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phil777
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16 Oct 2009, 3:41 pm

He used to have my respect while he was putting bars in the American's wheels, but uh, after i read that he tried to modify the constitution to allow himself to serve more terms than was allowed, he kinda dropped in my esteem.



Dox47
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16 Oct 2009, 3:57 pm

I tend to think of Hugo as the world leader equivalent of an internet troll, yes he's loud and distracting, but as tempting as it may be to smack him down, it's usually better to just ignore him. I do wish the alternative fuel people would hurry up a bit so we didn't have to do business with his ilk anymore, but in the meantime I'm content to buy his oil and let him rave about the numerous conspiracies trying to kill him, though if it could somehow be arranged for him to choke to death on his own overwrought rhetoric, I'd probably be down.


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techstepgenr8tion
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16 Oct 2009, 4:45 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Think about that very carefully. After you have surrendered your right to free speech and political protest, the government cuts back on the welfare goodies to save money, but you are no longer in a position to complain, since you have surrendered your right to free speech political protest.

Your proposal is dead on arrival.

ruveyn


Lol, its definitely not my proposal nor anything I ever desire to see. Glad to see you have a similar take to my own on one issue at least.



EC
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16 Oct 2009, 6:19 pm

Dox47 wrote:
I tend to think of Hugo as the world leader equivalent of an internet troll


Don't forget about Ahmadinejad:
ImageImage



0_equals_true
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16 Oct 2009, 7:26 pm

skafather84 wrote:
"Fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power."
Benito Mussolini

We're in a fascist state. It's hidden under a lot of freedom rhetoric that doesn't really apply anywhere in practice...but we're pretty fascist.

Concur



TitusLucretiusCarus
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18 Oct 2009, 11:33 am

Quote:
He used to have my respect while he was putting bars in the American's wheels, but uh, after i read that he tried to modify the constitution to allow himself to serve more terms than was allowed, he kinda dropped in my esteem.


why should the limits of bourgeois parliamentary democracy remain the ultimate horizon of his/their goals? the US has term limits and upon the completion of his the warmonger Bush left office for a man who withdraw all US troops from occupied territories, closed the torture and detention centres and brought the US economy back from the brink of....oh, wait, no nothing changed at all. Sorry for being facetious towards you, but, the illusion of liberal deomcracy is that the state can be changed and held to account through parliamentary elections every four years, but it can't, it is far too massive a presence for that - either Chavez crashes through the limits imposed by the system he works in or the Bolivarian revolution is steadily rolled back and if he leaves office because of term limits anything and everything done in office will be for nought. And every time a country elects someone who remotely threatens US hegemony in the region the US backs a deeply repressive (and undemocratic) coup, Honduras being only the latest example. Chances are that Chavez will become an even more polarizing figure over the next couple of years; either Venezuela presses forward against private property, the corporations etc etc in short, continue into the final and most active stage of the revolution or it slides backward. Also, what wasn't covered in the western media were the constitutional changes giving full rights to homosexuals, legislation on areas of womens issues and so forth. The changes were hugely progressive, but mediacorp will take any and every opportunity to try and slander the Bolivarian revolution (course I was taken aback and sickened by Chavez' support for Ahmedinejad a few months before the Iranian elections {I think}, that was a stupid, stupid move; though I think motivated largely by their shared enemy)



techstepgenr8tion
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18 Oct 2009, 12:39 pm

TitusLucretiusCarus wrote:
Quote:
He used to have my respect while he was putting bars in the American's wheels, but uh, after i read that he tried to modify the constitution to allow himself to serve more terms than was allowed, he kinda dropped in my esteem.


why should the limits of bourgeois parliamentary democracy remain the ultimate horizon of his/their goals? the US has term limits and upon the completion of his the warmonger Bush left office for a man who withdraw all US troops from occupied territories, closed the torture and detention centres and brought the US economy back from the brink of....oh, wait, no nothing changed at all.


Congratulations, I think you've likely quite accurately guessed the logic, should we ever have at least a liberal/Democrat president try to crash through the constitution (mainly by trying to get a third term, probably on other matters as well) - if you combine that statement, that its all the same leadership anyway and that it would only be a change in appearance rather than substance, combined with Skafather's take that there's nothing to fear from the Fairness Doctrine - all the more ways that anyone who disagrees with things that, to most people these days would be shocking, would be just written off as ultra-right loonytoons.