Welcome to UKIPland- a nightmare vision of future britain

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Danimal
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31 May 2014, 11:04 pm

Oh dear. I really wanted to visit the UK someday. If it's going to implode, maybe I should plan to visit Sweden.



thomas81
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31 May 2014, 11:24 pm

Tequila wrote:

As far as I'm aware, this is Paul's personal opinion. Not that of the party.


Pull the other one.
UKIP adheres to the same neoliberal orthodoxy as tweedle con, tweedle lab and tweedle lib. The only difference is they will want to up the ante to put clear purple water between them and the tories. All the warning signs are there. UKIP is a ultra reactionary Thatcherite party that subscribes to a mantra of free market = good public=bad. They oppose human rights legislation. they refuse to state any opposition to the TTIP trade deal which is indictive of a indifference towards public ownership of the NHS and nowhere on its manifesto does it specifically promise that the NHS wouldnt be privatised under a UKIP government.
Tequila wrote:

Nice to know you feel threatened by us, though. Thank you very much.



Whether or not I feel threatened on a personal or political level by Farage is another matter.

I feel threatened by the thought of having to fork out for my medication.

I feel threatened by the idea that i could be turfed out of a hospital for not having insurance.

I feel threatened by the idea that if the worst happens, myself and my loved ones won't get access to necessary medical care.


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thomas81
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31 May 2014, 11:30 pm

Danimal wrote:
Oh dear. I really wanted to visit the UK someday. If it's going to implode, maybe I should plan to visit Sweden.


If you want to play witness to a case study in how to run a country in a just and empathetic manner in treating your public with respect and dignity, the UK perhaps shouldn't be top of your itinerary right now. If UKIP gets in power you can put a line through it altogether.


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Danimal
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31 May 2014, 11:46 pm

In America the majority of us have health insurance provided by our employers. The elderly and disabled are covered by Medicare. The poorer among us may have access to Medicaid. Military members have access to military hospitals and veterans can receive medical care at VA hospitals. Now that we have the Affordable Care Act even more people have access to health insurance.
I have one question. Does the UK have a written Constitution that guarantees civil rights like the United States? Not only do we have a constitution but the individual states also have constitutions. Of course, the Constitution provides the framework of our government such as separation of powers, a bicameral legislature, and civil rights in the first 10 amendments.



Robdemanc
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01 Jun 2014, 3:26 am

No. The UK does not have a written constitution. We have no guaranteed rights whatsoever.



Danimal
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01 Jun 2014, 3:39 am

Do you think that such guarantees would be acceptable to the people of the UK? But, then federalism may not work for them.



Robdemanc
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01 Jun 2014, 7:50 am

Danimal wrote:
Do you think that such guarantees would be acceptable to the people of the UK? But, then federalism may not work for them.


I am not sure what most people think. But I would say in the UK we have a tendency to be open to change and we try not to set things in stone. So a constitution may not be palatable. We are also a monarchy, and the Queen is head of state, so ultimately she is in charge.



The_Walrus
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01 Jun 2014, 10:33 am

Robdemanc wrote:
No. The UK does not have a written constitution. We have no guaranteed rights whatsoever.

This isn't exactly true...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Rights_Act_1998 for starters



Robdemanc
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01 Jun 2014, 11:25 am

The_Walrus wrote:
Robdemanc wrote:
No. The UK does not have a written constitution. We have no guaranteed rights whatsoever.

This isn't exactly true...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Rights_Act_1998 for starters


Its not the same as a constitution.



The_Walrus
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01 Jun 2014, 12:34 pm

True. I was more contesting your assertion that we don't have guaranteed rights, although I may have misunderstood your use of "guaranteed".



Danimal
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01 Jun 2014, 7:12 pm

I see. Our laws are judged if they are constitutional. For example, our income taxes are an amendment to the Constitution. For a state to outlaw the federal income tax would be unconstitutional. Perhaps a country doesn't really need to have written guarantees of civil rights, but it works for us. Because we have no royalty, the President is the head of state. He can only serve two terms.



Robdemanc
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02 Jun 2014, 3:19 am

Danimal wrote:
I see. Our laws are judged if they are constitutional. For example, our income taxes are an amendment to the Constitution. For a state to outlaw the federal income tax would be unconstitutional. Perhaps a country doesn't really need to have written guarantees of civil rights, but it works for us. Because we have no royalty, the President is the head of state. He can only serve two terms.


That's another thing I like about the US. In the UK there is nothing but old age and senility to end our PM's reigns.



Danimal
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02 Jun 2014, 5:18 am

The two term limit for Presidents was another amendment added to the Constitution. President Roosevelt won 4 terms in office and the people didn't want that to happen again. It is not easy to pass an amendment. It must pass both houses of Congress by, I believe, a 75% vote in favor. It then must be ratified by 75% of the 50 states.
As a side note, members of the military take an oath "to defend the Constitution of the United States". We never take an oath to support a person.
The last amendment added was in the 1970s.



thomas81
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03 Jun 2014, 2:33 pm

Democracy in the UK will be nothing more than a facade as long as we have an unelected head of state, hereditary peers and unelected lords.

Then that would only be starting to address the problem.


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Arran
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03 Jun 2014, 5:02 pm

thomas81 wrote:
Democracy in the UK will be nothing more than a facade as long as we have an unelected head of state, hereditary peers and unelected lords.


The Labour Party has had more than enough decades to consign them to the scrapheap as well as kicking the Remembrancer of the City of London out of the House of Commons...

...but they haven't, so why should any intelligent person believe that they will offer anything but the status quo in the future?



Robdemanc
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04 Jun 2014, 4:50 am

I think it would be a good idea for everyone to vote for themselves at the next general election. Maybe I could start a web campaign for it.