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Alex jones - hero, anti-hero or villain?

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Fnord
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06 Aug 2022, 10:03 pm

MuddRM wrote:
HighLlama wrote:
Trump might go to church, but he's not a Christian.
You could say that about 99.99% of the people who even attend church.
By whose standards: Yours, theirs, or Christ’s?

But we are discussing Alex Jones here, so . . .

“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Therefore by their fruits you will know them.” -- Matthew 7:15-20 (NIV)

:D Jesus may as well have been referring to old A.J. himself!



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06 Aug 2022, 10:16 pm

It looks like Texas caps punitive defamation damages at $750K per person, so while Jones might be on the hook for a decent chunk of change, that massive award might get chopped down a bit.

https://www.reuters.com/business/media- ... 022-08-05/

Quote:
Outside the courthouse, Reynal told reporters the verdict was high but that Texas law caps punitive damages at $750,000 per plaintiff.

Reynal later told Reuters he aimed to minimize compensatory damages throughout the trial knowing there is a cap on punitive damages.

"We always knew that was going to be a backstop, so the strategy worked," Reynal said, referring to the cap.


IANAL, but I'm not entirely sure how it works, I'm also seeing some reference to 2x the amount of compensatory damages plus $750K as the cap, it's a bit confusing, but that's still well under the jury award. I'm also very weirded out by the business with sending opposing attorneys the text messages, that's the kind of thing that could draw an ineffective counsel appeal in a criminal trial, and certainly seems like something worth litigating regardless.


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07 Aug 2022, 12:48 am

As far as the original question is concerned: villain, without a doubt. But as he had denied the very existence of murdered children and called grieving parents "crisis actors," there should never have been any doubt of that from the beginning.


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07 Aug 2022, 1:24 am

Kraichgauer wrote:
As far as the original question is concerned: villain, without a doubt. But as he had denied the very existence of murdered children and called grieving parents "crisis actors," there should never have been any doubt of that from the beginning.


If you recall Trump belittled the parents of a dead soldier
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/31/us/p ... azala.html

They set the bar quite low



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07 Aug 2022, 1:34 am

cyberdad wrote:
Kraichgauer wrote:
As far as the original question is concerned: villain, without a doubt. But as he had denied the very existence of murdered children and called grieving parents "crisis actors," there should never have been any doubt of that from the beginning.


If you recall Trump belittled the parents of a dead soldier
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/31/us/p ... azala.html

They set the bar quite low


Very true. Both Trump and Jones are spawned from the same populist right wing cesspool.


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07 Aug 2022, 7:42 am

cyberdad wrote:
Fnord wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Clearly he is lying but...here's the thing, it doesn't matter because he is being bankrolled by millions of nutters who are also probably (not surprisingly) MAGA/QAnon believers.
Then they are supporting someone for whom the word ‘Slimeball’ is a compliment.


To use a fisherman's metaphor - they fall for the bait, hook, line and sinker. I've been wondering why for many years now?. I have a theory, in among the hundreds of stupid things Jones, Tucker Carlson and Trump say there are things they want to believe....these strongly align with their values....so they cut their nose to spite their face so long as they prop up the villain who pushes their pet values.

I don't need to spell out what these things are...


The reason you get crackpots like Jones is largely because our media cannot be trusted. We're are being assaulted by lies daily from them at the behest of the corporate powers that run our government.

Disinformation is disinformation regardless of the source. CNN, MSNBC, and Fox news is every bit as guilty of it as Alex Jones.


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Fnord
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07 Aug 2022, 11:01 am

There is no valid reason to blame the faceless, formless media when Mr. Jones decided for himself -- of his own volition -- to spread lies, doubt, and suspicion.



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07 Aug 2022, 11:56 am

Fnord wrote:
There is no valid reason to blame the faceless, formless media when Mr. Jones decided for himself -- of his own volition -- to spread lies, doubt, and suspicion.


That just proves you don't understand the nature of our media. You might want to read 'Manufacturing Consent.' It would be an eye opener for you.


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07 Aug 2022, 12:06 pm

Deflection. One person's misbehavior is not justification for another's. The mainstream media can manufacture consent like they manufacture everything else and Alex Jones can be a villain for spreading lies and disinformation. There's room in the world for both truths.



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07 Aug 2022, 1:16 pm

VegetableMan wrote:
The reason you get crackpots like Jones is largely because our media cannot be trusted. We're are being assaulted by lies daily from them at the behest of the corporate powers that run our government.

Disinformation is disinformation regardless of the source. CNN, MSNBC, and Fox news is every bit as guilty of it as Alex Jones.



Yeah, that's the real joke here, Alex Jones is being pilloried for lies that got some families harassed, while the people who lied us into unnecessary wars that killed hundreds of thousands of people and cost trillions of dollars not only faced no formal sanction, but were often rewarded with promotions. Adding to the dark comedy is how many of the former neocons have managed to "rehabilitate" themselves as "resistance" figures, because resistance liberals are truly the dumbest people in American politics, making the MAGAS crowd look like comparative geniuses. Don't even get me started on the various intelligence service figures now serving as commentators on liberal networks, it's like they've brainwashed themselves into forgetting that less than 10 years ago they opposed the security state, let alone that these people are literally trained to lie and manipulate, that was their previous job.


