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Misslizard
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30 Jul 2021, 12:13 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
My ex and I fought about politics.


I'm sorry to hear that. Can I ask what types of topics were relevant?

Abortion, immigration,LGBTQ issues,race relations etc.,The only topic we agreed upon was the environment.He was into crazy conspiracy theories like black helicopters and one world order.
He was a conservative and I’m a liberal.
He was also a narcissistic misogynistic control freak.That was the worst part.


I'm sorry to hear you were with a narcissist and control freak. Been there, done that.

It's just weird to me that people would spend that much time discussing other people's business (politics). Even if one of you was an elected official, your job would be to represent constituents' values and not necessarily your own. Plus you aren't supposed to bring your work home with you from the office, so to speak. Unless one of you was LGBTQ, requiring an abortion, arranging immigration for the other, or from a different racial background, I don't know why any of it would be relevant. Those might be topics for deep philosophical discourse one day if you're stoned, but on a daily basis in a marriage? I'm really sorry to hear that.

He made his obnoxious opinions very vocal.He wasn’t like that when we first met, it seemed to get worse as he aged.
He would tell jokes that were racist and misogynistic even when he knew I didn’t want to hear them.
I can give you a good example, once we were getting take out and the man taking our order was from the Middle East and my ex belts out, “ Step on it Mohammed, you got a big order.” Then he laughed.
So I would get on his case about remarks like that.

I’ve read the Bell Jar, I can relate to depression that bad.Been there.


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IsabellaLinton
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30 Jul 2021, 12:19 am

Misslizard wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
My ex and I fought about politics.


I'm sorry to hear that. Can I ask what types of topics were relevant?

Abortion, immigration,LGBTQ issues,race relations etc.,The only topic we agreed upon was the environment.He was into crazy conspiracy theories like black helicopters and one world order.
He was a conservative and I’m a liberal.
He was also a narcissistic misogynistic control freak.That was the worst part.


I'm sorry to hear you were with a narcissist and control freak. Been there, done that.

It's just weird to me that people would spend that much time discussing other people's business (politics). Even if one of you was an elected official, your job would be to represent constituents' values and not necessarily your own. Plus you aren't supposed to bring your work home with you from the office, so to speak. Unless one of you was LGBTQ, requiring an abortion, arranging immigration for the other, or from a different racial background, I don't know why any of it would be relevant. Those might be topics for deep philosophical discourse one day if you're stoned, but on a daily basis in a marriage? I'm really sorry to hear that.

He made his obnoxious opinions very vocal.He wasn’t like that when we first met, it seemed to get worse as he aged.
He would tell jokes that were racist and misogynistic even when he knew I didn’t want to hear them.
I can give you a good example, once we were getting take out and the man taking our order was from the Middle East and my ex belts out, “ Step on it Mohammed, you got a big order.” Then he laughed.
So I would get on his case about remarks like that.

I’ve read the Bell Jar, I can relate to depression that bad.Been there.


To what extent do you think his assholery was political, as opposed to a mental illness / personality disorder?

I'm not debating what you've said. That's intolerable and I wouldn't put up with it either, regardless of how the behaviour is classified. I'm just wondering if racism is maybe part of paranoia, or psychopathy? I'm not excusing it. I'm just wondering what the Venn diagram would look like, comparing personality disorders and political extremism?


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Sweetleaf
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30 Jul 2021, 12:30 am

ironpony wrote:
Oh okay. I'm just going by people I know who describe their women as very left wing.


There are misandrist left wing women, I think one of my boyfriends old roomates was one. But uhh I don't want to delve into that whole story..I am in a fairly good mood right now and I don't need that piece of work person, taking up space in my head, after all they aren't paying rent for it.

But yeah I am not into that kind of left wing, besides I am not even welcome in it because I am not a 'super career women who doesn't need anyone in their life to be with. I am just a woman on disability who does more housework than working a job with my boyfriend working more. I guess for me to be a real women to them I have to have my own career and except nothing less than my boyfriend doing most of the housework even if he works longer hours than me. And it's like sheesh hold up...for one maybe I like cleaning our apartment, like for me it is actually sort of fun to put on some music and go to town cleaning up the place. Also what the hell isn't feminism about woman doing and being what they want? I for sure don't think women should be expected to have to be the one that cleans more for instance, but like if a woman wants to do more of the cleaning what the hell is wrong with that? The problem would be just assuming because someone is a woman they'd rather be at home cleaning than doing a job, but it is also a problem to like act like you lose 'real woman' points if you're a woman and don't mind being home more often and doing that stuff.

