Criminologist believs mass killing result of no belief in..

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khaoz
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21 Jul 2014, 7:19 pm

...afterlife.

How much more insane are people going to become?

9/11; mass killing. Supposed perpetrators believed reward of heavenly orgy as reward for their actions.
All other acts of war; Patriots involved in mass killings because of lack of belief in afterlife?

Does she provide any evidence that anyone responsible for a mass killing in America in the past 5 years does not believe in an afterlife? No, this is all her assumption based on the studies that others have done. Studies which say nothing about how people feel about the afterlife. Only their religious beliefs now, at the moment of the studies.

Consider the possibility that a lot of people who do not blieve in a God, heaven or hell, may have a completely different understanding or visualization of what they consider to be an interpretation of afterlife, even if their understanding of an afterlife, or not, is as completely preposterous to her as the concept of heaven, hell an d craetor Gods may be to more lucid and rational people.

http://freethinker.co.uk/2014/07/21/why ... ngs-occur/

zer0netgain
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22 Jul 2014, 8:12 am

Missed point.

Be it a distorted view of the afterlife (paradise for killing for God) or the belief that there is no afterlife, either will produce someone who thinks there is no consequence for their actions in life.

A belief that somehow in the afterlife/next life you will reap the consequences of choices made in this life makes a person think twice about what they are choosing to do.

TallyMan
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22 Jul 2014, 8:48 am

zer0netgain wrote:

Missed point.

Be it a distorted view of the afterlife (paradise for killing for God) or the belief that there is no afterlife, either will produce someone who thinks there is no consequence for their actions in life.

A belief that somehow in the afterlife/next life you will reap the consequences of choices made in this life makes a person think twice about what they are choosing to do.

Not true. I don't believe in an afterlife but I do believe in living my life compassionately and not hurting others. As far as other atheists are concerned I suspect there is no correlation between their lack of belief and how they behave towards others.

If someone doesn't behave badly now because they expect they'd be punished in an afterlife, that says more about that persons lack of empathy, lack of morality and lack of character in this life!

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zer0netgain
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23 Jul 2014, 6:17 am

TallyMan wrote:

As most people seem to lack empathy...or at least make choices based on how it will affect THEM...the idea of a punishment/reward for choices here and now is a check on their moral choices.

Some people make good choices because they want to make good choices. If they feel there are no consequences to fear (either by the law or a "god"), they will do what pleases them no matter who it hurts.

GGPViper
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23 Jul 2014, 7:37 am

Some food for thought (US data only):

Saslow, L. R., Willer, R., Feinberg, M., Piff, P. K., Clark, K., Keltner, D., & Saturn, S. R. (2013). My brother?s keeper? Compassion predicts generosity more among less religious individuals. Social Psychological and Personality Science, 4(1), 31-38.

http://www.rifters.com/real/articles/My ... iduals.pdf

From the abstract:

Saslow et al. wrote:

Past research argues that religious commitments shape individuals? prosocial sentiments, including their generosity and solidarity. But what drives the prosociality of less religious people? Three studies tested the hypothesis that, with fewer religious expectations of prosociality, less religious individuals? levels of compassion will play a larger role in their prosocial tendencies. In Study 1, religiosity moderated the relationship between trait compassion and prosocial behavior such that compassion was more critical to the generosity of less religious people. In Study 2, a compassion induction increased generosity among less religious individuals but not among more religious individuals. In Study 3, state feelings of compassion predicted increased generosity across a variety of economic tasks for less religious individuals but not among more religious individuals. These results suggest that the prosociality of less religious individuals is driven to a greater extent by levels of compassion than is the prosociality of the more religious.

(My emphasis added)

Here is a journalistic representation of the study:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... -believers

Furthermore: On the basis of the above study one might hypothesize that the widespread distrust of atheists in the US (see a recent Pew study here: http://www.pewforum.org/2014/07/16/how- ... us-groups/) could be a by-product of psychological projection among some religious individuals.

If religious individuals are (as the study shows) less likely to be motivated by compassion in pro-social acts - and more by the doctrines of their faith - some may then erroneously assume that atheists similarly lack an internal motivational basis for pro-social behaviour.

TallyMan
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23 Jul 2014, 7:58 am

zer0netgain wrote:

TallyMan wrote:

Sounds like you are describing psychopaths rather than people who simply don't believe in an afterlife. While most people put themselves and their own needs first, it by no means indicates they lack empathy. I'm sure the average person (if such a person exists) wouldn't kill someone just to take their wallet/money even if they knew they could get away with it without ever being caught and punished.

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Dillogic
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23 Jul 2014, 9:29 am

Kinda paints a bad picture for humanity if they need a gift or punishment to behave appropriately.

trollcatman
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23 Jul 2014, 11:23 am

zer0netgain wrote:

TallyMan wrote:

The problem with this is that the religions that have the reward/punishment, also tell you what is good and what is evil. The ISIS people who call themselves the Caliphate are even crucifying people because of their religion. They are killers sanctioned by their religion (at least their interpretation of it).

zer0netgain
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24 Jul 2014, 8:39 am

TallyMan wrote:

zer0netgain wrote:

TallyMan wrote:

Have you ever MET a human? :lol:

There's a joke that goes, "To lazy to work but too nervous to steal."

If you could murder a person and get away with it (both here and in the "hereafter") would you have the guts to actually do it?

Killing someone sounds easy. It's not unless you can press a button and make it happen. PTSD cases with people who are in close-combat differ from those who are snipers and those who do drone attacks. The remoteness from the target, the lack of exposure to the victim's suffering as they die, etc. impacts how much is needed before the person doing the deed feels an effect from their actions resulting in someone else's death.

TallyMan
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24 Jul 2014, 9:34 am

zer0netgain wrote:

Have you ever MET a human? :lol:

Of course! I'm sure I met one once; well I think it was a human, could have been a chimp, difficult to tell the difference to be honest; you apes all look alike to me.

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Jono
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26 Jul 2014, 7:46 am

From the same article:

Quote:

I see Glavin did not learn from her criminology degree that you can?t invent criminal profiles out of thin air, that statistically sound data are behind good profiling. And the statistics do not support any correlation between belief in the afterlife and crime. Statistics in fact show that non-theists are UNDER-represented in violent crime, and that the more non-theistic the country, the less violent it is.
Glavin?s whole premise is that ?ultimate accountability? is synonymous somehow with ?supernatural accountability after death?, when there?s no justification at all for that definition. Non-theistic humanists such as myself believe in an ?ultimate accountability? that is in our opinion more ?ultimate? than Glavin?s. Since we believe this world is our only world, and this life is our only life, we and no one else ? no angels or deities ? are responsible for humanity?s well-being. The responsibility is truly and ultimately ours alone.

This was a response from Bo Gardiner, her colleague who is also a criminologist. Professional criminologist or not, what she said was complete and utter crap.

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