Atheists Libertarians are smarter than everyone else

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Vexcalibur
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23 Mar 2011, 8:32 am

That's right, ever since the .com bubble bust we have had an overprotective state trying to fix everything and moving the bust from one section to another.


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ruveyn
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23 Mar 2011, 9:30 am

Vexcalibur wrote:
That's right, ever since the .com bubble bust we have had an overprotective state trying to fix everything and moving the bust from one section to another.


It is a futile quest on the part of government. There is an old saying: Before the stupidity of Man even the Gods are helpless.

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Awesomelyglorious
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23 Mar 2011, 11:43 am

jamieboy wrote:
The credit crunch would have been such a bust. Were it not for the intervention of Big government and it's nationalization of the banking sector undertaken in order to protect ordinary peoples savings. Failure to act at all (the position of the Libertarian Right) would have been an unmitigated economic disaster. If you're going to have markets then they need regulating properly as people are often incapable of acting rationally where money is concerned. The negative side of the bailout is that bankers will be able to act the same way again knowing they have a government guarantor.

Speculation on events that did not happen is always questionable, especially in economics. Frankly, the Great Depression, the largest destructive event in banking for the last 100 years wasn't as bad as you are claiming this would be, and when anybody tries to do that, this is questionable.

In any case, there are a few problems with what you put forward:
1) Who is to say that the regulation will start off properly? Politicians are by no means unbiased or rational actors, nor are their constituents, so who is to say that this could be enacted?
2) Who is to say that even if enacted, it would be properly maintained? Regulators are themselves people, and even if they ideally follow certain rules, in practice they might easily not, especially if things are looking good at the moment. This point is made by Charles Kindleberger, who is not a libertarian, but rather a promoter of Minsky's(the Post-Keynesian) business cycle.
3) What is to say that the regulation would work as well as common sense of some form? Regulations often cannot foresee all events, but people who trust heavily in a regulatory body may mistakenly think they would be able to do so and thus fail to exercise a more discerning judgement.
4) What is to say that efforts over time would not improve people's abilities to reason on certain areas? Either in promoting better institutional norms or in promoting just better thinking?

That negative side you just mentioned is something that a lot of libertarians have mentioned.

Finally, let's even say that you are right, and that intervention WAS necessary at that point in time. Does it follow that the rest of your economic ideas and prescriptions are true? Wouldn't it still be true that a deficit interventionist-libertarianism would still be broadly libertarian.



Master_Pedant
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23 Mar 2011, 11:48 am

For those living under a rock, the nature and logic of my past three posts was greatly inspired by these threads.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt127541.html

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt128298.html


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Awesomelyglorious
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23 Mar 2011, 5:34 pm

Master_Pedant wrote:
For those living under a rock, the nature and logic of my past three posts was greatly inspired by these threads.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt127541.html

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt128298.html

Oh, Master_Pedant, unless it is election season, we're not at the point of complete batsh** arguments/smears.



Orwell
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23 Mar 2011, 5:39 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Master_Pedant wrote:
For those living under a rock, the nature and logic of my past three posts was greatly inspired by these threads.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt127541.html

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt128298.html

Oh, Master_Pedant, unless it is election season, we're not at the point of complete batsh** arguments/smears.

Never to soon to start campaigning!

When is the next election, anyways?


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Awesomelyglorious
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23 Mar 2011, 5:57 pm

Orwell wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Master_Pedant wrote:
For those living under a rock, the nature and logic of my past three posts was greatly inspired by these threads.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt127541.html

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt128298.html

Oh, Master_Pedant, unless it is election season, we're not at the point of complete batsh** arguments/smears.

Never to soon to start campaigning!

When is the next election, anyways?

Still, there is a certain level of decorum, where the smear campaigns have to follow the actual effort to start campaigning in general. I mean, smears only work with a populace that is already engaged.



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23 Mar 2011, 6:04 pm

Orwell wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Master_Pedant wrote:
For those living under a rock, the nature and logic of my past three posts was greatly inspired by these threads.

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt127541.html

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt128298.html

Oh, Master_Pedant, unless it is election season, we're not at the point of complete batsh** arguments/smears.

Never to soon to start campaigning!

When is the next election, anyways?


The "pre-election" round starts May 31, 2011 and ends on June 3, 2011. The final, STV vote for the 3 representatives of strident atheism takes place from June 3, 2011 to June 10, 2011.

And the birther smears against Obama started well before the final Presidential campaign (McCain vs. Obama), so if anything it's best to float out lies while nobody is paying attention and later they'll gain traction. I think I've already poisoned the well against AG quite a bit.