And I thought feminism had more of a goal of like just getting rid of the archaic, gender rules altogether, but seems at least some branches of it just want it totally reversed. When the thing is gender based heirarchy is bad in general, like having a society where men are the second class citizens rather than women would not actually solve the problem of gender inequalty which is what feminism was intended to challenge. But some feminist groups have run wild with it and forgot that point and just want to create a reverse of the past where women are the top dogs and men are second class citizens. For sure seems like more of a revenge thing than a well thought out way to end unfair gender discrimination in society. And well those are the sort of leftists I do not agree with.

I mean those sort of feminists and leftists, even end up leaving a crap load of women and non-binary people out, and in my opinion can be just about as bad as the incel community.


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Misslizard
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30 Jul 2021, 12:33 am

IsabellaLinton wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
IsabellaLinton wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
My ex and I fought about politics.


I'm sorry to hear that. Can I ask what types of topics were relevant?

Abortion, immigration,LGBTQ issues,race relations etc.,The only topic we agreed upon was the environment.He was into crazy conspiracy theories like black helicopters and one world order.
He was a conservative and I’m a liberal.
He was also a narcissistic misogynistic control freak.That was the worst part.


I'm sorry to hear you were with a narcissist and control freak. Been there, done that.

It's just weird to me that people would spend that much time discussing other people's business (politics). Even if one of you was an elected official, your job would be to represent constituents' values and not necessarily your own. Plus you aren't supposed to bring your work home with you from the office, so to speak. Unless one of you was LGBTQ, requiring an abortion, arranging immigration for the other, or from a different racial background, I don't know why any of it would be relevant. Those might be topics for deep philosophical discourse one day if you're stoned, but on a daily basis in a marriage? I'm really sorry to hear that.

He made his obnoxious opinions very vocal.He wasn’t like that when we first met, it seemed to get worse as he aged.
He would tell jokes that were racist and misogynistic even when he knew I didn’t want to hear them.
I can give you a good example, once we were getting take out and the man taking our order was from the Middle East and my ex belts out, “ Step on it Mohammed, you got a big order.” Then he laughed.
So I would get on his case about remarks like that.

I’ve read the Bell Jar, I can relate to depression that bad.Been there.


To what extent do you think his assholery was political, as opposed to a mental illness / personality disorder?

I'm not debating what you've said. That's intolerable and I wouldn't put up with it either, regardless of how the behaviour is classified. I'm just wondering if racism is maybe part of paranoia, or psychopathy? I'm not excusing it. I'm just wondering what the Venn diagram would look like, comparing personality disorders and political extremism?

He was diagnosed with a personality disorder, antisocial.He genuinely got a kick out of upsetting people.No paranoia or psychosis, just a genuine as*hole.
When we went to visit some of my family I asked him to please keep his racist comments to himself,He didn’t.Then they got upset and rightly so.It ruined the visit.Once he said our daughters boyfriend at the time was ,”A big corn fed Jew.” WTF does that even mean?
She now has as little to do with him as possible.The obligatory holiday phone call is about it.I don’t think that relationship will ever be repaired and I don’t blame her.


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IsabellaLinton
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30 Jul 2021, 12:37 am

Sweetleaf wrote:
ironpony wrote:
Oh okay. I'm just going by people I know who describe their women as very left wing.


There are misandrist left wing women, I think one of my boyfriends old roomates was one. But uhh I don't want to delve into that whole story..I am in a fairly good mood right now and I don't need that piece of work person, taking up space in my head, after all they aren't paying rent for it.

