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On the budget crisis in Wisconsin, I say...
Poll ended at 27 May 2011, 1:13 pm
Where? What? *runs to google* 3%  3%  [ 1 ]
Lynch the Governor for union busting. Workers' Revolt! 61%  61%  [ 20 ]
Fire the union workers! They get paid too much anyway! 18%  18%  [ 6 ]
Protests scare me...just...make them stop. 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
They're protesting somewhere? Let me get my sign...and my molotov cocktails. 3%  3%  [ 1 ]
Doesn't effect me, so I don't care. 12%  12%  [ 4 ]
Your polls are stupid, your topic is stupid, and I'm going to tell you why... 3%  3%  [ 1 ]
Total votes : 33

pandorazmtbox
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26 Feb 2011, 1:13 pm

Have you politicos been following the hootenanny in Wisconsin? I've been watching all kinds of hot debate on FBook from my midwestern friends. Some say the class wars have begun. Some are blaming the workers--especially those evil, wicked unions. Some are blaming the Governor and especially the Christian Right Conservatives. Some say Cairo has moved to Wisconsin. :roll:

I figure this place might be a good place to stir up a debate, or an argument, or a philosophical word whack-off. What do you have to say?


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Inuyasha
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26 Feb 2011, 1:16 pm

First some of your responses are out of line.

Lynching someone, seriously...


Second of all, a lot of these teachers have committed a felony. Specifically fraud, and those that took those phony doctor's notes should be fired.



leejosepho
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26 Feb 2011, 1:18 pm

What? Where? *too lazy to run to google*


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pandorazmtbox
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26 Feb 2011, 1:30 pm

Oh, Inuyasha, lighten up. It's called humor. None of those responses are actually serious, and are ALL posted in a very polarized way to spark discussion.

If lynching isn't the solution, then what is?


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leejosepho
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26 Feb 2011, 1:36 pm

pandorazmtbox wrote:
Oh, Inuyasha, lighten up. It's called humor. None of those responses are actually serious ...

You notice has come a bit late.


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26 Feb 2011, 1:43 pm

I think we are seeing some of the first austerity measures, similar to what has been occurring in Europe. Hope we don't become another Greece. Enjoyed Professor Mead's article the other day about what is occurring in Madison.

The Madison Blues
http://blogs.the-american-interest.com/ ... son-blues/


On the positive side this could be another stimulus for some states. Was reading that towns in Illinois are advertising for fleeing Democrats to come, stay, & spend money. Rockford, Illinois made this video.

Best tourism video ever: Rockford IL woos Fleebaggers
http://michellemalkin.com/2011/02/25/be ... eebaggers/



pandorazmtbox
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26 Feb 2011, 1:48 pm

leejosepho, here is a link to a recent USAToday story (in the last two hours), about the continuing protests at the State Capitol building in Wisconsin.
Protesters plan biggest rally at Wisconsin capitol

There was a budget surplus in Wisconsin, prior to the governor instituting some corporate tax cuts (to the tune of 140 million dollars). Walker (the governor) then announced a budget crisis, and submitted a proposal that would have the public employees' benefits cut (to the tune of $137 million)--especially those of the unionized employees, some of whom would suffer a 12% decrease in benefits. Just to be clear, these are the teachers who have helped Wisconsin education to be ranked 2nd among the 50 states. Salon.com article

Protests have been ongoing for at least a week, as the governor has refused to negotiate with the unions and the democratic legislators have walked out of the capitol to prevent the passing of this proposed solution. I hear the protests have been peaceful, including yesterday when the police were ordered in to the capitol to disperse the gathered, and ended up joining them instead. The Understory

Both sides are so entrenched, that even in polite Wisconsin, where protestors will spontaneously chant "thank you" to the cops [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOk4CLZb_dM[/youtube], people are getting on the brink of public fist-fight angry about the "other" side. Friendships are straining and breaking...and is Wisconsin just a weird blip in the news or the sign of things to come?


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leejosepho
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26 Feb 2011, 2:10 pm

pandorazmtbox wrote:
Both sides are so entrenched, that even in polite Wisconsin, where protesters will spontaneously chant "thank you" to the cops ... people are getting on the brink of public fist-fight angry about the "other" side. Friendships are straining and breaking...and is Wisconsin just a weird blip in the news or the sign of things to come?

A sign of things already here.


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Philologos
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26 Feb 2011, 2:55 pm

It is a symptom of the accelerating lemming run associated with civilization.



Inuyasha
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26 Feb 2011, 4:22 pm

pandorazmtbox wrote:
There was a budget surplus in Wisconsin, prior to the governor instituting some corporate tax cuts (to the tune of 140 million dollars). Walker (the governor) then announced a budget crisis, and submitted a proposal that would have the public employees' benefits cut (to the tune of $137 million)--especially those of the unionized employees, some of whom would suffer a 12% decrease in benefits. Just to be clear, these are the teachers who have helped Wisconsin education to be ranked 2nd among the 50 states. Salon.com article


Uh this is why I don't trust salon.