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07 Aug 2022, 1:18 pm

Fnord wrote:
There is no valid reason to blame the faceless, formless media when Mr. Jones decided for himself -- of his own volition -- to spread lies, doubt, and suspicion.


That, and Jones had always taken the opposite standpoint of mainstream media. That being the case, it's not likely said mainstream media is wrong if Jones is, too. For instance, you can't have Jones being a soulless liar for calling a mass school shooting a false flag with non-existent children and crisis actors playing parents, but then say that the media had collaborated with the government to establish a false flag operation.


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07 Aug 2022, 1:20 pm

orrery wrote:
Deflection. One person's misbehavior is not justification for another's. The mainstream media can manufacture consent like they manufacture everything else and Alex Jones can be a villain for spreading lies and disinformation. There's room in the world for both truths.


Explanation, not justification. It's a good question to ask, would Alex Jones be so popular and influential if our mainstream media wasn't so biased and deceptive? Kind of like my previous question about the wisdom of paying so much attention to him and risking steering curious people into his grift, there's a lot of disagreement on how to ethically cover Jones.


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07 Aug 2022, 1:29 pm

Dox47 wrote:
orrery wrote:
Deflection. One person's misbehavior is not justification for another's. The mainstream media can manufacture consent like they manufacture everything else and Alex Jones can be a villain for spreading lies and disinformation. There's room in the world for both truths.


Explanation, not justification. It's a good question to ask, would Alex Jones be so popular and influential if our mainstream media wasn't so biased and deceptive? Kind of like my previous question about the wisdom of paying so much attention to him and risking steering curious people into his grift, there's a lot of disagreement on how to ethically cover Jones.


With dirt. Or perhaps manure. Just get him out of public viewing already. He's a nutjob conspiracy theorist preying on people with mental illnesses to hawk his ridiculous wares to. People susceptible to believing his nonsense get all wound up in fear about the deep state or whatever and then empty their bank accounts buying doomsday prepper rations and boner pills. Just cover him in dirt already. Or perhaps manure.


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07 Aug 2022, 1:31 pm

Dox47 wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
The reason you get crackpots like Jones is largely because our media cannot be trusted. We're are being assaulted by lies daily from them at the behest of the corporate powers that run our government.

Disinformation is disinformation regardless of the source. CNN, MSNBC, and Fox news is every bit as guilty of it as Alex Jones.



Yeah, that's the real joke here, Alex Jones is being pilloried for lies that got some families harassed, while the people who lied us into unnecessary wars that killed hundreds of thousands of people and cost trillions of dollars not only faced no formal sanction, but were often rewarded with promotions. Adding to the dark comedy is how many of the former neocons have managed to "rehabilitate" themselves as "resistance" figures, because resistance liberals are truly the dumbest people in American politics, making the MAGAS crowd look like comparative geniuses. Don't even get me started on the various intelligence service figures now serving as commentators on liberal networks, it's like they've brainwashed themselves into forgetting that less than 10 years ago they opposed the security state, let alone that these people are literally trained to lie and manipulate, that was their previous job.


Walk in the shoes of any of those grieving parents, and you'd see why the Anti-Jones outrage is justified. Just because it was on a smaller scale hardly makes Jones' lies any less significant to those people.


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07 Aug 2022, 1:44 pm

Dox47 wrote:
Yeah, that's the real joke here, Alex Jones is being pilloried for lies that got some families harassed, while the people who lied us into unnecessary wars that killed hundreds of thousands of people and cost trillions of dollars not only faced no formal sanction, but were often rewarded with promotions. Adding to the dark comedy is how many of the former neocons have managed to "rehabilitate" themselves as "resistance" figures, because resistance liberals are truly the dumbest people in American politics, making the MAGAS crowd look like comparative geniuses. Don't even get me started on the various intelligence service figures now serving as commentators on liberal networks, it's like they've brainwashed themselves into forgetting that less than 10 years ago they opposed the security state, let alone that these people are literally trained to lie and manipulate, that was their previous job.



They didn't just get harassed. They were shot at. Wtf.

Also, just because someone else got away with a crime doesn't mean this guy should. Also Wtf.


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07 Aug 2022, 4:07 pm

Dox47 wrote:
VegetableMan wrote:
The reason you get crackpots like Jones is largely because our media cannot be trusted. We're are being assaulted by lies daily from them at the behest of the corporate powers that run our government.

Disinformation is disinformation regardless of the source. CNN, MSNBC, and Fox news is every bit as guilty of it as Alex Jones.



Yeah, that's the real joke here, Alex Jones is being pilloried for lies that got some families harassed, while the people who lied us into unnecessary wars that killed hundreds of thousands of people and cost trillions of dollars not only faced no formal sanction, but were often rewarded with promotions. Adding to the dark comedy is how many of the former neocons have managed to "rehabilitate" themselves as "resistance" figures, because resistance liberals are truly the dumbest people in American politics, making the MAGAS crowd look like comparative geniuses. Don't even get me started on the various intelligence service figures now serving as commentators on liberal networks, it's like they've brainwashed themselves into forgetting that less than 10 years ago they opposed the security state, let alone that these people are literally trained to lie and manipulate, that was their previous job.


Agreed. 100 per cent!


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