But yeah I am not into that kind of left wing, besides I am not even welcome in it because I am not a 'super career women who doesn't need anyone in their life to be with. I am just a woman on disability who does more housework than working a job with my boyfriend working more. I guess for me to be a real women to them I have to have my own career and except nothing less than my boyfriend doing most of the housework even if he works longer hours than me. And it's like sheesh hold up...for one maybe I like cleaning our apartment, like for me it is actually sort of fun to put on some music and go to town cleaning up the place. Also what the hell isn't feminism about woman doing and being what they want? I for sure don't think women should be expected to have to be the one that cleans more for instance, but like if a woman wants to do more of the cleaning what the hell is wrong with that? The problem would be just assuming because someone is a woman they'd rather be at home cleaning than doing a job, but it is also a problem to like act like you lose 'real woman' points if you're a woman and don't mind being home more often and doing that stuff.

And I thought feminism had more of a goal of like just getting rid of the archaic, gender rules altogether, but seems at least some branches of it just want it totally reversed. When the thing is gender based heirarchy is bad in general, like having a society where men are the second class citizens rather than women would not actually solve the problem of gender inequalty which is what feminism was intended to challenge. But some feminist groups have run wild with it and forgot that point and just want to create a reverse of the past where women are the top dogs and men are second class citizens. For sure seems like more of a revenge thing than a well thought out way to end unfair gender discrimination in society. And well those are the sort of leftists I do not agree with.

I mean those sort of feminists and leftists, even end up leaving a crap load of women and non-binary people out, and in my opinion can be just about as bad as the incel community.


Image


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30 Jul 2021, 1:21 am

Mikah wrote:
XFilesGeek wrote:
Women "freezing" during sexual harassment and/or assault is a common occurrence.

The lack of a hard "no" is absolutely NOT a "yes."


Unfortunately, while sympathies must be had for the victim, this may not count as rape either - depending on the situation and lead up. Mens rea - the perpetrator has to understand he is committing rape or at least doing something wrong to be guilty of it - something very much lost in this argument sometimes. I've heard some justice systems are adjusting the concept of mens rea for rape - which I am pretty suspicious of, but the general principle stands.


In that case, anyone can claim they didn't know what they were doing was wrong when they did it.

I've frozen in certain situations with men. That doesn't mean I consented to sex, or that the men in question were blameless.


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30 Jul 2021, 2:18 am

Misslizard wrote:
He was diagnosed with a personality disorder, antisocial.He genuinely got a kick out of upsetting people.No paranoia or psychosis, just a genuine as*hole.


Sorry you lived through that Misslizard. In some ways were you relieved he got his diagnosis, at least it explains his compulsions.

I'm more worried about ultra-normal people who suddenly turn out to be totally evil or sick.



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30 Jul 2021, 2:57 am

ironpony wrote:
From people I know. They have really left wing politics and it seems that on that side of the spectrum the women seem to hate men, or not think much of them, and the men do the women want to please them too much. But only going by more left wing people I know personally.


Have you considered that these women became left wing because of how men treated them and they wanted to campaign against injustice?

I used to be quite conservative, but the way I've been treated by men and women has made me more concerned for marginalised people like myself. I used to have ideals and see the good in people, but life beat that out of me.

Whereas I know conservative women who hate men too because of the way they've been treated.



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30 Jul 2021, 5:52 am

I’ve known hard-conservative lesbians who can’t stand men.

I’ve known left-wing hetero women who dig men extremely, and are very nice to them.

I knew a devoted pedophile on my job many years ago who certainly did not espouse liberal causes. So dedicated that he passed around NAMBLA pamphlets. NAMBLA means “North American Man-Boy Love Association.”



Last edited by kraftiekortie on 30 Jul 2021, 7:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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30 Jul 2021, 6:32 am

ironpony wrote:
So as far as the notion goes that ring wing men are said because women are too conservative for them, could the argument be made on the opposite political end of the spectrum that left wing men are sad, because they go for left wing misandrist women, and bend over for them?


There are no binaries, here. 8)



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30 Jul 2021, 8:22 am

Bradleigh wrote:
Could you point me to the covering up of facilitating abuse?


Is google broken where you are? Look up "Helmet Kentler", his "experiments" and the involvement of local authorities.

Bradleigh wrote:
Also, curious, why is it only the German Greens party? If this is indicative of an inherent element of the Left, shouldn't there be other examples from Green/progressive parties that were similar in platforms?


The German Greens are just the latest and most sordid of scandals. There have been other scandals in other countries, one in the UK I've already mentioned. I've already said it is not an inherent element of the Left. They are, however, always on the periphery, if not directly involved with sexual rights organisations - which like it or not is something inherent to the Left. The link between the Left and pedophilia is a tenuous link - which is why I included it in my alternate version of the video.

