"You HAVE to believe in God" - My mum.

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Thank you! I'll add these to my list of "Sunday-School Stoppers"!

It's likely most effective to not talk about religion at all.

Bad example. The Bible doesn't classify hares as ruminants. It says they "chew the cud." First of all, they do appear to "chew cud" at rest. Second, their droppings consist of partially digested plant material, which they will in turn eat. It has a similar function as the four stomachs of ruminating mammals.

Bats are flying creatures, just like birds are flying creatures. The mistake is not with the Bible, since the Bible cannot make scientific conclusions without ALL the facts present. If it is not known at the time that bats are rodents, it is unfair to say the Bible is wrong on a mere technicality. The language just equates all winged flying creatures as birds.

Same goes for the value of Pi. The Bible never assigns a value to Pi. In references to measurements involving circles, it makes an approximation. Rounding off numbers is a frequent feature of the Bible. If we're rounding to the nearest whole number, there is no error.

It's always interesting to read the same old lame excuses.

Rounding off to the nearest bullsh!t is also a frequent feature in the Bible

What?! I thought Quebec was the most secular part of Canada!

It is

Why it's bad that Qubec is the most secular place in Canada ?

Cud is pre-digested and regurgitated plant matter. Rabbits don't regurgitate their food, so they can't chew cud. Eating feces is a different matter. As for bats being listed as birds or fowl, shouldn't the creator of the universe know better? If the Bible is god-breathed, as Paul puts it, it shouldn't contain such glaring factual errors. One has to assume that other Bible content is non-factual as well.

Btw, bats aren't rodents. The reason for this common misconception is probably that they are called mice in some languages (Fledermaus = "winged mouse" in German and Chauve-souris = "bald mouse" in French). But they belong to an entirely different order of mammals (Chiroptera).

This is why I hid under bleachers when my parents sent me to sunday school as a kid. I hated that kind of inane answer to reasonable questions.

I'm a atheist, and have been one for around two years. I had this same exact discussion with my mom also. I was told that "You have to believe in a higher power." Both of my parents were 'concerned' about my soul, and think that I am going to Hell.

I read many philosophy that really made me question the existence of a higher power, and my passion for philosophy scared my parents as they were worried I was "getting influenced" by philosophy, some of which was 100+ years old. We got into fights frequently over my beliefs, or lack there of.

To the OP, I'd say no, you don't HAVE to believe in a higher power. It is your choice not to. Your parents cannot, and should not, shape your free will. It is only human to question everything and to shape your own opinions.

My favorite quote by far from my philosophical readings by far has to be this one by German philosopher Karl Marx:

"Question everything."

Yes, question everything. One thing that really bothered me was when my parents thought it was wrong to read the opinions of 100+ year old atheist writers/philosophers. I have a right to believe what I want as a free thinking human being.

question everything, and keep doing that til the day that you die.

Um... what? Are you sure that you've thought about this carefully?

How can the Bible classify bats as "birds"? Surely it can only classify bats as a Hebrew classification, which may sometimes be translated as "birds"? And clearly bats really are part of this Hebrew classification, because otherwise it wouldn't say that!

The modern scientific way of classifying animals isn't the only possible way.



As already pointed out, this isn't true at all. In fact, if the implication is that the ancient Jews really thought that pi is exactly 3, it can't be true. Think about it. It is impossible for a civilization that builds anything to not figure out that what we call "pi" is somewhere between 3 and 4.

Ask how they know what they believe and the most likely point to the bible. Then ask how the know the bible is correct?

Even in the most secular province in Canada, people are not exactly tolerant of atheists. Even less so of apatheists/pragmatic atheists like me. Being an Anglo-Atheist (thus two of the least-loved of our minorities combined in one, hurray for me!), I generally keep my mouth shut around here

My parents know but really don't tell anyone. The way my dad's way of phrasing it is that I 'haven't found God yet' - which apparently a more theistically friendly way of saying that he simply hasn't exposed himself to me but will (ie. a temporary atheism). I also had a relative who I had a lot of respect for who I mentioned that I debate atheists often (though I didn't say 'other') and that set her off on quite a surprising tirade about atheists believing they simply don't need God, that they're selfers and just don't want God to see what they're doing - all the more reason perhaps to never pass that info her way.

Surely any classification system will file bats under the group of animals that give life birth instead of laying eggs, possess mammary glands and suckle their offspring, have fur instead of feathers, and possess a placenta as well as a diaphragm. The differences between mammals and birds are quite obvious, unless we're talking about monotremes such as the platypus (which aren't placental mammals).