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carlos55
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29 Nov 2023, 3:33 am

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3f3gLiruW ... bmRyZXc%3D


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Honey69
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29 Nov 2023, 4:23 pm

Interesting. Thanks!


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Mona Pereth
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30 Nov 2023, 2:21 am

The video title mentions Andrew Tate, about whom see:

- Andrew Tate (Wikipedia)
- Inside the violent, misogynistic world of TikTok’s new star, Andrew Tate - Guardian, Sat 6 Aug 2022
- Andrew Tate charged with rape and human trafficking, BBC News in Bucharest and London, 21st June 2023
- Andrew Tate: Chats in 'War Room' suggest dozens of women groomed, BBC, 31st August 2023.

The full title of the video you're promoting is "What is The Matrix (of Andrew Tate)? The 9-5 Job Slave System." The title is apparently a reference to Tate's claim to be able to help people free themselves from "The 9-5 Job Slave System." Andrew Tate runs something called "Hustler University," which purports to teach various ways of earning money outside of traditional jobs.

Apparently, judging by the above-listed news stories, some of his students are taught how to become (abusive) pimps. Also, Tate uses a form of affiliate marketing that looks to me like a pyramid scheme.

Why are you calling our attention to this video? You posted just a link to it, without comment. What about it is "interesting" to you? What is your aim?


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Honey69
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30 Nov 2023, 12:05 pm

^ Oh. I had never heard of Andrew Tate before. They use similar verbiage when recruiting people for pyramid schemes. I don't think that I will join that club.


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carlos55
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30 Nov 2023, 2:31 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
The video title mentions Andrew Tate, about whom see:

- Andrew Tate (Wikipedia)
- Inside the violent, misogynistic world of TikTok’s new star, Andrew Tate - Guardian, Sat 6 Aug 2022
- Andrew Tate charged with rape and human trafficking, BBC News in Bucharest and London, 21st June 2023
- Andrew Tate: Chats in 'War Room' suggest dozens of women groomed, BBC, 31st August 2023.

The full title of the video you're promoting is "What is The Matrix (of Andrew Tate)? The 9-5 Job Slave System." The title is apparently a reference to Tate's claim to be able to help people free themselves from "The 9-5 Job Slave System." Andrew Tate runs something called "Hustler University," which purports to teach various ways of earning money outside of traditional jobs.

Apparently, judging by the above-listed news stories, some of his students are taught how to become (abusive) pimps. Also, Tate uses a form of affiliate marketing that looks to me like a pyramid scheme.

Why are you calling our attention to this video? You posted just a link to it, without comment. What about it is "interesting" to you? What is your aim?


Andrew Tate is quite famous ( I heard most googled person) like or not I think he’s an a hole, but he uses the term matrix to describe something often referred to by many people but called different things.

The video hardly mentions Tate other than matrix name association.

I don’t believe in throwing out the baby with the bath water so to speak.

It’s an interesting video that gives a certain perspective on things that we’re really all slaves against those that control the world.

Apparently Hillary Clinton is worth $400 million!

That’s a lot of money for someone who was a public servant most of her life and on government payroll don’t you think? :D

The corruption in US politics is like a banana republic.


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Mona Pereth
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30 Nov 2023, 6:23 pm

carlos55 wrote:
Andrew Tate is quite famous ( I heard most googled person) like or not I think he’s an a hole, but he uses the term matrix to describe something often referred to by many people but called different things.

Lots of people, with lots of different non-mainstream or not-quite-mainstream points of view, have used the "Matrix" metaphor to refer to the mainstream consensus on whatever topic. Exactly what facet(s) of the mainstream consensus they were objecting to, or what kind of deeper reality they believed they were seeing, has varied a lot, depending on who was using the metaphor. For example, before 2016, it was common for ex-Christian atheists (here in the U.S.A. at least) to refer to Christianity as the "matrix," or as a "blue pill," and themselves as having taken the "red pill."

However, as of 2016, most people other than extreme right wingers stopped using that metaphor, because it became stigmatized due to all the publicity given to the term "red pill" as used by "Manosphere" folks. (See my post here.)

carlos55 wrote:
The video hardly mentions Tate other than matrix name association.

I don’t believe in throwing out the baby with the bath water so to speak.

It would be better to bathe the baby, if any, in less polluted water....

carlos55 wrote:
It’s an interesting video that gives a certain perspective on things that we’re really all slaves against those that control the world.