XFilesGeek wrote:
In that case, anyone can claim they didn't know what they were doing was wrong when they did it.

I've frozen in certain situations with men. That doesn't mean I consented to sex, or that the men in question were blameless.


And then it's up to the courts to decide whether a reasonable person might have believed consent was given. This is why they (used to?) ask all those hated questions about dress, location and actions in the lead up. It's not blaming the victim for rape - it's to determine the mental state and intention of the accused - to determine whether a rape or an assault actually occurred, which cannot rightly depend solely on the thought process of the victim.


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30 Jul 2021, 9:35 am

cyberdad wrote:
Misslizard wrote:
He was diagnosed with a personality disorder, antisocial.He genuinely got a kick out of upsetting people.No paranoia or psychosis, just a genuine as*hole.


Sorry you lived through that Misslizard. In some ways were you relieved he got his diagnosis, at least it explains his compulsions.

I'm more worried about ultra-normal people who suddenly turn out to be totally evil or sick.

Thank you.I found out his diagnosis by being a snoop.He was trying to get a disability check so had all these medical records coming to the house.I looked at them.
He was diagnosed with that before I met him .It did explain a lot.The divorce followed soon after.
I feel for anyone trapped inside toxic relationship.My biggest regret is I didn’t divorce him sooner.


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30 Jul 2021, 9:38 am

Mikah wrote:
Is google broken where you are? Look up "Helmet Kentler", his "experiments" and the involvement of local authorities.


I would appreciate being pointed in a direction, rather than a vague posturing of if I apparently keep reading pages I will eventually find one that says that the Left wing politicians covered up something. He just looks like one bad dude, who was probably being supported by a bunch of pedophiles that try to sneak their goals in by pretending to be a valid sexual minority.


Mikah wrote:
The German Greens are just the latest and most sordid of scandals. There have been other scandals in other countries, one in the UK I've already mentioned. I've already said it is not an inherent element of the Left. They are, however, always on the periphery, if not directly involved with sexual rights organisations - which like it or not is something inherent to the Left. The link between the Left and pedophilia is a tenuous link - which is why I included it in my alternate version of the video.


Latest? This again all happened in the 80s, and apparently only in Germany. And the UK example is just one person. Kind of sounds as valuable as using Roy Moore and Milo Yiannopoulos as evidence. This whole argument kind of sounds like part of a conspiracy theory that pedophilia is really going to be accepted in as part of Pride, which just goes back to old homophobic beliefs of gay men being on the prowl to attack little boys.

Going back to what you were trying to make it an alternative to, it is much more logical that the kind of guys that make "edgy jokes" and have a dislike of outside groups such as those of other races are likely to be more conservative, along with other attitudes that don't make them too popular to people who don't share those attitudes. To be honest, I wasn't even sure what you were referring to as comments of "personal inadequacy" and it having a tenuous link to "racial/ethnic awareness". It kind of sounds a bit unspecific to comments that you didn't agree with, especially when I was actually asking you for examples.

It would be appreciated if you could highlight a specific example from the video, which could be used as a specific comparison to your example of saying that the Left want to add pedophilia to LGBT via your examples from 40 years ago. It would be cool if you could contest those parts, just like you have expected me to look into a weird fringe phenomena from 1980s Germany.


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30 Jul 2021, 1:50 pm

Bradleigh wrote:
Mikah wrote:
Look up "Helmet Kentler", his "experiments" and the involvement of local authorities.


I would appreciate being pointed in a direction


What does being pointed in a direction mean to you? Shall I prepare a reading list of overpriced textbooks to buy? Perhaps I should organise a 15 week lecture course with weekly tutorials, and write a midterm and final exam and give you 15 good boy stickers if you get over 60%?

Bradleigh wrote:
rather than a vague posturing of if I apparently keep reading pages I will eventually find one that says that the Left wing politicians covered up something.


Bradleigh wrote:
It would be appreciated if you could highlight a specific example from the video, which could be used as a specific comparison to your example of saying that the Left want to add pedophilia to LGBT via your examples from 40 years ago. It would be cool if you could contest those parts, just like you have expected me to look into a weird fringe phenomena from 1980s Germany.


