Stop using guns to kill things!

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What about crossbows?

ruveyn

Yes, I do have quite a colorful imagination.


It was a hypothetical example to demonstrate something you seem to have trouble grasping. I only used myself as the active shooter in that hypothetical example since I know my skill-set better than anyone else's.


Clearly, by your logic, if I drove a Corvette instead of a Toyota Tundra I'd automatically get tickets all the time since one is faster than the other. Forget that both can haul ass, just assume that only the vette can since that's what it's built for.


How do you know I don't? Trust me, that old Mauser I just randomly used in my hypothetical example is not without plenty of company the safe.
Whether one or more of it's brethren are full auto capable you'll never know for sure.


Difficult but extremely so to do it legally. Very expensive as well, legally. There are channels that are not legal from which the same hardware is obtainable, though.
Did Holmes legally shoot all of those people?
Semi-autos can be converted to selective fire as well....

Last edited by Raptor on 21 Jul 2012, 9:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Setting aside the wisdom of a potential 3+ way gunfight in a dark room filled with tear gas, at the end of the day he was wearing some kind of kevlar and had an AR-15 and a shotgun. Those are bad odds for anyone.

How about rarely effective when all is said and done?
How would you accurately measure the effectiveness of gun control?


Legally define "assault weapon" if you would, please.
Then discuss the differences between the "assault weapon" and the hunting rifle describing how they cannot effectively swap roles.

Someone failed to pick up on a joke.






Evidence, plz?

I would measure it based on the elimination of gun-related violence. If people continue to kill each other with guns, law enforcement would need to do a better job.



I would like to see all guns eliminated (ideally). However, by "assault weapon," I mean the automatic rifle used in the Colorado massacre.

Maybe because there is no irony.


Um, in case you didn’t start at the beginning of this thread the topic is titled “Stop using guns to kill things!”. I had actually hoped the massacre in Aurora story wouldn’t come to this kind of discussion on this forum but someone else elected to get the ball rolling in the wrong direction. Bark up someone else’s tree about this thread instead of letting your partisan instincts blind you.


So now you’re saying that someone legally carrying a concealed handgun is an unstable freak? Not only that but doting on it in every sentence that follows?
If you read what I wrote I said someone legally carrying under the CCW law the massacre could potentially have been stopped. I don’t have the time or inclination to go over every scenario and I don’t even know what all would apply in this instance.


So someone who has an opportunity to neutralize a threat (to put it mildly) shouldn’t just because he might mistakenly shoot someone else? Yeah, better to let the guy kill 12 and wound 58.


I guess you’re talking about James Holmes. It’s not immediately clear since you seem to equate an active shooter to someone carrying strictly for defensive purposes.
Anyhow, I don’t think anyone with all of their marbles in one jar is carrying on their person an AR-15 and a 12 gauge shotgun in addition to the Glock .40 just for self defense. It’s kind of hard to conceal those to go unnoticed and comply with the law.


Yes, but it’s one of the perils of life that we all risk by getting out of bed every day. There is nothing that can keep the sky from falling when someone is determined to make it fall and I don’t want to live in a country or state that tries to legislatively do the impossible just as a feel good measure at the expense of my rights and safety.


Again, go back to the OP and bark up that tree.


Not necessarily.
It depends on the determination and skillset of the psycho in question.
I’ve seen skilled shooters do awesome things with a 6 shot revolver and the not so skilled individuals that couldn’t hit the ground consistently with a 17 shot Glock.

Who said we're limited to handguns?

So a city or state with strict gun control automatically has less violent crime and one with lenient gun control has a high violent crime rate?
It's illegal to murder people but apparently that doesn't work as some would like to believe.


Well, I'll carry a pistol since any cop is too heavy and cumbersome to carry very far.


I kind of figured that from the beginning.


I believe it was a Smith & Wesson semi auto M4 type carbine (AR-15 with a collapsible stock and short barrel).
It wasn't an "automatic rifle" by any technical definition, period.

Regarding gun control and confiscation - it will be no more effective than creating "Gun Free Zones".
Guns are practically off limits to citizens in the UK and we still have gun crime.

And now, a video

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7pGt_O1uM8[/youtube]

No, I was responding to your question. You asked me how it could be measured. As I said, I do not think that people who are not in law enforcement or hunters should have guns.



I am not an expert on firearms. So, I would expand what I said to include semi-automatic weapons, too.

And you didn't provide much of an effective metric to measure the success of gun control other than feel good rhetoric.


And with this comes the end of violent crime? And if it doesn't (and it won't) then what?


That rules out some hunter's guns. Need examples?

BTW: Note that I'm not even going into the constitution, yet.

I love it!
The sad thing is that some people, even in this thread, actually subscribe to that kind of thinking.

Ill take the odds if it were my children in there. Ill be shooting at where the flashes are coming from.

I did not claim to be providing metrics. I was expressing a moral position.



I will look at the Constitution after it is rewritten for the 21st century.

Guns are a necessary tool. Do you unquestionable trust your government as the sole owners of guns? I sure as hell don't, if a cop or soldier can have a gun I can too. An armed populace is a free populace.

Gun control is not going to EVER stop a determined individual from causing harm. That's just an unfortunate fact.

Last edited by Jacoby on 22 Jul 2012, 1:03 am, edited 1 time in total.