people lose, and it is quite rude when winners rub their good luck in the faces of those less fortunate. I wish the winners understood it is purely good luck that has allowed them to hold the beliefs they hold, but they don't.

I am firmly in the "stay distant, wear your mask" camp, and feel it was an absolute failure of leadership to allow both to become political issues. But we are where we are and I can only ask that people exercise their personal choices as far away from me as possible and, also, that they respect I have given appropriate weight, though and analysis to all my positions. Our family has been extra cautious, and we have enough financial and social privilege to have been able to do so. I am so grateful for all the delivery workers and private shoppers who have allowed my family to cocoon so effectively, but I have guilt, too, because I know that it does come from privilege, and those workers are stuck unable to avoid the risk the anti-mask crowd spreads. What I have the most trouble with are people who can't follow the rules when around others who may not share those beliefs in locations where they are expected to do so. For me, Aspie1 is free to hang out with like minded folks as long as they don't try to go mask-less into a store, restaurant, church or other location that is choosing to require a mask. Plus, well, I have empathy for the frustration he's had in life and if he finds a little joy in defiance I won't take it away (that he is less generous towards my choices is unfortunate but not something I can control). I can deal with a split world so long as we all know that if a location requires masking and distancing, everyone will mask and distance. I'll stay out of Florida, for example, if those folks will stay out of my town. It's about respect. If people with different beliefs and priorities are gathering in places I can avoid, I am not directly affected by their choices and, thus, it is easier to stay on a "live and let live" page. I'm past selling to anti-mask crowd. Once this all became political there was no putting the genie back in the bottle, we can only ask that the two approaches figure out how to coexist in one nation. We can if we want, but I admit that is a lot easier for someone like me who has been riding out the pandemic safely in private, than someone like you, who has not had the same good luck.

I am so ready for the death and disease to end, but there is still a long road ahead. Once I'm vaccinated I can take some baby steps. I need to make a trip out of state to help settle the estate of a relative who died months ago from COVID-19; I don't think it has ever fully hit me that she's gone. I suspect a lot of my suppressed anger will come out at the time, too; her death could have been avoided but explaining would take pages. Hard to believe there is still anyone who hasn't been touched by the long reach of loss, but its seems there are plenty.

Anyway, sorry for all musings. I wanted you to know that I care, even if I'm past debating pandemic approach with anyone. I don't know if my words help or hurt, but do know I care.


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SabbraCadabra
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12 Apr 2021, 3:10 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
One thing I do not think you should do is beat up yourself over any of your choices in those early months.

Oh, I don't beat myself up over it, it's just one of those "would'a could'a should'a" things. It's actually thanks to this very forum that I even knew so early about the pandemic over in China, and I had considered investing in masks (this was well before there were shortages), but I didn't want people to think I was paranoid, and like I said, I figured the virus wouldn't come here.

Typical of me to worry about what other people think :roll:

DW_a_mom wrote:
I'll stay out of Florida, for example, if those folks will stay out of my town.

Yeah, it might be too late for that one. Huge crowds gathered there for spring break, mostly people from out-of-state.

DW_a_mom wrote:
I'm past selling to anti-mask crowd. Once this all became political there was no putting the genie back in the bottle, we can only ask that the two approaches figure out how to coexist in one nation.

I know what you mean. Even without the politics, a good portion of these people are 100% set in their ways, no matter what kind of evidence, logic, or reasoning you throw at them. I usually just toss them a couple informational links (which they won't read) and leave them be...the stress just triggers my symptoms, I can't do it anymore.

It also doesn't help that social media was flooded with bots who were spreading lies and misinformation...almost as if some outside influence were trying to tear our country apart from the inside out... :? A lot of them have been deleted since, but the damage has already been done.

DW_a_mom wrote:
... I admit that is a lot easier for someone like me who has been riding out the pandemic safely in private, than someone like you, who has not had the same good luck.

I actually just happened to have a lot of money saved up, so I've been pretty good, apart from the illness. It won't last forever though, so I'm trying to stop procrastinating and sign up for disability.

They did call me back to work in June, and I came back for two days. I was told that everyone was taking the pandemic seriously, but when I got there, it was exactly how I expected it would be. They put me back "on leave", but a few months later, I got letters in the mail letting me know that my heath insurance had been cancelled.

DW_a_mom wrote:
... her death could have been avoided but explaining would take pages.

A lot of deaths could have been avoided =( I don't think I know anyone who's died from it (I haven't asked about my uncle's cause of death), but I hear plenty of stories from other people I know.

Thank you.


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Aspie1
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12 Apr 2021, 4:22 am

SabbraCadabra wrote:
We're all in the same boat, here. When the captain asks you to "stop rocking the boat", he's not trying to oppress you; he's trying to keep his ship from capsizing.
We are NOT in the same boat!! ! We're in the same storm. Whitmer, Cuomo, Newsom, and other Democrats---they have an aircraft carrier. Your average private citizen has a kayak. They won't lose any freedoms in the lockdowns, because those who make the rules can break them as they see fit. Just read "1984".

These politicians have all been going to their secret, private parties since day one. And I'm not talking about the depravity Q insinuates, just lively games, dancing, and what-have-you. They're stopping private citizens from doing the same, and support unmasked, crowded looting. If that's not hypocrisy, then I'm voting for Biden in 2024.

My only regret is stupidly following the rules for as long as I did, rather than joining the group sooner. I just damaged my mental health, and wasted money by drinking too much alcohol even for me. But finding rebellious groups often takes time, and it took me a while to learn that lockdowns with no end in sight were about undermining Trump, not to do with public health.