Your education is not my problem Bradleigh and I have already provided a flimsy link between the Left and paedophilia which is all I needed to defend my "alternate video" pages ago in this thread. I really can't be bothered to go deep diving, just to have a fruitless conversation with you where everything, probably even the year 2003, will be dismissed as "not recent enough".

This entire pointless tangent only occurred because you either didn't understand what I was doing when I wrote that "alternate video" or you personally took offence to it - even when I explicitly stated what I was doing (weaving strands of truth with obnoxious armchair psychology designed to provoke). You seek to dismantle it for your own peace of mind - feel free to do so, but on your own time, not mine.


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30 Jul 2021, 3:47 pm

Bradleigh wrote:
Mikah wrote:
Look up "Helmet Kentler", his "experiments" and the involvement of local authorities.


I would appreciate being pointed in a direction


Bradleigh, Mikah has already provided a couple of articles discussing links between paedophilia (or paedophilia advoacy) and leftist political movements, particularly with relation to Germany. Since I have a bit of time on my hands, I will provide you with some more from other parts of the world, if only so I can watch you wave away the evidence.

Here is some info on a pro-paedophile activist group from the UK from the late 70s and early 80s.

Quote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paedophil ... n_Exchange

The Paedophile Information Exchange (PIE) was a British pro-paedophile activist group, founded in October 1974 and officially disbanded in 1984.[2] The group campaigned for the abolition of the age of consent …

PIE was set up as a special interest group within the Scottish Minorities Group (an LGBT right organization) by founding member Michael Hanson, a gay student living in Edinburgh …

The Paedophile Action for Liberation had developed as a breakaway group from South London Gay Liberation Front.


Note how they developed out of an LGBT rights organization? That’s not to say most LGBT-right activists would support these people, but it’s easy to see why these people would want to attach themselves to the LGBT rights movement.

The following article from the socialist Morning Star website from circa 2019 claims that such groups still exist internationally and are still trying to attach themselves to LGBT-rights organizations: https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article ... aedophilia

Next, here is a short article about some of the leftist heroes of the 1968 revolt in France and their support for paedophilia

Quote:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2001/feb/24/jonhenley

Calls for legal child sex rebound on luminaries of May 68
Some causes championed in the Paris revolt are now seen as very troubling

Jon Henley in Paris
Sat 24 Feb 2001 02.27 GMT

Jean-Paul Sartre, Simone de Beauvoir and the current French health and education ministers Bernard Kouchner and Jack Lang were among the signatories of petitions in the 1970s calling for paedophilia to be decriminalised, it emerged yesterday.

A number of extraordinary documents have surfaced - in the wake of accusations of possible child sex abuse against the former student revolutionary Danny Cohn-Bendit that are forcing France's intellectuals to confront the values of the May 1968 revolution and its aftermath, a period that witnessed probably the biggest change in sexual behaviour in recorded history.


Next, here is a YouTube video of a lecture given by the ecophilosopher Derrick Jensen in which he discusses the historical links between anarchism, “queer theory” and paedophilia.



Some facts Jensen quotes:
• Michel Foucault, the so-called godfather of “queer theory”, argued for the eradication of age-of-conset laws down to infants.
• Gayle Rubin, the “author of the founding document of queer theory” compared paedophilia to a preference for spicy food.
• Bisexual trans essayist and third wave feminist Pat Califia once said that any child old enough to decide if they want to eat spinach or play with trucks is old enough to decide whether they want to engage in sexual activity.

Jensen also briefly mentions Peter Lamborn Wilson (aka Hakim Bey), a leading American anarchist (known for his concept of temporary autonomous zones) who, according to the leftist website libcom.org (here) and even Wikipedia, has frequently used anarchist arguments to promote paedophilia.

Next, the following website lists 66 members of the UK Labour Party who have been convicted of child sex offences in recent years: https://labour25.com/labour25/

I have also heard it suggested that a disproportionate number of modern-day antifa have been convicted of child sex offences, one being the leader of Antifa Ireland no less (Pat Corcoran), although it is difficult to find much information on antifa, what with antifa’s secrecy and the lack of media interest in investigating them.



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30 Jul 2021, 3:56 pm

^As if the right is pedophile free... :roll:


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