Our conclusion: Maddow and the others are wrong.

There is, indeed, a projected deficit that required attention, and Walker and GOP lawmakers did not create it.

More on that second point in a bit.

The confusion, it appears, stems from a section in Lang’s memo that -- read on its own -- does project a $121 million surplus in the state’s general fund as of June 30, 2011.

But the remainder of the routine memo -- consider it the fine print -- outlines $258 million in unpaid bills or expected shortfalls in programs such as Medicaid services for the needy ($174 million alone), the public defender’s office and corrections. Additionally, the state owes Minnesota $58.7 million under a discontinued tax reciprocity deal.

The result, by our math and Lang’s, is the $137 million shortfall.

It would be closer to the $340 million figure if the figure included the $200 million owed to the state’s patient compensation fund, a debt courts have declared resulted from an illegal raid on the fund under former Gov. Jim Doyle.

A court ruling is pending in that matter, so the money might not have to be transferred until next budget year.

To be sure, the projected shortfall is a modest one by the standards of the last decade, which saw a $600 million repair bill one year as the economy and national tax collections slumped.

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin/sta ... udget-sur/

pandorazmtbox wrote:
Protests have been ongoing for at least a week, as the governor has refused to negotiate with the unions and the democratic legislators have walked out of the capitol to prevent the passing of this proposed solution. I hear the protests have been peaceful, including yesterday when the police were ordered in to the capitol to disperse the gathered, and ended up joining them instead. The Understory



Death threats is hardly peaceful. I'll try to find the video of a union thug being arrested for vandalism too.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ac/20110219/pl_ ... n_protests

pandorazmtbox wrote:
Both sides are so entrenched, that even in polite Wisconsin, where protestors will spontaneously chant "thank you" to the cops [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOk4CLZb_dM[/youtube], people are getting on the brink of public fist-fight angry about the "other" side. Friendships are straining and breaking...and is Wisconsin just a weird blip in the news or the sign of things to come?


Brink of fist fights, there have already been attacks.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zm_Fl3AszuU&feature=player_embedded#at=41[/youtube]

http://www.varight.com/news/tim-kaines- ... -activist/



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26 Feb 2011, 4:32 pm

Your not going to convince anyone that this protest is unruly, the police joined. That gives the protest its own legitimacy, although I doubt all the officers joined as that would be dangerous.



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26 Feb 2011, 4:52 pm

ikorack wrote:
Your not going to convince anyone that this protest is unruly, the police joined. That gives the protest its own legitimacy, although I doubt all the officers joined as that would be dangerous.


And I really doubt the police or very many of the police joined the protest.

Also:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=je3UT7ol1JY&feature=player_embedded#at=199[/youtube]

http://www.bernardgoldberg.com/the-lame ... n-madison/

Kinda sad that Bretbart does a better job reporting than CBS, New York Times, MSNBC, ABC, CNN, combined.

http://biggovernment.com/laborunionrepo ... n-workers/

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APzu9zX4mBA&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]



pandorazmtbox
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26 Feb 2011, 4:55 pm

Actually, I have friends who were there who confirm that the police did join.


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Inuyasha
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26 Feb 2011, 5:00 pm

pandorazmtbox wrote:
Actually, I have friends who were there who confirm that the police did join.


Okay glad to know the Police Support Money Laundering

http://ciscocotto.wordpress.com/2011/02 ... aundering/



ikorack
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26 Feb 2011, 5:03 pm

The only use of better I can see your use meaning is the better which results from appraising sources by what fits your world-view. Essentially a useless standard. What makes their report better?



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26 Feb 2011, 5:04 pm

pandorazmtbox wrote:
leejosepho, here is a link to a recent USAToday story (in the last two hours), about the continuing protests at the State Capitol building in Wisconsin.
Protesters plan biggest rally at Wisconsin capitol

There was a budget surplus in Wisconsin, prior to the governor instituting some corporate tax cuts (to the tune of 140 million dollars). Walker (the governor) then announced a budget crisis, and submitted a proposal that would have the public employees' benefits cut (to the tune of $137 million)--especially those of the unionized employees, some of whom would suffer a 12% decrease in benefits. Just to be clear, these are the teachers who have helped Wisconsin education to be ranked 2nd among the 50 states. Salon.com article

Protests have been ongoing for at least a week, as the governor has refused to negotiate with the unions and the democratic legislators have walked out of the capitol to prevent the passing of this proposed solution. I hear the protests have been peaceful, including yesterday when the police were ordered in to the capitol to disperse the gathered, and ended up joining them instead. The Understory

Both sides are so entrenched, that even in polite Wisconsin, where protestors will spontaneously chant "thank you" to the cops [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOk4CLZb_dM[/youtube], people are getting on the brink of public fist-fight angry about the "other" side. Friendships are straining and breaking...and is Wisconsin just a weird blip in the news or the sign of things to come?


It seems when the chips are down the people will fight like dogs over scraps of meat. I think the right wing is playing the private sector middle class against the public sector middle class. One side wants to drag the other down because the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.