DW_a_mom wrote:
For me, Aspie1 is free to hang out with like minded folks as long as they don't try to go mask-less into a store, restaurant, church or other location that is choosing to require a mask. Plus, well, I have empathy for the frustration he's had in life and if he finds a little joy in defiance I won't take it away (that he is less generous towards my choices is unfortunate but not something I can control).
Thanks. :) I do follow private venue rules, because house rights are a big part of conservatism. That, and I don't want the workers to feel uncomfortable helping me. So yes, I do wear a face gag in stores and such. But my obedience ends there.



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12 Apr 2021, 5:46 am

Aspie1 wrote:
hurtloam wrote:
Aspie1 was let down by authority figures as a child. When he needed the adults to protect him, they didn't. It's little wonder he has this view.

My Mum is the same.

I don't agree. I don't think all authority figures are untrustworthy, but I do understand where he's coming from.

I'm not sure that this lack of trust can ever be regained.
Thanks for backing me up. Not only did the authority figures fail to protect me, they banded together against me. My parents, extended family, teachers, doctors, shrinks, everyone! To add insult to the injury, it was all presented in the guise of being "for my own good", which I knew was a lie. This explains why I always hit a brick wall when trying to get help: they were all proverbially in bed with each other. For instance, when I told my therapist about my family emotionally abusing me for bad grades, hoping she'd teach me verbal self-defense tactics, she just mocked me. :evil: Or when I told a pediatrician that I had "childhood-onset Alzheimer's Disease, mild form" (I struggled with forgetfulness due to constant severe stress), she told my parents and I got scolded.

So when the lockdowns started, I was determined to fight against them tooth and nail. And unlike with stupid rules my parents made when I was a child, I succeeded smashingly. Because I've been sneaking around since I was 7, it wasn't difficult at all.


Well, I wouldn't say I was backing you up. More that I've seen the exact same thing happen with my Mum. She didn't have a supportive upbringing or a supportive marriage either.

I wish we could help you regain some trust, but I know that what you're doing is building your own worldview so that you can feel safe and in control of your life.

Edited for grammar



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12 Apr 2021, 12:57 pm

The government is like a living thing. It wants to live, consume, grow, and conquer. It will do whatever it feels it can do. A generation ago when civics were taught is school, this would have been no problem to explain. Unfortunatly most of society has been dumbed down and groomed to do whatever the government tells them without question. So long as their political tribe is in power.



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19 Apr 2021, 11:09 am

A leading conspiracy theorist who thought COVID-19 was a hoax died from the virus after hosting illegal house parties

Quote:
A Norwegian COVID-19 denier, who threw illegal gatherings, has died from the virus, officials said.

Hans Kristian Gaarder, 60, died days after holding two illegal parties on his property.

Several guests have since tested positive for the virus and also gave it to close contacts.

A Norwegian conspiracy theorist, who believed COVID-19 was a hoax, has died from the virus just days after hosting two illegal gatherings at his property, according to officials.

Hans Kristian Gaarder, 60, from Gran, a municipality that lies 40 miles north of Oslo, tested positive for the virus after dying on April 6, officials said this week.

"A man in his 60s, living in Gran, has died after being ill with coronavirus. The person was not tested for coronavirus before he died, but it is confirmed afterward that he was infected with the virus," the municipality of Gran said in a statement on their website, according to Metro.


https://news.yahoo.com/leading-conspira ... 00477.html

The moral of the story: pretending something dangerous doesn't exist won't protect you.


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19 Apr 2021, 10:07 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
A leading conspiracy theorist who thought COVID-19 was a hoax died from the virus after hosting illegal house parties
...
https://news.yahoo.com/leading-conspira ... 00477.html

The moral of the story: pretending something dangerous doesn't exist won't protect you.

Obviously, a death is tragic, and I sympathize for his family. But look at this from a different angle. That man died doing what he loved: socializing with like-minded friends in a fun, lively environment, like I did at my Q parties. At least, that was the last thing he did before he died: that's not a bad way to go. Not only that, he died FIGHTING against the liberal anti-freedom government, like a serviceman fighting a domestic enemy (which was his own government), not standing on all fours in front of it with his pants down, like a weak prison inmate. That's a much better way to die, than a suicide to escape the government-imposed social isolation, or a liver failure from constant drinking to numb the pain caused by the loneliness. Just as many people in America died from those things as from the Election Infection. But the liberal media will never allow that to be published, because it undermines their agenda.

Oh, and Yahoo? :thumbdown: Only CNN is more leftist than them! If you believe Yahoo, I have a bridge to sell you.



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19 Apr 2021, 10:20 pm

CNN is centrist/establishment drivel. If that's what you consider left you've never spoken to actual leftist and probably define socialism as everything you disagree with.

His death was a shame, but what's worse is that he also likely infected people who weren't denying reality and were taking precautions.


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19 Apr 2021, 10:25 pm

funeralxempire wrote:
His death was a shame, but what's worse is that he also likely infected people who weren't denying reality and were taking precautions.
If they were "taking precautions" (read: being socialist sheep), they wouldn't have hung out with him, knowing (or suspecting) where he's been. But they needed a scapegoat. Thanks for reading, and good night!

I swear to god (and I'm an atheist), the more I read leftist posts on this site, the more glad I am to have joined QAnon.



Last edited by Aspie1 on 19 Apr 2021, 10:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.