Many people, on both the right and the left, have said similar things.

However, this video puts an antisocial spin on it, arguing NOT that there should be limits to the ability of the rich to exploit everyone else, but, rather, that it's fine to be ruthless in the pursuit of wealth.


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Mona Pereth
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01 Dec 2023, 1:50 am

More about Andrew Tate: In 2022, he claimed to have converted to Islam. Many Muslims are skeptical of the sincerity of his conversion and worried about his influence on young Muslim men:

- How Muslims feel about Andrew Tate’s conversion to Islam - ITV News
- Why this Muslim is pushing back against Andrew Tate: "In the West, some young Muslim men are being influenced by toxic rhetoric usually associated with far-right groups," by Yousra Samir, Al Jazeera, 22 Nov 2022
- The Muslim Manosphere Is Growing And It’s Andrew Tate’s Fault - Buzzfeed, April 21, 2023


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carlos55
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01 Dec 2023, 3:05 am

Mona Pereth wrote:
carlos55 wrote:
Andrew Tate is quite famous ( I heard most googled person) like or not I think he’s an a hole, but he uses the term matrix to describe something often referred to by many people but called different things.

Lots of people, with lots of different non-mainstream or not-quite-mainstream points of view, have used the "Matrix" metaphor to refer to the mainstream consensus on whatever topic. Exactly what facet(s) of the mainstream consensus they were objecting to, or what kind of deeper reality they believed they were seeing, has varied a lot, depending on who was using the metaphor. For example, before 2016, it was common for ex-Christian atheists (here in the U.S.A. at least) to refer to Christianity as the "matrix," or as a "blue pill," and themselves as having taken the "red pill."

However, as of 2016, most people other than extreme right wingers stopped using that metaphor, because it became stigmatized due to all the publicity given to the term "red pill" as used by "Manosphere" folks. (See my post here.)

carlos55 wrote:
The video hardly mentions Tate other than matrix name association.

I don’t believe in throwing out the baby with the bath water so to speak.

It would be better to bathe the baby, if any, in less polluted water....

carlos55 wrote:
It’s an interesting video that gives a certain perspective on things that we’re really all slaves against those that control the world.

Many people, on both the right and the left, have said similar things.

However, this video puts an antisocial spin on it, arguing NOT that there should be limits to the ability of the rich to exploit everyone else, but, rather, that it's fine to be ruthless in the pursuit of wealth.


Once again the video is not about Andrew Tate and doesn’t endorse him in anyway.

Rather what he and others mean when referring to “the matrix”

Quote:
However, this video puts an antisocial spin on it, arguing NOT that there should be limits to the ability of the rich to exploit everyone else, but, rather, that it's fine to be ruthless in the pursuit of wealth.


Of course that’s one interpretation and maybe he’s just a fed up programmer :D

There’s natural law (don’t kill , steal etc) then there’s many people telling us what we should do or think on top, which is not the same.

The main point I believe is be careful about so called special interest groups many are backed up by big money so called “dark money “

Many don’t have the interests of those they represent and secretly get rich themselves on the politics.


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Mona Pereth
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01 Dec 2023, 11:28 am

carlos55 wrote:
Once again the video is not about Andrew Tate and doesn’t endorse him in anyway.

The point of the video is to endorse and elaborate on some aspects of Andrew Tate's worldview.

carlos55 wrote:
Rather what he and others mean when referring to “the matrix”

... which is an aspect of his worldview. As I've said, different people have used "The Matrix" as a metaphor for whatever aspects of mainstream society they happen to disagree with. Since 2016, it has been mostly just extreme right wingers, and primarily "Manosphere" folks, who have used that metaphor, although that wasn't always the case.

carlos55 wrote:
Quote:
However, this video puts an antisocial spin on it, arguing NOT that there should be limits to the ability of the rich to exploit everyone else, but, rather, that it's fine to be ruthless in the pursuit of wealth.


Of course that’s one interpretation and maybe he’s just a fed up programmer :D

There’s natural law (don’t kill , steal etc) then there’s many people telling us what we should do or think on top, which is not the same.

Things like not letting people say really gross, blatantly racist and sexist things on social media?

carlos55 wrote:
The main point I believe is be careful about so called special interest groups many are backed up by big money so called “dark money“

Many don’t have the interests of those they represent and secretly get rich themselves on the politics.