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Awesomelyglorious
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23 Mar 2011, 6:07 pm

Master_Pedant wrote:
The "pre-election" round starts May 31, 2011 and ends on June 3, 2011. The final, STV vote for the 3 representatives of strident atheism takes place from June 3, 2011 to June 10, 2011.

And the birther smears against Obama started well before the final Presidential campaign (McCain vs. Obama), so if anything it's best to float out lies while nobody is paying attention and later they'll gain traction. I think I've already poisoned the well against AG quite a bit.

Except that nothing you put out there will help you that much. You only alienated those who were NOT left wing, as your entire argument centered around that I was NOT a left-wing candidate.



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23 Mar 2011, 6:12 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Except that nothing you put out there will help you that much. You only alienated those who were NOT left wing, as your entire argument centered around that I was NOT a left-wing candidate.


So? There's enough leftwing atheists to carry me through and anti-atheists who vote in the anonymous poll to affirm the evilest atheist on WP will likely vote me in as a result as well.


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23 Mar 2011, 6:55 pm

Master_Pedant wrote:
Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Except that nothing you put out there will help you that much. You only alienated those who were NOT left wing, as your entire argument centered around that I was NOT a left-wing candidate.


So? There's enough leftwing atheists to carry me through and anti-atheists who vote in the anonymous poll to affirm the evilest atheist on WP will likely vote me in as a result as well.

There probably is a strong leftist sentiment among atheists here, but they will probably base their vote solely on who is the most strident atheist, and AG has been more persistent in attacking theism than you have. Also, his avatar looks like something that would eat the souls of the unborn.


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Master_Pedant
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23 Mar 2011, 6:58 pm

Orwell wrote:
There probably is a strong leftist sentiment among atheists here, but they will probably base their vote solely on who is the most strident atheist, and AG has been more persistent in attacking theism than you have. Also, his avatar looks like something that would eat the souls of the unborn.


May this be evidence of the liberal Calvinist conspiracy against me.


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Vigilans
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23 Mar 2011, 6:59 pm

Master_Pedant wrote:
Orwell wrote:
There probably is a strong leftist sentiment among atheists here, but they will probably base their vote solely on who is the most strident atheist, and AG has been more persistent in attacking theism than you have. Also, his avatar looks like something that would eat the souls of the unborn.


May this be evidence of the liberal Calvinist conspiracy against me.


Atheists don't believe in the souls of the unborn anyway


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Awesomelyglorious
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23 Mar 2011, 7:19 pm

Orwell wrote:
There probably is a strong leftist sentiment among atheists here, but they will probably base their vote solely on who is the most strident atheist, and AG has been more persistent in attacking theism than you have. Also, his avatar looks like something that would eat the souls of the unborn.

Right, well, I haven't disappeared for a months. Even further, M_P, your comeback is rather unexpected. There was a very strongly theistic poster who posted here regularly for awhile and then left a few days back. You arrived about WHEN HE LEFT. Now, some people might think this is a conspiracy, however, this brings to mind a very real possibility, that there aren't really two different posters but perhaps those two are one and the same. I am not the person to advocate muckraking though, and so I will not outright proclaim that 91 and M_P are actually the same person. However, if it is possible, I think we, the voters, have to take this seriously.



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23 Mar 2011, 7:35 pm

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
Right, well, I haven't disappeared for a months. Even further, M_P, your comeback is rather unexpected. There was a very strongly theistic poster who posted here regularly for awhile and then left a few days back. You arrived about WHEN HE LEFT. Now, some people might think this is a conspiracy, however, this brings to mind a very real possibility, that there aren't really two different posters but perhaps those two are one and the same. I am not the person to advocate muckraking though, and so I will not outright proclaim that 91 and M_P are actually the same person. However, if it is possible, I think we, the voters, have to take this seriously.


I will not stand by while a right-libertarian self-hating atheist endorsed by LIBERAL CALVINISTS insinuates me of being a double agent while there is so much evidence that AG is one and the same as iamnotaparakeet.


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Awesomelyglorious
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23 Mar 2011, 7:38 pm

Master_Pedant wrote:
I will not stand by while a right-libertarian self-hating atheist endorsed by LIBERAL CALVINISTS insinuates me of being a double agent while there is so much evidence that AG is one and the same as iamnotaparakeet.

Except this coincidence is REAL. I've argued with iamnotaparakeet enough times where people can easily distinguish between the writings, and underlying thought processes.

Now, obviously M_P, the entire direction you are going is fictive, just like your atheism. I already showed to the world that you were a Catholic. Maybe you've converted to another religion, like scientology, but still, it's true.