The President was a draft dodger.

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I think you are conflating nationalism with patriotism. They aren’t the same thing.

I know what nationalism is.

I know that it frequently manifests itself in negative ways.

But the basic definition of it doesn't preclude esteem for another nation.

However, most of the time, within a nationalistic setting, this "esteem for another nation" is not manifested. This is how the definition of the term "nationalism" has evolved. It has come to connote a situation where one's own nation is perceived as being superior, with others being inferior.

If one mentions "nationalism" nowadays----and probably even in past centuries----one would know that it connotes a situation where one's own nation is paramount to all other nations, with no esteem for other nations whatsoever.

Last edited by kraftiekortie on 19 Aug 2022, 9:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

Patriotism vs. Nationalism

Patriotism: A sense of personal identification with the country.
Nationalism: A sense of personal identification with the leadership.

Patriotism: Based on fellowship and affection.
Nationalism: Based on rivalry and resentment.

Patriotism: Equal Justice under the Law.
Nationalism: Special Justice for those who are above the Law.

Patriotism: Equality, Liberty, and Justice for All.
Nationalism: Equality, Liberty, and Justice for the Privileged Few.

Patriotism: Fighting Fascism.
Nationalism: Practicing Fascism.

Patriotism: Freedom of Press, Speech, Religion, and Peaceful Assembly.
Nationalism: Propaganda, Censorship, Persecution, and Harassment.

Patriotism: Government by consent of the governed.
Nationalism: Government by force and decree of those who govern.

Patriotism: Hiring and promotion based on ability and willingness to work.
Nationalism: Hiring and promotion based on one's loyalty to the leadership.

Patriotism: "I love my country."
Nationalism: "My country; love it or leave it."

Patriotism: Love of country regardless of ethnicity, religion, or language.
Nationalism: Love of country requires shared ethnicity, religion, and language.

Patriotism: Love for fellow citizens.
Nationalism: Hatred for non-citizens.

Patriotism: Learning from our history and the history of others.
Nationalism: Teaching our version of history to others.

Patriotism: "My country can always do better."
Nationalism: "My country is already the best."

Patriotism: Pride in country for the good it does.
Nationalism: Pride in country for the evil it does.

Patriotism: Pride in self for who you are.
Nationalism: Pride in self for who you are not.

Patriotism: Securing government's loyalty to the citizens.
Nationalism: Securing citizens' loyalty to the leadership.

Patriotism: Special concern for the well-being of the citizenry.
Nationalism: Special concern for the well-being of the leadership.

Patriotism: The right to bear arms.
Nationalism: The right to shoot someone in pre-emptive "self-defense".

Patriotism: Tolerance for criticism as a learning experience.
Nationalism: Intolerance for criticism as an insult.

Patriotism: Upholding the right of others to disagree with authority.
Nationalism: Equating disagreement with treachery, disloyalty, and moral decay.

Patriotism: Willingness to sacrifice one's self to promote the country's good.
Nationalism: Willingness to sacrifice others to promote one's own self-interest.

It does, though.

If you think that your country is superior, you probably aren’t going to have much esteem for other locales.

One can love one's nation while loving other nations.

Like I said, nationalism, as it has manifested itself since at least the 19th century, has taken away esteem for other nations, and has placed one's own nation on an unrealistic pedestal.

Nationalistic nations tend to be regressive nations in many ways. I wouldn't want to live under an ideology of nationalism.

Like I said, you are conflating nationalism with patriotism.

If you think your country is superior, you won’t love other nations.

I would agree with Fnord’s examples.

Wrong.  Nationalists love only their own nations.  Every other nation must serve the nationalist's own nation.Thank you.  I have compiled this list over years of careful study, and not through mere assumption or guess work.

When a President openly declares that he is a proud nationalist, I think it’s important to know what that actually means and to be concerned about the sizable population which respects that.

I know what it “actually means.”

And I’ve been “very concerned” about it since Trump took office, and beyond.

You need to think about why they are so deeply annoyed.

I believe the reasons why some people may be annoyed by the MAGA slogan are being discussed precisely in this thread.
How does that address my question? I mean - what is the goal to achieve by annoying a group of people?

I'm not much for nationalism or patriotism at this point, and haven't been for years. It's just glorified tribalism, which just divides us and is responsible for most of the s**t in this world.

MAGA Types are "Deeply Annoyed" because:

  1. Their favorite ex-President did not have the 2019 election stolen from him.
  2. They are jealous when others do better than they.
  3. They cannot convince everyone that their lies are truth.
  4. They cannot get everyone to share their racist and sexist ideologies.
  5. They do not always get what they want.
  6. They do not enjoy being caught in lies and illegal activities.
  7. They fear being outnumbered by those whom they hate.
  8. They hate being proven wrong repeatedly.
  9. They hate being told 'No'.
10. They hate being told what to do.
11. They know, deep down inside, that they are equal to those whom they hate.

Trump lost the 2020 election.

Here's a hint, Perhaps those drawn to shallow slogans that are designed to build barriers between social groups think that those who wear those hats (cough*Sandmann cough*) subscribe to the idea that "patriotism" means you can attack (insert group) destroy existing bridges rather than actually build a country.

Think about tea party, MAGA and QAnon philosophy. It's about attacking other groups.

Don't believe me? watch any one of the hundred or so popular right wing podcasters who broadcast MAGA beliefs. Their modus operandi is identical
the left is corrupt
the left is woke
minorities take from true americans
minorities aren't true americans
get rid of welfare for the poor
get rid of free healthcare (not that exists in america)
get rid of alternative energy sources
get rid of electric cars
burn more fossil fuels
make it only rich people can afford education
the left is spreading woke propaganda through our schools
we can bring jobs back to america if you ban foreign exports
get rid of the minimum wage
rich shouldn't have to pay tax
stop immigration from s**thole (non-European) countries (Trump virtually got into power on this slogan alone)
women having a right to abortion should be banned
revoke laws that allow gay rights or civil rights

I could list several more but everyone knows this is what the MAGAs believe.
Nowhere is there about building social cohesion or economic planning for the future, stopping global warming or actually building jobs for the unemployed or integrating America into the global community by trade links

Biden dodged drafts in his youth and now he's dodging important questions.