There are different kinds of "special interests":

- 1) Lobbyists on behalf of corporations or wealthy individuals to advance their financial interests.
- 2) Genuine grassroots movements that have gotten big enough and respectable enough to attract support on college campuses and donations to relevant nonprofit organizations from some sympathetic rich people. (Various marginalized-group rights movements are in this category.)
- 3) Astroturf movements, founded by primarily by rich people to advance their own financial interests, similarly to type #1, but seeking to legitimize themselves by attracting grassroots support also. (Climate change denial is in this category.)

Right wingers, like Andrew Tate, tend to object only to "special interests" in category #2 above. And many right wingers falsely attribute these movements, in their entirety, to an elite conspiracy by some rich people to stop other people from getting rich. Hence the claim that these movements, in their entirety, are just part of "the Matrix."


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carlos55
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01 Dec 2023, 3:59 pm

The term "the matrix" was used by AT but the commentator associated that with "dark money". A real term not a conspiracy theory.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_money

It would be naive to believe many of these special interest groups trying to influence the public, big money, foreign entities & hedge funds were spending billions of their own funds to influence things for no self interest.

That interest may not necessarily be in the interests of the public or those they claim to represent


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Mona Pereth
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03 Dec 2023, 2:04 am

carlos55 wrote:
The term "the matrix" was used by AT but the commentator associated that with "dark money". A real term not a conspiracy theory.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_money

Note that "dark money," in the sense discussed in the Wikipedia article you linked to, has to do with anonymous indirect campaign contributions. But that is NOT the video commentator's main bone of contention, at all.

His prime alleged example of a sinister "dark money" organization is Media Matters, which is primarily just a website -- run by a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization, and, therefore, not legally allowed to make campaign contributions at all -- whereas "dark money" organizations (according to the Wikipedia article you linked to) are typically 501(c)(4).

According to the Wikipedia article about Media Matters:

Quote:
Media Matters for America (MMfA)[2] is a left-leaning[3] 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization and media watchdog group.[4] It was founded in 2004 by journalist and political activist David Brock as a counterweight to the conservative Media Research Center.[5] According to the New York Times in 2010, it is known for its "aggressive" criticism of conservative journalists and media outlets

Evidently, your video commentator would prefer that only right-wing media watchdog groups existed, and not any left-leaning ones. The fact that any left-leaning ones exist is, in his view, a sinister conspiracy to control us all.

Your video commentator claims that Media Matters "is just this random dark organization that was propped up out of nowhere, and they had been controlling so many commercial brands, and it was this shady organization, who nobody has ever heard of, funded out of nowhere, that had been controlling the mind-think and the narratives for millions of Americans."

The idea that Media Matters "had been controlling so many commercial brands" is ridiculous. However, advertisers do need to know what's going on with the media they advertise in. And media watchdog websites, on both the left and the right, might be seen by marketing executives as an efficient way to keep up with media trends. Only in that sense is Media Matters likely to have power over "so many commercial brands."

Earlier in the video, your commentator defends Andrew Tate himself in a thoroughly ingenuous way, implying that Tate was charged only with breaking some obscure laws that nobody ever heard of, when in fact Tate was charged with rape and human trafficking. You would have to live under a rock not to know that those things are illegal.


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07 Dec 2023, 12:53 pm

Didn't watch the vid, but most people to some degree or another are plugged into "The Matrix."

Honey69 wrote:
^ Oh. I had never heard of Andrew Tate before. They use similar verbiage when recruiting people for pyramid schemes. I don't think that I will join that club.

8O

He's a misogynistic dickbag "alpha male," darling of the political right.. ex professional fighter, exotic car collector etc.. but mainly made famous for being arrested in Romania last year for running an international human trafficking ring that basically locked up & enslaved women to be forced into making online webcam porn. I don't think that case has been settled yet.


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07 Dec 2023, 5:10 pm

goldfish21 wrote:
Honey69 wrote:
^ Oh. I had never heard of Andrew Tate before...

8O

He's a misogynistic dickbag "alpha male," darling of the political right.. ex professional fighter, exotic car collector etc.. but mainly made famous for being arrested in Romania last year for running an international human trafficking ring that basically locked up & enslaved women to be forced into making online webcam porn. I don't think that case has been settled yet.


Well, after all, I do happen to live under a rock...


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