Open Season in openly New York City Jews

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Back when you "followed the 9/11 truth movement closely," did you look not only at the 9/11 conspiracy theories themselves, but also at the grand conspiracy ideology ("Illuminati", "New World Order," various nonsense about the Federal Reserve, etc.) that was being promoted by Alex Jones and similar figures?

Here in NYC, back in 2007 or so, there was a group of Alex Jones fans who splintered out of the main New York 9/11 Truth organization and started their own organization, whose name I don't remember offhand. This group not only promoted the idea that "9/11 was an inside job," but also used 9/11 conspiracy claims as a gateway drug to promote Alex Jones's larger conspiratorial worldview.

Most of this grand conspiracy ideology was much older than 9/11. But the 9/11 Truth movement was being used, by some activists, as a vehicle to promote grand conspiracy ideology.

Not everyone in the 9/11 Truth movement accepted Alex Jones's extreme right wing views. The 9/11 Truth movement itself included a wide variety of people from across the political spectrum. But there was definitely a wing of the 9/11 Truth movement that did promote various extreme right wing views.


Indeed my main concern was not the 9/11 Truth movement itself but the grand conspiracy ideologists who opportunistically latched on to the 9/11 Truth movement.

Another category of people who opportunistically glommed on to the 9/11 Truth movement was Holocaust deniers. The vast majority of 9/11 Truthers were not Holocaust deniers, but some were, and the 9/11 Truth movement subculture was a convenient place for them to try to gain an audience.


Indeed I don't draw a straight line between the anti-Jewish aspects of some 9/11 conspiracy claims and now. But I do draw a straight line between the ideology Alex Jones and his fans were promoting back then and Pizzagate/QAnon, and I do draw an almost-straight line from Alex Jones's ideology to the recent revival of ideas from the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" and "The International Jew." Additionally, Alex Jones and some of his many followers, including those here in NYC, were actively working to build the general far-right political and social milieux that eventually blossomed into today's far-right.


The "Great Replacement Theory" was indeed fringe back then. But the far-right milieux built by Alex Jones and his followers certainly helped it grow and eventually become not quite so fringe anymore.

I don't dispute they faced discrimination but they happily assimilated in white spaces and like other migrants from Europe,
I'll break it down for you. The United states in the 19th and early 20th century was a layered cake of heirarchy. Yes the Jews knew they weren't part of the icing on the cake but they certainly didn't go out of their way to help those on the bottom (I deliberately used the layered cake as it's white icing and chocolate on the bottom which is a metaphor).

There is a valid argument that migrants have their own struggles and they can't be expected to stick their neck out for the traditionally oppressed groups (e,g. black and native). I think most migrants really just want to mind their own business and focus on their family and community.

However, the perception of the black community is they (the Jews) allied with the whites. Put yourself in the shoes of a black person, it's not hard to make that leap when Jews are one of the most successful groups to exceed even the whites they live as neighbors with despite the US clearly being a white supremacist state.

There was a time, when I was a kid, that black people thought that Jews were their allies. Partially it was because blacks people knew that Jews face discrimination, though of a different and maybe less virulent nature than what they (black people) experienced..

Jews were always one of the more liberal, radical, and pro civil rights voting blocs in America. Jewish names were always prominent when it came to liberal and radical leaders, and Jews were jailed, beaten
, and a couple died in aide of the civil rights movement. In the 60s it was a common for Jews to be called out for supporting Israel while protesting the Vietnam War.

I think black people generally lump Jews with whites. Can you blame them? Jews happily migrated to the US and (like all European and east Asian groups) participated in the institutions of Slavery and Jim Crow.

In an ironic twist the African Americans had to fight for their own civil rights on their own. Many of the victories they had in civil rights ironically benefitted Jews, hispanics and Asians who gratefully accepted the new laws and thanked black people by kicking them in the guts.

The bulk of American Jews came here through Ellis Island After the Civil War. Most American Jews are descended from peasants in places like Lithuania, who never owned slaves. And they were fleeing pogroms in Czarist Russia, and persecution in the Austro Hungarian Empire. East European Gentiles also moved here in the same era. And the core American population hated both East European Jews and East European Gentiles. And we became more antisemitic as a nation than before the Civil War. Jews were descriminated against in employment.

After WWII the Jews became major allies of the Black civil rights movement- because of their common interests with Blacks in fighting descrimination.

I'D respond coherently except i'm currently driunk.....over and out

I know all this but you are completely missing the point.

The average black American probably thinks that Rabbi Heimi Rubestein in New York wrote a letter to his extended family telling them how great America is, how much money they can make and you can have your own personal black slave

I also suspect the narrative that every jew who stepped through Ellis Island was an oppressed refugee is a little bit of an exaggeration.
Roger and Hammerstein were Jews and captured (in their musicals) the spirit in which migrants to the US saw the prospect of liberty and freedom. It's naive to think they expected the worst

Another Jew wrote West Side story and the quintessential essense of the experience of arriving in America is captured in the lyrics of the song "I want to live in America"

All this hometown history is slippin' away
Shattered by a miracle age
I'm gonna roar through the night on a fantasy flight
As soon as I come of age
When the dream ignites, there's a flame so bright
Burnin' in a young man's heart
Get your hands on the wheel of some Detroit steel
You can hear the music start

I'm telling you I want to live in America
I want to live in America

Have you ever been down south of Chinatown
Seen the face of a refugee
The kids are alive, they've learned to survive
They're just like you and me
All their friends back home wonder what it's like alone
Living in the land of the free
It's another way of life, rev it up and take a ride
Realise your dreams

I'm telling you I want to live in America
I want to live in America

Doesn't sound like the rumination of an oppressed jew (BTW no mention of blacks)

damn! I have a splitting headache