Changing American Perceptions of its Military?
lotuspuppy
Veteran
Joined: 14 Jan 2008
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 995
Location: On a journey to the center of the mind
I found Wednesday's U.S. GDP report very interesting. For those who do not know, GDP for the fourth quarter of 2012 shrank by 0.1 percent. That said, economists and serious investors did not seemed concerned about it. Consumer spending and business investing grew pretty robustly, and one drag on growth, shrinking business inventories, is likely not to be repeated now that American spending is growing.
What struck me the most was the contraction in defense spending. Defense spending declined 22.2 percent, the largest drop since 1972. This is before possible sequestration, which would slash the military budget further.
I am mostly interested in what this means for American culture, and how it views the military. In the past, defense spending was a sacred cow, and was almost never cut. Now, there are talks about trimming the defense budget, and indeed, it appears to be happening on its own. It seems as if Americans accept this far more than, say, a cut to Social Security or Medicare, which is not currently at risk of budget cuts.
Could this signal a new era in America's relationship with its military? Is the U.S. entering a stage of demilitarization? Do you think these spending draw downs mean a genuine decline of the U.S. military, or that it will simply become more efficient and adapt?
It IS a peacekeeping force.
Best way to keep peace is through superior firepower.
_________________
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
- Thomas Jefferson
It IS a peacekeeping force.
Best way to keep peace is through superior firepower.
And having military bases in like 63 countries in the world.
How would you feel if China put bases in America, you know, to protect the world from anti-Chinese interests?
I don't think we'll have to worry about that.
Having too small of a military and an isolationist national policy is what got us roped into WW1 and subsequently WW2.....
_________________
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
- Thomas Jefferson
I don't think we'll have to worry about that.
Having too small of a military and an isolationist national policy is what got us roped into WW1 and subsequently WW2.....
Huh wha?
We should never have gotten involved in WWI. All we would have needed to do was just shoot down said German subs in our waters. And Mexico invading us wasn't even a credible threat, as Germany was losing WWI anyway and couldn't send them arms and US would be the only place Mexico could buy arms to invade US. Arguably, our going into WWI caused WWII. If we just stayed the out of WWI and not artificially influenced the war for France and England, I think things would have gone much better. Hitler wouldn't have rose to power if we just let Germany win. But hey, we had to look cool to the international people.
For WWII, we could have just sold Japan the stuff it wanted and likely avoided an invasion.
When was the last time Switzerland was involved in a war (besides now with "UN Peacekeeping" it's forced to do being part of the UN)? They're extremely isolationist and neutral, so isolationist they'd shoot down American planes and German ones flying over their airspace during WWII.
Unfortunately USA wants an empire, and an empire requires alliances. We could have been a nice, free, peaceful neutral state but we wanted power instead.
It is certainly difficult to remain neutral if a trading partner is involved in war and their enemy torpedos our ships though. If a rising power is out of control bombing and invading neighboring nations i don't see a problem with military expansion and joining the fight. But after the fight if we keep up a big army I think we tend to look for other enemies to fight.
What struck me the most was the contraction in defense spending. Defense spending declined 22.2 percent, the largest drop since 1972. This is before possible sequestration, which would slash the military budget further.
I am mostly interested in what this means for American culture, and how it views the military. In the past, defense spending was a sacred cow, and was almost never cut. Now, there are talks about trimming the defense budget, and indeed, it appears to be happening on its own. It seems as if Americans accept this far more than, say, a cut to Social Security or Medicare, which is not currently at risk of budget cuts.
Could this signal a new era in America's relationship with its military? Is the U.S. entering a stage of demilitarization? Do you think these spending draw downs mean a genuine decline of the U.S. military, or that it will simply become more efficient and adapt?
There have also been large cuts in state and local government spending during that same time which helps explain the shrinkage.
Yes I do think we can deal with international terrorists without sending an entire army to kill what is basically a foreign gang/cult.
That is a step in the right direction. Our armed forces are there to defend our borders against invading forces.
It also is a step to putting an end to the Forever War which the U.S. has been "fighting" since the Korean War. First it was the virtual or proxy war against the communists. Now it is war against the Jihadim. When will it stop? We can no longer afford it.
ruveyn
techstepgenr8tion
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Joined: 6 Feb 2005
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Posts: 24,182
Location: 28th Path of Tzaddi
We might have to just change how we use our military or how we think of them in terms of deployment.
My thought, in a world where warfare keeps getting less conventional every year, why not just invest more in special forces and intelligence? Have fewer but better trained troops with better tech?
I don't think insanely drastic cuts are wise but if we're going to be making cuts there might be nothing wrong at all with smarter strategy rather than blunt force and $$.
I notice your map shows that we don't have any bases in China.
Most of the bases are in countries that invited us in. That doesn't mean they're a good idea, but they aren't nearly as much of a political issue as, say, our constant drone strikes in supposedly neutral nations.
Yes I do think we can deal with international terrorists without sending an entire army to kill what is basically a foreign gang/cult.
That is a step in the right direction. Our armed forces are there to defend our borders against invading forces.
It also is a step to putting an end to the Forever War which the U.S. has been "fighting" since the Korean War. First it was the virtual or proxy war against the communists. Now it is war against the Jihadim. When will it stop? We can no longer afford it.
ruveyn
For once, ruveyn, I'm in complete agreement with you.
The good news is, I think public sentiment is finally swaying in that direction. Eight years of disastrous neo-conservative "shock and awe" foreign policy under Bush, capped off by Obama's campaign of not-so-secret drone strikes against Pakistan, have drastically undermined the agenda of the stalwart hawkish within the ranks of our policymakers. With bin Laden no longer among the living and an ongoing recession, we've got more pressing priorities than Afghanistan anyway. The bad news is, public sentiment and common sense only go so far in Washington. So long as lobbyist money speaks louder than the voice of the people, I'm not optimistic about the prospects of the US abandoning its "global policeman" attitude anytime soon. If we're ever going to change direction, we're going to have to get serious about systematic restructuring of how business is conducted at the level of our civilian leadership.
_________________
Mediocrity is a petty vice; aspiring to it is a grievous sin.
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